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Old 08-28-2013, 10:39 PM   #5836
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The S is for soft and refers to the hardness of the plastic. Medium have no marking and hard have an H.

Are you using a standard spur or an offset Xray style? If it is an offset, flipping the spur may give you the mesh you want.
Huh just checked and I thought I ordered the medium but in fact ordered the standard, or soft as you say. What difference would I see between the soft vs the medium? any idea?

Im also using the standard spur so no luck there.
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Old 08-28-2013, 10:46 PM   #5837
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Huh just checked and I thought I ordered the medium but in fact ordered the standard, or soft as you say. What difference would I see between the soft vs the medium? any idea?

Im also using the standard spur so no luck there.
Tried all 3 type before. The Soft plastic parts makes the car very unpredictable...... normal parts a bit better. Like the hard stuff most.... just my 2 cents.
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Old 08-28-2013, 10:50 PM   #5838
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Tried all 3 type before. The Soft plastic parts makes the car very unpredictable...... normal parts a bit better. Like the hard stuff most.... just my 2 cents.
Interesting. Parts are cheap so I might just pick up med and hard too just to try. Thanks!
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Old 08-28-2013, 11:01 PM   #5839
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I was of the thinking the softer stuff aka plastic not ALU would flex more and provide better overall traction. Can you explain what you mean by unpredictable?
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Old 08-29-2013, 01:01 AM   #5840
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Hi Everyone,

Iím having difficulties with the rear belt/diff and was hoping someone could help me out.

The belt keeps tapping the chassis as if its warped and the diff looks like its not centred. Ive replaced the diff with a spare but the problem still remains. The belt doesnt look damaged but its the only thing I havent changed yet. The eccenter is pointing straight down and is even on both sides. Should I replace the belt or is there something else Im missing?? Some people have said its normal but it causing a considerable wobble in the rear at low speedsÖ.

Thanks in advance for your help.
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Old 08-29-2013, 07:25 AM   #5841
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Hi Everyone,

Iím having difficulties with the rear belt/diff and was hoping someone could help me out.

The belt keeps tapping the chassis as if its warped and the diff looks like its not centred. Ive replaced the diff with a spare but the problem still remains. The belt doesnt look damaged but its the only thing I havent changed yet. The eccenter is pointing straight down and is even on both sides. Should I replace the belt or is there something else Im missing?? Some people have said its normal but it causing a considerable wobble in the rear at low speedsÖ.

Thanks in advance for your help.
did you try tightening the belt one notch?
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Old 08-29-2013, 04:44 PM   #5842
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Yes. Thanks for the response. I figured it out last night. It needed two notches before it straightened up. Ive havent been racing long and just realised thats what the eccenter is for
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Old 08-30-2013, 01:45 PM   #5843
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Huh just checked and I thought I ordered the medium but in fact ordered the standard, or soft as you say. What difference would I see between the soft vs the medium? any idea?

Im also using the standard spur so no luck there.
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Originally Posted by Bhodi11 View Post
I was of the thinking the softer stuff aka plastic not ALU would flex more and provide better overall traction. Can you explain what you mean by unpredictable?
I have used all 3. I am an average driver, but I did not feel a difference in handling with the c-hubs, but I did with the arms. I found the soft (in general) does flex more, and is a little less predictable due to the flex (variable camber/tie). The hard made the car feel much more precise for me (I could feel 1/2* changes in camber), but they break much easier. I have lost several front c-hubs and a few rear arms in the hard and medium, where I usually replace the softs when they wear out. I personally found the medium to be the unhappy medium, as I felt they were not as precise as the hard, but shared the same lack of durability.

I am running mostly hard plastics right now on the 17.5 and all soft on the mod car. If I am going to a larger race, I take both options. If there is a lot of contact going on, I might consider swapping to soft plastics just to ensure I finish, but I prefer the feel of the hard. I have aluminum knuckles and rear uprights but scared to use them as I only hear horror stories about them. They came with parts I bought though so just sitting there. I don't even run those pieces in aluminum on my ebuggy hehe.

No idea on the gear then. I run the RW gears (Xray offset) with no issues on everything from mid 20's to mid 50's pinions of all different brands (including PRS). Maybe a top down close up picture would help see if something is amiss?
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Old 08-30-2013, 02:04 PM   #5844
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I've been using the aluminum rear uprights and have no complaints. I switched after a couple instances of ripping the ballstud out of the plastic ones. Now it's pretty bulletproof and I can't imagine they'll ever wear out. A side-benefit is less play if you use the set screw to lock it to the hinge-pin.
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Old 08-30-2013, 07:42 PM   #5845
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Hey steve. have you had any issues with bending or bearing issues with the alloy uprights?

