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Old 11-12-2011, 09:23 PM   #691
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Originally Posted by AI View Post
I use UFO21.5T gearing is 2.789(spur35/pinion34) or 2.777(spur41/pinion40)
3.5mm downstop
rear roll bar
MUGEN #30000 in diff
MUCHMORE 450 in shock
1 degree rear camber
3 degree rear toein
TAMIYA F103 front suspension
3 racing gold front spring
TAMIYA F104 body and front/rear wing
CYCLONE 12 rear shock and black shock spring, 2 hole piston, I think spring is soft than FGX stand spring
HOTBODIES servo saver

In Shanghai SGP1 F1 rc-racing, we always use pradise rubber tire, it's control tire. Race is a 30min qualify round each group, re-sort to final by your best lap time, Final A is 30min race.

Today's setting is a little understeering, but I think in a long race, tire grip will down, stable car is good for me.

In corner car is very smooth. Out of corner I can push more throttle, car will not slip.

a few days ago, I try same setting but only diff oil different or same setting with F103GT front suspension. Light diff oil, car will more steering, if track grip is lower , I hold throttle in s corner, car maybe will slip. F103GT suspension will give car more steering, but I don't like F103GT front suspension, front tire have bigger shake than F103
Thank you for some solid testing results. 30 minute races, wow! Do you run pit stops also?
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Old 11-13-2011, 06:18 AM   #692
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my rabbit car
Im assuming you still use the independent rear suspensions with this? Also would i need the full front end including servo mounts etc from the F104 for this?

Sorry for the questions, just would like to see a complete car with this conversion
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Old 11-13-2011, 09:26 AM   #693
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Originally Posted by liljohn1064 View Post
Thank you for some solid testing results. 30 minute races, wow! Do you run pit stops also?
No pit stop, I use Tianhao 6200mah65c battery, 30 min race use 70% battery capacity. Car with body is 1170g, a little heavy but it's ok, because everybody use big battery, same battery in my F104 is 1140g, I can accept a little heavy
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Old 11-13-2011, 09:57 AM   #694
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Originally Posted by kid TT-01 View Post
Im assuming you still use the independent rear suspensions with this? Also would i need the full front end including servo mounts etc from the F104 for this?

Sorry for the questions, just would like to see a complete car with this conversion
Yes, I use all FGX rear bulkhead and suspensions parts. Rabbit conversion give car lightweight chassis and upper, hard and more hole rear camber mount, more gearing space motor mount, and give car a chance to use F103/F104 front suspension, front wing and sevro mount, all front hole in chassis is fit TAMIYA F103/F104 design. You need full TAMIYA F103/F104 front parts to build Rabbit car.
Kit is not change FGX rear design.

I will post my complete car photo later
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Old 11-13-2011, 07:11 PM   #695
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I received a email regarding the Rabbit Conversion from the compant that makes them:

"Formula Rabbit is a conversion kit for FGX. Kit only include chassis, upper deck, motor mount, rear camber link mount*2.
Motor mount in kit is Installation of 45 degrees design for UFO 540 sensed brushless motor, you can use this mout on some normal motor, and you can use option 60 degrees design motor mount to fit more brand's motor .
Kit cost is 64usd no include shipping, option motor mount is 9usd."

How ever they charge a stupid amount for postage, from China - Australia they wanted to charge $56us!!! . Seems far to excessive
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Old 11-13-2011, 07:39 PM   #696
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Originally Posted by kid TT-01 View Post
I received a email regarding the Rabbit Conversion from the compant that makes them:

"Formula Rabbit is a conversion kit for FGX. Kit only include chassis, upper deck, motor mount, rear camber link mount*2.
Motor mount in kit is Installation of 45 degrees design for UFO 540 sensed brushless motor, you can use this mout on some normal motor, and you can use option 60 degrees design motor mount to fit more brand's motor .
Kit cost is 64usd no include shipping, option motor mount is 9usd."

How ever they charge a stupid amount for postage, from China - Australia they wanted to charge $56us!!! . Seems far to excessive
Yep way to much you could get a whole kit sent for less. They might want to rethink the shipping provider to sell more ?
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Old 11-13-2011, 07:41 PM   #697
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Originally Posted by kid TT-01 View Post
I received a email regarding the Rabbit Conversion from the compant that makes them:

"Formula Rabbit is a conversion kit for FGX. Kit only include chassis, upper deck, motor mount, rear camber link mount*2.
Motor mount in kit is Installation of 45 degrees design for UFO 540 sensed brushless motor, you can use this mout on some normal motor, and you can use option 60 degrees design motor mount to fit more brand's motor .
Kit cost is 64usd no include shipping, option motor mount is 9usd."

