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Old 08-09-2013, 07:20 AM   #5776
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The earplug trick is basically using this stuff (http://www.earplugstore.com/putbudcolsof.html) broken up into small pieces, and stuffed inside the diff. Add a few drops of oil to help it all slicken up a bit (doesn't matter what oil), and makes for a really heavy front diff, that doesn't prove a problem to remove! Think the tub cost me about $5 in Foodworks (I got tub of the orange in the link) and a tub will probably do 3 diffs.

Is quite a bit heavier than 500k, closer in feel to a 2.5mil diff.

Ed
Any chance you could snap a pic of what it looks like inside the diff? Curious how small of pieces and how much you fill it. How is the weight in comparison to using diff fluid?

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Obviously, more holes in the piston will make the shock for the same weight of oil, as there is more area for the oil to flow through. Hence why the need to run heavier oils to compensate.
However, one thing it does do, due to the larger hole area, is allow the oil to start flowing quicker on piston movement. This is 'pack'. The less pack, the quicker the shock can react to high-speed movement, such as bumps and so on. This is one way with our simplistic RC shocks that we can tweak high-speed damping (bump, kerbs) separately to low-speed (body control).

Personally, I would say for a smooth track, that the pack isn't so critical, and you'll probably be fine... but if it has big kerbs that unsettle a car, then give it a shot.

As a rule of thumb, I would go about 100-150wt harder with 4hole pistions. 6holes, probably be looking in the 1500-2000wt range... This is something I really want to test out again, but my last set of home made pistons were a touch off balance, so I need to get another set of Delrin pistons to play with.

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I got the GMK drill set and added 3 1.1mm holes to my 3 hole pistons and went up to 50wt front, 45wt rear associated oil. Track is indoor carpet with a fair amount of bumps. It definitely made the car less fidgety and feel much more settled especially on entering and exiting the corners. Using RSD springs as well which have always felt better to me then the Serpent ones. This is on an LE, 1st gen shocks.
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Old 08-10-2013, 07:55 PM   #5777
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oops double post
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Last edited by Bhodi11; 08-10-2013 at 08:11 PM.
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Old 08-10-2013, 07:55 PM   #5778
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Im working on resolving my torque steer issue. I have found few possible causes that reduced the issue but not entirely cured it. 1. changed tires, had a back tire the was a little mangled from a crash and had come unglued in a small area 2. disconnected the front sway bar 3.refilled diff.

My diff was dry with a little wear on the gears so I am replacing tonight. I did refill and reinstall did a test run no real difference. I noticed my front sway bar arm was rubbing the drive shaft a little. I disconnected both ends left it flopping and did a few runs. The problem was greatly reduced but still present. I changed tires from some rubber Sweeps to Ennetti foams and it got a little better. On a long straight I still have to correct to keep it heading on a line when boost kicks in at full throttle, but don't have to fight it from going out of control like before. Im thinking the biggest issue was with how I had the sway bars set up. So my question is can someone tell me the right way to set up the sway bars. Should the mounts be perpendicular to the ground? Should the wire be right at the end or sticking out "x" amount? Should the side with grub screw face in or out? Should the wire be held tight with the grub in the center or should the wire be able to slide freely left to right at front and back of the bulk head? What about the 2 grubs on the left and right side of bulk head with plastic guides? I have also noticed the ball joint ends are pretty tight on the sway bar assembly. Should these flop around freely? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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Last edited by Bhodi11; 08-10-2013 at 09:53 PM.
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Old 08-10-2013, 10:18 PM   #5779
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for the swaybar, dont tighten the screws down all the way on their keepers. i tighten them down so the ball has just the slightest tick to it, but still moves free. as for disconnecting, if you have the setscrews adjusted properly on the swaybar mounts, you should only need to disconnect one of the swaybar ends to try the car swaybarless. assuming the manual spec for endlink length, you shouldnt have any problems with the bars rubbing the axles. when in doubt, build the car absolutely to manual, and adjust from there.

if unhooking the sway bar fixed the on power torque steer, its likely the bar is tweaked or missaligned causing tweak. if the bar cant sit on a table top without rocking, replace the bar.

I do the lift test after ive checked tweak on my shock springs to make sure the swaybars are not causing tweak.

