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Old 01-03-2005, 10:17 AM   #2356
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YOu know whats odd-is I was making roll center changes on the front and rear of the TC4 sunday-while my buddy was making or Had made the same changes on his TC3. I trust what he feels on the track and i think I have a decent feel for set-up chnages too.

Well-we feel we accomplished opposite things at times-making the same changes on the car. I have seen this same thing going from the TC3 to the Xray as well. It makes it tough to think through chnages when youve got to remember which chnages have what affect on what brand car I am driving at the time

All I have found so far is raising the front roll center has smoothed out steering so that car does not continue to steer more and more through the corner. I have also found that by raising the rear a tad too-it has freed up the the car as well.
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Old 01-03-2005, 10:41 AM   #2357
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one thing i noticed when running the tc4 yesterday is that it was really stable at low speed but as soon as i got it upto speed it was really unstable and veered off to one side.

is this just something that happens with shaft drive cars? (i know they usually get torque steer) but "rpm steer"???
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Old 01-03-2005, 10:49 AM   #2358
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Quote:
Originally posted by stulec52
Here is a copy of the E-Mail I HAD to send to my sponsor...
Keep in mind I had made a big deal about wanting to run a TC4 this indoor season.. oh jeez...

"Sir,

2 more X Rays have shown up at our club since Christmas.

Middle of the pack kind of guys, top of the B's, maybe bottom of the A's, you know the type...
INSTANTLY quicker !!
I mean, like timed to be between .2 and .5 a second a lap quicker !
SO, I thought maybe it's the track, went out and ran with both guys, and 1 of them I just couldn't run with anymore. This will not do.
So, should I jump on the X Ray band wagon?? Are you laughing your ass off right about now??
Let me know what you think
Talk to you soon

Stu "
At our track the fastest car was an Xray T1FX BMI car. Know there is a TC4 which has taken over that spot. The car is easy to drive does not want to get out of shape at all and is just flat out ballistic. For once the Xray guys are playing catch up, at least here at our track.

Later,
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Old 01-03-2005, 10:59 AM   #2359
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it's just what works for the individual I guess.

I have converted my old TC3 to the 4 parts where I could, so I 'll keep that car around for a while yet.

My TC4 is for sale though if anyone is interested.
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Old 01-03-2005, 11:08 AM   #2360
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Quote:
Originally posted by Boomer
Great answer Bob. I think it's the vocal minority who are dissatisfied.

I love the car and will begin running it more and more.
Well, I been staring at this forum for quite awhile... finally got my TC4.. and being a long time owner of the TC3, I must say this car works well (the TC4 that is..).

I don't see any of the slop and or diff problems that I read about, nor do I see any big time steering problems.

I have YET to take in for a real drive during qualifying/heats , only ran the track during off days *quiet time* to see.. and neutral outta the box it drove quite well. Put 3 batt packs through it...

Just gonna change springs out, adjust the droop, and put some diff shock oil weight in.. and I think I might be set.. maybe a bit tighter on the diffs. Will try the one way again in this car....

ONLY complaints... front bumper is a tad bit small... im used to the nice big BRP/Bud's bumper I used to have on my Tc3 with a big ole blue Trinity foam bumper

and... that I had to drill new holes on my bodies to fit the TC4 :P~

otherwise.. im pretty pleased with it.... *shrug*
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Old 01-03-2005, 11:44 AM   #2361
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I was ready to throw my TC4 out the window after the first couple of race days with it. (one on carpet/ one on asphalt). Now that I have the car pretty quick (.3 tenths off some factory guys times and I was running the wrong tires) I will give the car a shot for this season. I am a little worried about asphalt after some of the reports I've heard but we'll see in the spring after more people get to play with it outdoors.
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Old 01-03-2005, 11:47 AM   #2362
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After having not raced for almost 3 years, on impulse i bought a TC4 just before Xmas.

At the local track it looks like i will be one of only a couple TC4's as the Xray is run by almost everyone.

Observations so far about this car.
1. VERY responsive to changes.
2. very stable.
3. light - 5 grams over with FT dual fan kit (works awsome btw 30deg diff in the motor temp), Tekin G10+, stock futaba receiver.
no lightweight gear at all.
4. good transition speed.

I am just now playin around with different settings, seeing if i can get the twitchiness that i want to go with the rear traction.

Overall, very happy with the car.

I think in a couple months, there are going to be some damn fast tc4's. Just needs a bit of time to learn how it reacts to tuning.
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Old 01-03-2005, 11:52 AM   #2363
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bob Nilsen
I think this is a bit of a bold generalization... *everyone*?

I'm liking my TC4 more and more. I had my best lap times ever this weekend at Mikes racing a Snowbirds layout using something similar to the Barry Baker carpet setup on rc10.com. My car is now fast enough and dialed enough for me to concentrate on my driving.

I think you'll find that critics are typically more vocal than the people that are happy with the car. RCknight is apparently gonna bag on the TC4 indefinitely on this thread.