How ever they charge a stupid amount for postage, from China - Australia they wanted to charge $56us!!! . Seems far to excessive
Yes i got the same email and queried the postage as it's ridiculous. The reply mentioned it was a 1KG bag and the kit weighed 110g, so basically you can ship 9 for the same price. I can hear a group buy coming on ! .. even so its more than half the kit price, so a little exy !
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Old 11-13-2011, 07:57 PM   #698
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So, as promised, some pics of my Rabbit FGX/104 conversion...

First pic up, the bits that come in the kit...
Carbon lower deck
Upper deck
Camber mounts
Optional motor bulkhead

Now, I've got to be honest here, there carbon cutting quality is not exactly stellar. I had to spend a bit of time removing material to smooth off cut edges, and some of the screw holes are not quite where they should be. On the very front, I had to sand the lip down a fair bit to fit the wing in place.
Having said all that, 10mins with a bit of sand paper and a counter-sunk bit and it's sorted.
second step, is basically removing from the FGX the parts that are needed, in effect, thats the whole rear end, although also including the ball joints for the shocks and tie-rod brace.

Second picture is the assembled rear mounted to the carbon bits. I did a dry fit whilst I waited for my parts to arrive. On the camber plates, you need to use some shims to get into the correct position. I find 9mm under the front screw, with 1.5mm under the rear is about right, and gets the ball joint in the right place as the FGX kit camber mounts.
You might notice I stuck with the alloy motor mount. I tried both, and tbh, the alloy one fits better, and still gives the gearing options I need. I'm running a 34t pinion, and reckon I could get a 36 or 37t in there fine (albeit with a 35t spur set on the car), which is more than enough gear for a 21.5 at the track I race on.

Third pic is the shock ball studs, showing how I mounted them up. As the FGX shock stud is small (4mm I think), I used the tamiya 5mm ball nut to give the 3Racing one something to screw into, and used a 6mm M3 countersunk to secure to the top plate. 4mm of shims raises the shock into the same position as the standard FGX. Doesn't look so neat there... but I have changed it out as you'll see in the next post!

Fourth picture is the centre brace, same thing as the shock, needs spacing up. The picture here was actually a best guess at the time, turns out the amount of spacers was spot on, as needed the height to clear the roll bar. 8mm on the front, with 1.5mm on the bulkhead.

Fifth (and last picture for this post) is the dry fitted car and all the parts needed to fit the front end. Obviously, if you have a spare 104, it'll be a sinch, but I didn't so, brought a load of parts seperately. I also made sure to upgrade the front end to the coated piviot balls and kingpins, and the alloy camber plate.

Given some of the other options, I also picked up the following bits;
Sakura tuned gear set (for 35T spur)
Sakura Zero rear roll bar set
Sakura Zero roll bar mounting set
Ti turnbuckles for the steering and rear camber plate.
New mounting hardware (including lots of pink shims! I'm a stickler for matching colours!)
Attached Thumbnails
3 racing new F1-img_1505.jpg   3 racing new F1-img_1511.jpg   3 racing new F1-img_1517.jpg   3 racing new F1-img_1518.jpg   3 racing new F1-img_1520.jpg  

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Old 11-13-2011, 08:17 PM   #699
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So more pics once I'd mounted everything up...

First pic shows the motor mount side. Again, can see still plenty of room for gearing, although I think thats only a 31t pinion in that picture.. Can again see the number of shims in place under the camber mount, and I've also switched to a captive camber link ball stud (I'm wary of screwing only into carbon). Roll bar is also mounted, although the bottom of the bar mounts needed a little material removing to fit flat onto the camber plate, but nothing a few seconds with a knife couldn't sort.

Next up is the 104 front end, pretty standard fare in that shot, although by the end of yesterday I had converted it into a lowered camber plate version to help tame the front down.

Third is another more general rear end shot, can see the roll bar more clearly here. I had to use a long button headed screw, although would have preferred some long countersunk ones instead. Roll bar links I mounted to the rear hole on the wishbone.

Fourth shot shows the general electrics layout. I've mounted the ESC on the right, reciever on the left, mainly to route the motor wires so they avoid the shocks. I've used 16AWG wire all through the car (makes it nice and simple), and with the battery I'm using even the balance hole is exposed, so don't need to removed the cells (which are taped in place).

Fifth shot is the bodyshell (along with my X1). The FGX body fits fine (given the rear body mounts are in the right place anyway!), just need to drill a new hole in the front for the 104 wing (which is missing in that picture).
Attached Thumbnails
3 racing new F1-img_1528.jpg   3 racing new F1-img_1523.jpg   3 racing new F1-img_1532.jpg   3 racing new F1-img_1533.jpg   3 racing new F1-img_1460.jpg  

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Old 11-13-2011, 08:25 PM   #700
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So after the first day at the track with it, what are my thoughts...

Well, 1, it has a lot, A LOT, of steering. Too much in fact. Whilst it's possible to hang on for a few laps with very fast times, it's tricky to push.