From the XRAY setup book on adjusting tweak via swaybar endlinks
"If the front right wheel lifts first, INCREASE the length of the rear left linkage and DECREASE the length of the rear right linkage by an equal but opposite amount"

Kind of the opposite of spring tweak adjustment and sometimes difficult to remember. especially with the funky blade setup xray had on the front bar in the nt1 heh.
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Old 08-10-2013, 11:59 PM   #5780
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for the swaybar, dont tighten the screws down all the way on their keepers. i tighten them down so the ball has just the slightest tick to it, but still moves free. as for disconnecting, if you have the setscrews adjusted properly on the swaybar mounts, you should only need to disconnect one of the swaybar ends to try the car swaybarless. assuming the manual spec for endlink length, you shouldnt have any problems with the bars rubbing the axles. when in doubt, build the car absolutely to manual, and adjust from there.

if unhooking the sway bar fixed the on power torque steer, its likely the bar is tweaked or missaligned causing tweak. if the bar cant sit on a table top without rocking, replace the bar.

I do the lift test after ive checked tweak on my shock springs to make sure the swaybars are not causing tweak.


From the XRAY setup book on adjusting tweak via swaybar endlinks
"If the front right wheel lifts first, INCREASE the length of the rear left linkage and DECREASE the length of the rear right linkage by an equal but opposite amount"

Kind of the opposite of spring tweak adjustment and sometimes difficult to remember. especially with the funky blade setup xray had on the front bar in the nt1 heh.
Thanks for the input. I want to make sure I understand you correctly. First the manual does not spec how much of the sway bar should be sticking out of the ball mount. On the front it is just long enough to do the job. On the back however there is quite a bit sticking out if I try to maintain the same positioning as the front. When you say the keepers do you mean the mounts attached to the arms? Not much chance of the rear coming out due to the extra length but if I did not lock down the front the sway bar would likely wiggle out. Or do you mean the two set screws on the bulk heads as well as the donut in the center? Or all of them? I feel stupid but there is no real info specifically on how they should be properly set up. Also should the balls move freely in the rod ends? Or does it matter? Thanks again for the help.
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Old 08-11-2013, 03:41 AM   #5781
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Default Setup on a "Rain Car"

I wounder if someone has tried to workout a setup for a Rain Car.

Discussions has started to allow a dedicated rain car in the serie that we are running in Sweden.
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Old 08-11-2013, 08:04 AM   #5782
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Any chance you could snap a pic of what it looks like inside the diff? Curious how small of pieces and how much you fill it. How is the weight in comparison to using diff fluid?
Here's a pic of the diff with the insides... as you can see, well packed out! The diff itself is very tight, with it out of the car can't turn the outdrives by hand, need to use drivers in the drive cup slots to turn it. Mounted in the car, you can move them a little, but still quite a lot of resistance. I haven't noticed much change during a either, and pretty sure it'll be easier than 2.5mil to get out!
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Old 08-11-2013, 08:32 AM   #5783
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Originally Posted by Bhodi11 View Post
Thanks for the input. I want to make sure I understand you correctly. First the manual does not spec how much of the sway bar should be sticking out of the ball mount. On the front it is just long enough to do the job. On the back however there is quite a bit sticking out if I try to maintain the same positioning as the front. When you say the keepers do you mean the mounts attached to the arms? Not much chance of the rear coming out due to the extra length but if I did not lock down the front the sway bar would likely wiggle out. Or do you mean the two set screws on the bulk heads as well as the donut in the center? Or all of them? I feel stupid but there is no real info specifically on how they should be properly set up. Also should the balls move freely in the rod ends? Or does it matter? Thanks again for the help.
On the front, I line the end of the bar up with the end of the ball joint. On the rear, I run the out-board pick-up (use a ball joint in the front hole of the arm, and then make up a link to connect to the roll-bar), which allows me to use the full length of the bar.
If your using the kit setup, you'll just want to make the link vertical, and measure how much bar is sticking out, then match the two sides.

Valk means to not lock down the two set screws on the bulkheads, as clamping these down will mean the bar can't drop freely.

I have a fairly lengthy process to setup roll-bars, but once done, it's pretty much fit and forget... This is all assuming that the bar you have isn't badly tweaked to start with, and sits flat on the table. A small tweak(0.5-1mm of rock) isn't a big issue, IMO, and I've never had much success trying to bend bars back, so tend to ignore that and make sure they are setup right on the car.
Also, this assumes that there is no binding elswhere, and all the arms are free to move, with no binding.