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Old 08-30-2013, 08:09 PM   #5846
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On the front, I line the end of the bar up with the end of the ball joint. On the rear, I run the out-board pick-up (use a ball joint in the front hole of the arm, and then make up a link to connect to the roll-bar), which allows me to use the full length of the bar.
If your using the kit setup, you'll just want to make the link vertical, and measure how much bar is sticking out, then match the two sides.

Valk means to not lock down the two set screws on the bulkheads, as clamping these down will mean the bar can't drop freely.

I have a fairly lengthy process to setup roll-bars, but once done, it's pretty much fit and forget... This is all assuming that the bar you have isn't badly tweaked to start with, and sits flat on the table. A small tweak(0.5-1mm of rock) isn't a big issue, IMO, and I've never had much success trying to bend bars back, so tend to ignore that and make sure they are setup right on the car.
Also, this assumes that there is no binding elswhere, and all the arms are free to move, with no binding.

1) Mount the bar in the car, but without the ends connected. For the 1.4mm bars, use the 1.6mm holders (the 1.4mm ones are too snug, IMO). Then measure to make sure that the bar is mounted centrally in the car. You can do this off the bends in the bar to the bulkheads. Once it's central, lock down the centre retainer, so the bar can't move side to side. Check the movement is still free. You might need to cant the grub screw of the retainer so it points towards the middle of the car, as the collar can rub a little on the diff pulleys.

2) Next up, adjust the bulkhead set screws. Lifting and dropping the bar, slowly tighten down each screw until it doesn't drop under it's own weight, then back the screw off a little. When set right, there should be a small amount of play, but the bar should move freely.

3) Now attach the links to the arms. Make sure as a starting point they are the same length, and as mentioned above, that the balls attach to the same point on the bar (same amount of length either side is poking out).

4) Now comes the tricky part, which is setting up the bar to make sure it acts equal side to side. If you've followed all the above, it should be pretty darn close, but even so most still need a bit of setting up.
I use the "tap" technique to setup the bars. Basically, have the whole suspension built up, but remove the shocks. Now put a droop value on the end of the car you want to setup. I tend to use a lower gauge number than I would on track, more for ease of setting up (for example, I tend to run 5 droop on the rear of my car. For setting up the bars, I'll put this to 4).
Now slowly lift one side of the suspension, and make a note of when the other side lifts. I use a ride height gauge, pushed under the outer hinge pin point, and gently "tap" the opposite side whilst going to a higher number on the rh gauge. If the bar hasn't lifted, it won't tap, but when it does, you'll know. Make a note of the number that the bar lifted on, then repeat for the other side.
The key point is to get both sides lifting at the same time. If they are out, then you need to adjust the roll bar links to make them lift at the same measurement.
If the left hand-side lifts off at 7mm, but the right lifts off at 9mm, then you need to adjust the links. In that example, you either want to lengthen the left roll bar link, or shorten the right roll bar link.
One of the nice things about the snake, is that it's pretty easy to adjust the links by using a 2mm driver in the pivot balls in the arms, but you will have to play a little with the amount of adjustment to get it right.

Once you've got it right, go back through and check that all the arms are still free, and your good to go.

HiH
Ed
Ok im stumped!!! First car setup roll bars using above worked great. Second car I cannot no matter what I try get the 2 sides to lift equally. I even tried the roll bar from other car, flipped them over both times same issue. I tried flipping the camber links, changed the right arm out, tried extremes in bar length difference in both directions, moved the roll bar mounts out to front of arm. Everything is completely free on both sides - arms, uprights, camber links at both ball studs, dog bones. I just dont get it. Any ideas???

Update: did some more work trying to fix issue. Ive taken it down to only the rear arms and sway bars installed. Double checked the arms move freely on pins on and off the car. I have tried 2 different roll bars and flipped each one of them over. I am still getting the left side lifting around 6mm and the right around 12mm. At one point I got it to around 7mm on left and 9mm on right but it was late and I kept working at it to get it perfect but never could get back to that close of a value.When I adjust the heights of the arm holders it seems to have little or no effect. I did notice I have a little lift on the back right corner. With the chassis sitting flat on setup board I can rock it slightly. I loosened every screw on the bottom and top but the lift in that corner would not go away. Not sure if this would be enough to cause the roll bar issue but I did press the chassis down so it was perfectly flat on all 4 corners and tested the roll bar with same results as above. What I do know is that regardless of swapping parts in various combinations side to side and from car to car the problem varied only by 4mm or so and always with the left side lifting the right side almost immediately and the right side lifting the left side at a much higher value.
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Last edited by Bhodi11; 08-31-2013 at 10:18 AM.
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Old 08-30-2013, 09:10 PM   #5847
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Hey steve. have you had any issues with bending or bearing issues with the alloy uprights?

