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Old 10-04-2012, 11:37 PM   #1546
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Originally Posted by CristianTabush View Post
Ok. Will do.

I don't do anything special though. Check your shock caps to make sure they are to spec. I have seen tons of faulty ones.
What should we be looking for? (maybe something else for the TC Tech article )

Cheers,
Gary
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:41 PM   #1547
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Have you drilled your shock caps?

When you put the cap on, do you put the plastic part on first, and then apply downward pressure on it while you twist the metal part on?

-Mike
Thanks Mike

No I have not drilled the caps I've never heard of this (I must admit I have not been racing very long though).

I think I've tried just about everything to get the shocks not to leak but I'll give it another shot with your tip.

Cheers,
Gary
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Old 10-05-2012, 08:40 AM   #1548
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Hi Christian,

Got my order today. Thanks again for the fast shipping!

Now I am sitting and rebuilding my shocks, giving them the new pistons, when I had to think about the way I store my springs. They are all in plastic bags and I really don't like it that way. Do you know a better way or can you recommend a product for that problem?
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Old 10-05-2012, 09:58 AM   #1549
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I use a box with exactly enough space for 10 sets of 2 springs. This way they dont compress while transporting and I put values on the box to see what springs are in which compartement. You can get those boxes at loads of stores here in the Netherlands so probably in Germany too ;-).

Plus, you can get them from Ebay, for I guess a really low price.
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Old 10-06-2012, 01:23 PM   #1550
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I would like to see a TC Tech article on how to rebuild your shocks correctly with the RSD parts (especially the bladders).

I have the pistons, bladders and springs but every time I use the bladders I end up with leaky shocks and have had to go back to the stock ones.

I have also tried a second set of bladders just to be sure but they still leak - I must be doing something wrong (I am trying to get zero rebound).

I think what is happening is that every time I tighten down the cap down the bladder becomes twisted (sometimes I can actually feel it happen) and then air gets in and it leaks.

Cheers,
Gary
+1. Also seeing the same issue with the bladders twisting. Tips would be appreciated!


On a separate note, does anyone have an alternate suggestion for a hex hub adapter for the RSD DCJs? I have the official ones sold in the store, but managed to break the thin set screw. I'd like to see if there are any other options at least using beefier hardware.
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Old 10-06-2012, 01:31 PM   #1551
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I am not sure how you can tell a bladder is twisting? It should feel like the bladder gets "squished" but this is normal. It's a shock seal so as you tighten it it should squish the edges to seal the shock. You must tighten the shock cap all the way until it bottoms out and it can't be tightened anymore. This twisting feeling you are feeling is probably juat the bladders getting squished. This needs to happen to seal properly.
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Old 10-06-2012, 01:55 PM   #1552
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Originally Posted by CristianTabush View Post
I am not sure how you can tell a bladder is twisting? It should feel like the bladder gets "squished" but this is normal. It's a shock seal so as you tighten it it should squish the edges to seal the shock. You must tighten the shock cap all the way until it bottoms out and it can't be tightened anymore. This twisting feeling you are feeling is probably juat the bladders getting squished. This needs to happen to seal properly.
Christian,

Appreciate the support and fast response.

I mention twisting since that's how they appear when I take down the shocks for weight changes or cleaning. The bladder warping or twisting could certainly be from disassembly, but I try to unscrew the caps as slowly as possible to avoid that. EDIT: By the way, I should mention it only happens about 1/3 of the time; not always.

The shock caps are always screwed down as tightly as possible to ensure the bladders do get "squished" as you've suggested before. Perhaps I just need to apply more pressure to the black caps while screwing the caps back on.

Any tips on hex hub alternatives for your DJCs? I don't blame the product since I broke the screw off myself from over-tightening. I'm just hoping someone has a suggestion for a hex hub with a beefier screw so I can avoid this in the future.

Thanks again!

Last edited by silencery; 10-06-2012 at 02:01 PM. Reason: Edited for clarificatoin
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Old 10-06-2012, 06:39 PM   #1553
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I still don't understand how the twisting occurs. The bladder should not be affected by the threading or un-threading of the shock caps. Perhaps the shocks are being overfilled? The bladders are smaller than the shock OD, so they should never interfere with the threads at all, much less make them twist.

The way I do it is I make sure I fill the shock body with oil nearly to the top. I then work the shaft up and down 2-3 times to force the air bubbles to the top. If you have a shock pump, you can vacuum all the air out, otherwise, let them sit for 5-10 minutes to make sure all the bubbles are out.

Once this is accomplished, with the shock shaft fully extended I press the bladder in, making sure that all the air underneath escapes. Since they are clear, this is easy to do. Once this happens, I place the plastic piece of the shock cap on top of the bladder and I take the aluminum cap and thread it all the way down.

