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Old 10-18-2012, 07:57 AM   #3871
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Default Bladders

Hello.
I am new to the t3 (coming from a Photon) and if I have a complaint it's the shocks. I have been having a hard time getting them set with little rebound and no air.I am also struggling with getting the top tight enough where it won't leak and/or pushing in/cutting the bladders.
I have read through the various post and tried a few different methods to get the shocks right but I just don't have the knack with the xray stuff I guess..

That being said..
I messed up and ordered the "deep" x-ray bladders.
Rebuilt the shocks yesterday and with ease... I have what I would call
my ideal rebound for carpet (just a pinch over zero).

So my question is..
What will this effect as far as handling goes?
I noticed most people don't run this style of shock bladder anymore so there must be some sort of negative to using them over the shorti-soft ones.
Thanks for any input.
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Old 10-18-2012, 08:47 AM   #3872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j.d.roost View Post
Hello.
I am new to the t3 (coming from a Photon) and if I have a complaint it's the shocks. I have been having a hard time getting them set with little rebound and no air.I am also struggling with getting the top tight enough where it won't leak and/or pushing in/cutting the bladders.
I have read through the various post and tried a few different methods to get the shocks right but I just don't have the knack with the xray stuff I guess..

That being said..
I messed up and ordered the "deep" x-ray bladders.
Rebuilt the shocks yesterday and with ease... I have what I would call
my ideal rebound for carpet (just a pinch over zero).

So my question is..
What will this effect as far as handling goes?
I noticed most people don't run this style of shock bladder anymore so there must be some sort of negative to using them over the shorti-soft ones.
Thanks for any input.
Never really had an issue with my shocks, but the deep bladders are for the nitro touring shocks. Don't know offhand what the effects would be.
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Old 10-18-2012, 08:58 AM   #3873
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Its hard to beat the top shocks in my opinion . I have yet to rebuild my X-ray shocks but I dread it . So used to building my photon shocks for 3yrs...
I always built my photon shocks (hole drilled in cap) set to 7mm (this kept diapram relaxed at proper ride height) doin this would keep air from ever entering shock or oil coming out ...
Would their be a issue with drilling the X-ray cap and building them to have a relaxed [email protected] height??
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Old 10-18-2012, 09:11 AM   #3874
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlfx car audio View Post
Its hard to beat the top shocks in my opinion . I have yet to rebuild my X-ray shocks but I dread it . So used to building my photon shocks for 3yrs...
I always built my photon shocks (hole drilled in cap) set to 7mm (this kept diapram relaxed at proper ride height) doin this would keep air from ever entering shock or oil coming out ...
Would their be a issue with drilling the X-ray cap and building them to have a relaxed [email protected] height??
This is the way most people use the Xray shocks. Drill a hole in the cap and leave the foam out. Using the low profile bladders. Then build them from the top like a Tamiya/HB/TOP type of shock. You should have no problem getting your desired rebound.
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Old 10-18-2012, 09:21 AM   #3875
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j.d.roost View Post
Hello.
I am new to the t3 (coming from a Photon) and if I have a complaint it's the shocks. I have been having a hard time getting them set with little rebound and no air.I am also struggling with getting the top tight enough where it won't leak and/or pushing in/cutting the bladders.
I have read through the various post and tried a few different methods to get the shocks right but I just don't have the knack with the xray stuff I guess..

That being said..
I messed up and ordered the "deep" x-ray bladders.
Rebuilt the shocks yesterday and with ease... I have what I would call
my ideal rebound for carpet (just a pinch over zero).

So my question is..
What will this effect as far as handling goes?
I noticed most people don't run this style of shock bladder anymore so there must be some sort of negative to using them over the shorti-soft ones.
Thanks for any input.
The plastic shocks are not great...You will get the normal fan boys on this thread that rave about how good they are, but reality is they are sub-par compared to most other shocks in the Industry.

I would recommend the RSD 10mm bladders. They work very will in the Xray shocks and are tons more reliable then then Xray Bladders. The issue with the Xray bladders is that they are simply too soft.

The Key with the the reflex bladders is that they are slightly larger in diameter then the xray bladders. So you have to build them in a very specific way.

Here is what I do...

1)Fill shocks with oil and pump out all of the air... Typical stuff!
2)Insert the RSD bladder into the top cap (the correct direction of course) and make sure the bladder is flush with the plastic top shock mount that is in the top cap. In this Step it is normal to get the bladder stuck in the threads and not flush with the plastic cap. It is important to make sure the bladder is past the threads. Use a blunt tool to help ensure the bladder is properly seated on the outside lip. Anything sharp might damage the bladder.
3) with the piston pulled all of the way down; screw the top cap on slightly (maybe one or two revolutions at most). Push the piston up slowly to the top and watch the oil comes out the bleed hole (if the oil does not come out then the cap is on too far or the bleed hole is blocked). At this point with the piston all the way up continue to screw the top cap in until it stops. You should see a fair amount of oil come out of the bleed hole during this process.
4) check to ensure there is not air in the shock and check the rebound is where you want it. I normally run 0-10% rebound with a drilled top cap and no foam insert. The action should be smooth as butter and the shock should not make any noises while moving the piston up and down.
5)put on spring and retainer...install on car!

All of this assumes that all of the plastic parts have been trimmed and sanded properly.