Nick K
Like I said, they've been bulletproof. I find it really hard to imagine the rears bending before the arm or camber link lets go. The front parts may be a different story, but I have not tried them. I would think the knuckles would be pretty durable though. I might try some later.

When they were new, a couple of the bearings were quite a tight fit but that's the only issue I've had.
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Old 08-31-2013, 08:48 PM   #5848
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Originally Posted by orcadigital View Post
I have used all 3. I am an average driver, but I did not feel a difference in handling with the c-hubs, but I did with the arms. I found the soft (in general) does flex more, and is a little less predictable due to the flex (variable camber/tie). The hard made the car feel much more precise for me (I could feel 1/2* changes in camber), but they break much easier. I have lost several front c-hubs and a few rear arms in the hard and medium, where I usually replace the softs when they wear out. I personally found the medium to be the unhappy medium, as I felt they were not as precise as the hard, but shared the same lack of durability.

I am running mostly hard plastics right now on the 17.5 and all soft on the mod car. If I am going to a larger race, I take both options. If there is a lot of contact going on, I might consider swapping to soft plastics just to ensure I finish, but I prefer the feel of the hard. I have aluminum knuckles and rear uprights but scared to use them as I only hear horror stories about them. They came with parts I bought though so just sitting there. I don't even run those pieces in aluminum on my ebuggy hehe.

No idea on the gear then. I run the RW gears (Xray offset) with no issues on everything from mid 20's to mid 50's pinions of all different brands (including PRS). Maybe a top down close up picture would help see if something is amiss?
One thing to note about the plastics, at least certainly on the wishbones, is that serpent made a running change to the medium arms for the Eryx. They kept the same part number, but revised the arm thickness, webbing, and material type used, which made the new medium arms a lot stiffer than the old ones, and less flexible than the old hard. With the thicker webs, they are also a lot more durable than the old Hards...

Biggest issue is that there is old stock of mediums still around. You want to get the newer header cards (the black/grey design) rather than the old ones, and the arms are clearly marked with an 'M'. You can also tell by the webbing nearest the inner hinge pin, as this curves round more between the two hinge pin holes.

Deffiently worth trying out for a better arm solution.

Regards
Ed
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Old 08-31-2013, 10:04 PM   #5849
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One thing to note about the plastics, at least certainly on the wishbones, is that serpent made a running change to the medium arms for the Eryx. They kept the same part number, but revised the arm thickness, webbing, and material type used, which made the new medium arms a lot stiffer than the old ones, and less flexible than the old hard. With the thicker webs, they are also a lot more durable than the old Hards...

Biggest issue is that there is old stock of mediums still around. You want to get the newer header cards (the black/grey design) rather than the old ones, and the arms are clearly marked with an 'M'. You can also tell by the webbing nearest the inner hinge pin, as this curves round more between the two hinge pin holes.

Deffiently worth trying out for a better arm solution.

Regards
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Did they do anything with the plastic on the medium C-Hub, Upright and Steering block when the change the plastic on the arm?
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Old 09-01-2013, 03:52 AM   #5850
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Ok im stumped!!! First car setup roll bars using above worked great. Second car I cannot no matter what I try get the 2 sides to lift equally. I even tried the roll bar from other car, flipped them over both times same issue. I tried flipping the camber links, changed the right arm out, tried extremes in bar length difference in both directions, moved the roll bar mounts out to front of arm. Everything is completely free on both sides - arms, uprights, camber links at both ball studs, dog bones. I just dont get it. Any ideas???

Update: did some more work trying to fix issue. Ive taken it down to only the rear arms and sway bars installed. Double checked the arms move freely on pins on and off the car. I have tried 2 different roll bars and flipped each one of them over. I am still getting the left side lifting around 6mm and the right around 12mm. At one point I got it to around 7mm on left and 9mm on right but it was late and I kept working at it to get it perfect but never could get back to that close of a value.When I adjust the heights of the arm holders it seems to have little or no effect. I did notice I have a little lift on the back right corner. With the chassis sitting flat on setup board I can rock it slightly. I loosened every screw on the bottom and top but the lift in that corner would not go away. Not sure if this would be enough to cause the roll bar issue but I did press the chassis down so it was perfectly flat on all 4 corners and tested the roll bar with same results as above. What I do know is that regardless of swapping parts in various combinations side to side and from car to car the problem varied only by 4mm or so and always with the left side lifting the right side almost immediately and the right side lifting the left side at a much higher value.
hmmm, thats really odd. I'm assuming that you've checked the droop settings and so on, prior to doing the tap test? otherwise, not sure what could be causing that issue!

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Did they do anything with the plastic on the medium C-Hub, Upright and Steering block when the change the plastic on the arm?
I believe they all use the new material (new batches anyway), but the same designs as before. Only the arms had the design changed.
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