I'd suggest, however, that for every 1 person that's vocally unhappy with their TC4... there are 10 that like it just fine and are here to discuss ways to improve their setup.
Bob's TC4 had some serious rip this weekend! Added a couple of laps to his runs easy :P

Anyhoo, most the guys at our track run Xrays and swear by them. I think it all boils down to three things in favor of that car on our track…

1. Weight: We don't tech cars and the Xray is GROSSLY underweight. About the only thing lighter is my HPI Pro4 (HA!)

2. Reliability: There is one particular sportsman driver at our track who absolutely beats the SNOT out of his Xray and almost never breaks. These are the sorts of hits that would send my old TC3 to the garbage can, but he just keeps going. My Point: Nothing is tougher than an Xray, and our track can be brutal (especially “Expert Stock”).

3. Shared tuning brain trust: Whereas Bob and I are off in the weeds figuring out what set-ups work on our respective cars, the Xray guys are all running a setup almost the exact same as each other with minor differences in castor. Tires, springs, damping, and roll center all the same.

What's funny is that there are several drivers (sponsored) who show up every now and then with their TC4s and XXX-Ss and hand everyone their butts.

I've always been an AE guy, but just had to try something different after my TC3 (now HPI Pro4). The HPI is a great car, very reliable (Jaco wheels break too often BTW), light to fend off the Xrays, and just about dialed in for our track. But after looking over Bob's car this weekend I might have to propose a "wife swap" and have him drive mine for a round and I'll try his.

Kudos for not following the herd Bob! I'm right there with ya.
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Old 01-03-2005, 12:05 PM   #2364
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We have the same problems with Jaco's (although I'm using pan car tires for my pan car. . .strangely enough! ) - tire sauce melts them and any hit destroys them.

Anyway - that is one huge aspect, the brain trust. I also run Pro10 (primary class) and we all run 10L2 or 2.5's and it's so much easier to run what we all run so when someone has a problem, we all know what is up. . . if everyone around you runs X-Ray, well it's going to be harder to set up your TC4 unless you're already very good at working alone. . .

I WOULD like to see more places actually tech their cars. I know that we tech ourselves, for the most part (in our Pro10 class) - nobody is under weight, etc. I think it would actually motivate people to BE legal. If there's no motivation to BE legal, then WHY?
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Old 01-03-2005, 12:11 PM   #2365
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and don't get me wrong, nothing wrong with the car, just not working for me. I tried a lot of things on it but still could not get it the way I like a car to be.
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Old 01-03-2005, 12:18 PM   #2366
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Thanks for the confirmation on Jaco's Boomer.

Back on the weight/tech issue, what's funny is that there's a whole bunch of crying about who's running handwound 19T motors and suspect stock motors at our track. There's lots of quoting ROAR rules on the local boards etc etc, but nobody wants to quote the rules about bodies or chassis weight. I'd love to figure out a simple way to turn a pan car into 4wd and take that out there with a Protoform Nemisis body. What are they going to say about that? It's underweight? HA! I've made my point to several locals that we needed to stop complaining about motors and get back to racing open 19T and mod classes because there's alot more non-ROAR stuff going on than motors.
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Old 01-03-2005, 12:49 PM   #2367
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Quote:
Originally posted by mushu
Thanks for the confirmation on Jaco's Boomer.

Back on the weight/tech issue, what's funny is that there's a whole bunch of crying about who's running handwound 19T motors and suspect stock motors at our track. There's lots of quoting ROAR rules on the local boards etc etc, but nobody wants to quote the rules about bodies or chassis weight. I'd love to figure out a simple way to turn a pan car into 4wd and take that out there with a Protoform Nemisis body. What are they going to say about that? It's underweight? HA! I've made my point to several locals that we needed to stop complaining about motors and get back to racing open 19T and mod classes because there's alot more non-ROAR stuff going on than motors.
YOu make me happy to race where I race at when I hear stuff like that. No one who runs competitively at our track cheats or runs illegal motors of any kind. I am sure I have seen guys in the lower mains running cheater motors (Way to fast). Occasionally someone who has a brand new kit will run underweight-but when we weigh the car-the owner never has a problem adding in weight-even if its 3 or 4 oz-which we have seen and it does make a BIG difference when they make weight-like 0.2 to .4 sec per lap!!

Also-we know whos got raw talent and who doesnt. This weekend two guys were 0.8 to 1 sec faster than everyone else. thats 1 sec per lap mind you-an eternity on a 14 sec lap course. But-I know they didnt cheat-they were just dialed yesterday!!
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Old 01-03-2005, 01:02 PM   #2368
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xrays.. seem to be consistant... now, perhaps like you said it could be that the drivers all share the same setup.

i know for a fact that my setup in springs are different and always have been different from what other TC3'ers run. I run what suits my style of driving....

does that mean all the xray'ers drive similar? hrmm.. nah.


Last edited by RCMits; 01-03-2005 at 01:08 PM.
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Old 01-03-2005, 01:10 PM   #2369
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Nobody knows of a source for carbide thrust balls?
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Old 01-03-2005, 01:20 PM   #2370
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Quote:
Originally posted by Windsorguy99
Nobody knows of a source for carbide thrust balls?

did you try RC4LESS.com ?
I don't know it they also make thrust balls.
Cheers.

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