If you guys really want I can put together a short video...but with Xray moving to new shocks on the T4 it is probably all irrelevant moving forward.
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Old 10-18-2012, 09:27 AM   #3876
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlfx car audio View Post
Its hard to beat the top shocks in my opinion . I have yet to rebuild my X-ray shocks but I dread it . So used to building my photon shocks for 3yrs...
I always built my photon shocks (hole drilled in cap) set to 7mm (this kept diapram relaxed at proper ride height) doin this would keep air from ever entering shock or oil coming out ...
Would their be a issue with drilling the X-ray cap and building them to have a relaxed [email protected] height??
I think this is where I have the problem...The Top shocks build so darn easy.
My x-ray soft bladders seem too soft...I just can't tell when the top is seated properly.These deep bladders are also thicker allowing me to crank down the cap pretty good. When doing the bottom cap rebound thing...the oring sneaks out and air gets in there every time.
Guess I will try out another set of soft bladders and drill a hole.
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Old 10-18-2012, 09:41 AM   #3877
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j.d.roost View Post
I think this is where I have the problem...The Top shocks build so darn easy.
My x-ray soft bladders seem too soft...I just can't tell when the top is seated properly.These deep bladders are also thicker allowing me to crank down the cap pretty good. When doing the bottom cap rebound thing...the oring sneaks out and air gets in there every time.
Guess I will try out another set of soft bladders and drill a hole.
Just mount up a set of tamiya shocks
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Old 10-18-2012, 10:38 AM   #3878
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Quote:
Originally Posted by artwork View Post
The plastic shocks are not great...You will get the normal fan boys on this thread that rave about how good they are, but reality is they are sub-par compared to most other shocks in the Industry.

I would recommend the RSD 10mm bladders. They work very will in the Xray shocks and are tons more reliable then then Xray Bladders. The issue with the Xray bladders is that they are simply too soft.

The Key with the the reflex bladders is that they are slightly larger in diameter then the xray bladders. So you have to build them in a very specific way.

Here is what I do...

1)Fill shocks with oil and pump out all of the air... Typical stuff!
2)Insert the RSD bladder into the top cap (the correct direction of course) and make sure the bladder is flush with the plastic top shock mount that is in the top cap. In this Step it is normal to get the bladder stuck in the threads and not flush with the plastic cap. It is important to make sure the bladder is past the threads. Use a blunt tool to help ensure the bladder is properly seated on the outside lip. Anything sharp might damage the bladder.
3) with the piston pulled all of the way down; screw the top cap on slightly (maybe one or two revolutions at most). Push the piston up slowly to the top and watch the oil comes out the bleed hole (if the oil does not come out then the cap is on too far or the bleed hole is blocked). At this point with the piston all the way up continue to screw the top cap in until it stops. You should see a fair amount of oil come out of the bleed hole during this process.
4) check to ensure there is not air in the shock and check the rebound is where you want it. I normally run 0-10% rebound with a drilled top cap and no foam insert. The action should be smooth as butter and the shock should not make any noises while moving the piston up and down.
5)put on spring and retainer...install on car!

All of this assumes that all of the plastic parts have been trimmed and sanded properly.

If you guys really want I can put together a short video...but with Xray moving to new shocks on the T4 it is probably all irrelevant moving forward.
Have a set of those bladders on order already (I had read a few were using them).
Hoping they come in before the weekend..otherwise I will be testing out the deep x-ray ones.
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Old 10-18-2012, 10:44 AM   #3879
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeXray View Post
Just mount up a set of tamiya shocks
I need the exotek caps to do this right?
A bit too pricy for me by the time I order the shocks and caps.
Will try out the rsd bladders 1st and go from there.
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Old 10-18-2012, 11:32 AM   #3880
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j.d.roost View Post
I need the exotek caps to do this right?
A bit too pricy for me by the time I order the shocks and caps.
Will try out the rsd bladders 1st and go from there.
No, I used tamiya female ball studs for the top and used the xray mounts on the bottom. I put an oring on the shaft because the threads are longer on the tamiya shocks, this was kinda a bumpstop to prevent them from tearing the orings.
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Old 10-18-2012, 07:45 PM   #3881
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Originally Posted by kuruption View Post
Never really had an issue with my shocks, but the deep bladders are for the nitro touring shocks. Don't know offhand what the effects would be.
I just built a set of alu shocks with the long bladders for my mod car. Drilled the caps and tossed the foams in the trash. I feel NO difference between the long and short bladders on the bench or the track. Easily got the rebound I wanted.
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Old 10-18-2012, 09:49 PM   #3882
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Originally Posted by MikeXray View Post
Just mount up a set of tamiya shocks
+1!

by the way, has anyone tried the new Alu T4 shocks on their 12? I would presume it would fit as it is just shorter, am i correct on this? I'm thinking of getting these new shocks as my budget hinders me from purchasing the T4.
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Old 10-19-2012, 01:36 AM   #3883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcar951 View Post
I just built a set of alu shocks with the long bladders for my mod car. Drilled the caps and tossed the foams in the trash. I feel NO difference between the long and short bladders on the bench or the track. Easily got the rebound I wanted.
The long bladders are more susceptible to tearing as when the piston moves fully upward it actually makes contact with the bladder.

It's not a performance thing, it's a reliability thing

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Old 10-19-2012, 01:37 AM   #3884
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Originally Posted by alecladanga View Post
+1!

by the way, has anyone tried the new Alu T4 shocks on their 12? I would presume it would fit as it is just shorter, am i correct on this? I'm thinking of getting these new shocks as my budget hinders me from purchasing the T4.
As the new shocks are 8mm shorter (and the new towers are 15mm shorter) you'll never get the ride height.
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Old 10-19-2012, 02:17 AM   #3885
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As the new shocks are 8mm shorter (and the new towers are 15mm shorter) you'll never get the ride height.
thanks Skiddins!
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