Due to the soft nature of the bladders, this should yield zero rebound.
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Old 10-07-2012, 05:05 AM   #1554
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Thanks for that explanation Cristian.

I think the "feeling" of twisting is when I tighten the cap and can feel the "squish" but as I tighten the cap all the way down it grabs and the cap is all of a sudden loose again. When I then take the cap off the bladder is half inside the shock body.

I think I have been overfilling them and I was not pulling the shaft all the way down.

I'll have another go again soon and report back .

Cheers again,
Gary
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Old 10-07-2012, 05:14 AM   #1555
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Has anybody noticed a significant difference between using the stock shock o-rings versus the RSD o-rings?
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Old 10-07-2012, 08:20 AM   #1556
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Originally Posted by tr1kstanc3 View Post
Has anybody noticed a significant difference between using the stock shock o-rings versus the RSD o-rings?
Theres no real performance difference when both o rings are new, but the RSD ones dont swell up after 2 days
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Old 10-07-2012, 11:59 AM   #1557
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I had a great race day today, beeing TQ and got overall second after winning the first A-final, becoming second in the second and messing up the third one... Still the best result ever for me in this series!

Had again the chance to fight against some very good drivers (one became third in the german championship in the 17.5t class we drove today). I was able hold him behind me without problem. Just the overall winner was getting better every final while I couldn't improve my car. I worked between the races (controlling the cars if they were legal, use the right tires and so on...) and had no time doing some fine tuning.

My TC6.1 was awesome! It turned on the spot without losing the rear and had a lot of grip. It is upgraded with ReflexRacing stuff. Especially the shocks are fully tuned with pistons, black springs, o-rings and, of course, the bladders! Furthermore I used the dual cardan joints in front with the 4mm clamping hex hub adapters, the battery hold down system and the shock spacer washers.


Here some pictures:

My car in its black DTM-BMW colours.




And me in the middle. Looks as if I won, but the winner is on the left




The track (after the race with some guy chilling).

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Old 10-08-2012, 09:16 AM   #1558
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Awesome job Kevin! Way to go.
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Old 10-08-2012, 09:42 AM   #1559
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Default RSD6.7???

So I got a wild hair about a month back and I got a 417. I wanted to know what this magic synergy of development felt like and compare it to the RSD6.

What can I say, the 417 is awesome. But so is the RSD6. Every time I go to the track I find myself going marginally faster with one car or the other.

The RSD6 is more locked into the track, it makes better traction. The 417 feels more graceful, like it makes more corner speed, but with plenty of traction still. Lap times always end up being within 100ths of a second.

So with that, I wanted to see what would happen if I would replicate the geometry as close as I could with the RSD6 to that of the 417.

Nearly everything can be duplicated, this means, camber link angles and ball stud heights, wheelbase, shock angles, arm lengths, shock positions on A-Arm, Diff heights, camber, roll centers. So I set out to do it.

When I was doing it, I noticed there was a couple of things I could not mirror, Rear A-Arm Length and Rear Sway Bar position. So what I did was I installed 417 Rear arms and hubs. I also got some longer wire and made some longer swaybars for my TC6.1 swaybar mount.

The rear arms of the 417 are 1mm shorter than the 6.1, but 1mm longer than the 6's. They can easily be mounted by just using more shims on the hinge pins on the inside.

The rest, was mainly a big lowering of camber links, especially in the rear. In the rear, my camber links are essentially 2mm-2.5mm lower inside and outside and in the front, they are 2mm-2.5mm lower on the inside.

The results? Not done yet, but so far, not much. The rear end feels a lot more planted in the middle and exit of the corner on our high grip local track, but to a point where it is too much I think. One thing is certain is that the set-up can't be identical because it just not very cohesive. The car lacks balance.

On our big, medium grip local track, the set-up did far better, I still wish the car had a little more entry steering, but it always was like this, even before the 417 rear arms and copied geometry.

The one thing I do like is the longer rear swaybar. I have always felt that this set-up is more effective in keeping more consistent traction. I have a feeling this is what is making the car more locked in at the middle and exit of the corner. The rest of the changes are really far too small to make a huge difference. When the 6 went to the 6.1, they lengthened the arms by 2mm, the same set-ups worked fairly well.

My favorite set-up at our small track is still the latest one on our website asphalt. This one has a lot of potential though.
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Old 10-08-2012, 10:01 AM   #1560
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Well done WTCC. Is that your home track? Where is it located? We lack indoor tracks in the Netherlands, that's why i'm asking

@CT great that you are also looking into other cars. I like the RSD6, need to build up a little bit more cornering speed, which I lack a little compared to some local guys.
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