I tried a number of things to calm the car down, but whilst some worked, I also think I made it worse in others... and simply ran out of time to try anything else.

Next on my list to try is lighter diff oil, as I thought I had a problem with the gear diff, and 500K is all I had in my pit box (it's way too thick, 100K or lower will be better).
Then also sorting out the camber, as I personally think there is way too much rear camber gain/too much camber full stop! Less camber, and less camber gain are on the list.
Also need to play more with springs and roll bars, as it does feel like the rear rolls too much, then looses all grip and "patters" across the track surface. So some strange effects going on that hopefully more track time can resolve.

It has potential for sure, but the next few outings will be telling if it can be released.

(oh, and I flat out refuse to use a 103 front end... out of principle of scale!)
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Old 11-13-2011, 08:39 PM   #701
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Originally Posted by RedBullRacing View Post
FGX ordered !!

Has anyone tried the Shimizu grooved "soft" compound all-round yet ?? (this is what I have ordered)
Just finished racing my FGX with grooved soft Shimizu tires all around this weekend. These where mounted on Ride F10 wheels. The car was really planted and had tons of steering. This is on medium to high traction carpet.

Bad part was the front would hop and wiggle like crazy when being pushed hard in the corners. I had to keep changing the set up to get rid of the front end chatter.

The set up that worked best was:
Front
Shimizu grooved soft
3* caster/2* camber/zero toe
.018" springs
ride height 5mm
7mm wheel hexes for more track width

Rear
Shimizu grooved soft
2* camber/1* toe
stock FGX springs/oil with 3 o-rings used as a bump stop to keep the chassis from bottoming in the corners (really want to just get stiffer springs whenever they are available)
Added 1mm shim to the ball end that the shock connects to for more leverage over the suspension (also to make the spring seem stiffer)
6mm ride height.

Car was very fast with this set up. Got second to a F104W. Reeling him the last minute of the race, only 0.2 second behind at the buzzer. I could have won if I had one more lap!

Last edited by racer robert; 11-13-2011 at 08:41 PM. Reason: re wording
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Old 11-13-2011, 10:18 PM   #702
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Originally Posted by racer robert View Post
Just finished racing my FGX with grooved soft Shimizu tires all around this weekend. These where mounted on Ride F10 wheels. The car was really planted and had tons of steering. This is on medium to high traction carpet.

Bad part was the front would hop and wiggle like crazy when being pushed hard in the corners. I had to keep changing the set up to get rid of the front end chatter.

The set up that worked best was:
Front
Shimizu grooved soft
3* caster/2* camber/zero toe
.018" springs
ride height 5mm
7mm wheel hexes for more track width

Rear
Shimizu grooved soft
2* camber/1* toe
stock FGX springs/oil with 3 o-rings used as a bump stop to keep the chassis from bottoming in the corners (really want to just get stiffer springs whenever they are available)
Added 1mm shim to the ball end that the shock connects to for more leverage over the suspension (also to make the spring seem stiffer)
6mm ride height.

Car was very fast with this set up. Got second to a F104W. Reeling him the last minute of the race, only 0.2 second behind at the buzzer. I could have won if I had one more lap!
Reading this was exactly the same experience I had today ... car is great on these tires... better then with the Ride super softs all around... but full throttle on a high speed bumpy bit of the track was kinda scary... front end was bouncing all around and would easily grab and over steer...

Does need stiffer rear springs...
This car definitely can take the fight to the 104...
Did end up breaking an upper front arm I fortunately had 4 spares in reserve after reading this forum ...

35 spur gear with a 36 pinion on a 21.5 novak motor on blinky mode... motor temps were around 130...

There was 3 of us on the track today... loved the noise these things make...
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Old 11-13-2011, 11:05 PM   #703
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Then also sorting out the camber, as I personally think there is way too much rear camber gain/too much camber full stop! Less camber, and less camber gain are on the list.
Also need to play more with springs and roll bars, as it does feel like the rear rolls too much, then looses all grip and "patters" across the track surface. So some strange effects going on that hopefully more track time can resolve.
That was one of the first thing I thought when I saw the car- rear camber link is way short. Can you get it on the gearbox and eliminate the stock mount? I think your loss of grip in the rear is due to the funky camber link..
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Old 11-13-2011, 11:23 PM   #704
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That was one of the first thing I thought when I saw the car- rear camber link is way short. Can you get it on the gearbox and eliminate the stock mount? I think your loss of grip in the rear is due to the funky camber link..
Yeah, should be able to mod it too suit... the gearbox top is held in by six screws in effect, so the rear plate screw could be made into a ball joint... [plan forming]
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Old 11-13-2011, 11:34 PM   #705
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Last edited by Sydewynder; 11-30-2011 at 04:28 AM.
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