1) Mount the bar in the car, but without the ends connected. For the 1.4mm bars, use the 1.6mm holders (the 1.4mm ones are too snug, IMO). Then measure to make sure that the bar is mounted centrally in the car. You can do this off the bends in the bar to the bulkheads. Once it's central, lock down the centre retainer, so the bar can't move side to side. Check the movement is still free. You might need to cant the grub screw of the retainer so it points towards the middle of the car, as the collar can rub a little on the diff pulleys.

2) Next up, adjust the bulkhead set screws. Lifting and dropping the bar, slowly tighten down each screw until it doesn't drop under it's own weight, then back the screw off a little. When set right, there should be a small amount of play, but the bar should move freely.

3) Now attach the links to the arms. Make sure as a starting point they are the same length, and as mentioned above, that the balls attach to the same point on the bar (same amount of length either side is poking out).

4) Now comes the tricky part, which is setting up the bar to make sure it acts equal side to side. If you've followed all the above, it should be pretty darn close, but even so most still need a bit of setting up.
I use the "tap" technique to setup the bars. Basically, have the whole suspension built up, but remove the shocks. Now put a droop value on the end of the car you want to setup. I tend to use a lower gauge number than I would on track, more for ease of setting up (for example, I tend to run 5 droop on the rear of my car. For setting up the bars, I'll put this to 4).
Now slowly lift one side of the suspension, and make a note of when the other side lifts. I use a ride height gauge, pushed under the outer hinge pin point, and gently "tap" the opposite side whilst going to a higher number on the rh gauge. If the bar hasn't lifted, it won't tap, but when it does, you'll know. Make a note of the number that the bar lifted on, then repeat for the other side.
The key point is to get both sides lifting at the same time. If they are out, then you need to adjust the roll bar links to make them lift at the same measurement.
If the left hand-side lifts off at 7mm, but the right lifts off at 9mm, then you need to adjust the links. In that example, you either want to lengthen the left roll bar link, or shorten the right roll bar link.
One of the nice things about the snake, is that it's pretty easy to adjust the links by using a 2mm driver in the pivot balls in the arms, but you will have to play a little with the amount of adjustment to get it right.

Once you've got it right, go back through and check that all the arms are still free, and your good to go.

HiH
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Old 08-11-2013, 08:37 AM   #5784
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Originally Posted by Linguster View Post
I wounder if someone has tried to workout a setup for a Rain Car.

Discussions has started to allow a dedicated rain car in the serie that we are running in Sweden.
Honestly, for a wet car I just used to do the following...
Waterproof electrics
Wet Tyres
Higher ride height (for the puddles)
More droop

and run it!

I know there are a lot of people in the UK who like to go full soft, remove rollbars, and play a lot with shock positions. Personally, I never liked how the car drove when I did that, always prefered to litteraly run a waterproofed dry car if you will
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Old 08-11-2013, 11:48 AM   #5785
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Just like with real cars, you want the swaybar links to ve vertical at rest abd the bar as parallel to the ground as possible. Serpent says to cut the bar for the rear slightly. Leave a few mm extra though as you can adjust the bar tension by moving the links in or out.
I was talking about he little plastic keepers that attach the endlinks to the arms. I sont tighten them down all the way to keep the balls moving free.

With no shocks both arms should move up and down freely by the swaybar if you have done it right.
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Old 08-11-2013, 09:45 PM   #5786
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Thank you for taking the time to explain your process with the sway bars. That is exactly what I was hoping someone could explain cause it does not seem to be documented anywhere. It also confirms I have been doing it all wrong. I will test and report back.
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Old 08-12-2013, 10:08 AM   #5787
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The only thing I can add to sway bar adjustments, which Paul L mentioned once, is to make sure when starting that both links are the same length and also make sure that the setscrew for the links are in the same position on both sides. Since your link holder hole is big to accomodate larger bars, if the setscrews are in different orientation you could be effecting link length with out even noticing it.
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Old 08-12-2013, 01:48 PM   #5788
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I wonder what the specs are on the prototype chassis the David ran at the Euros?
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Old 08-12-2013, 04:46 PM   #5789
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I wonder what the specs are on the prototype chassis the David ran at the Euros?
2.5mm version of the 2mm stiff chassis I believe. He wasn't sure if it will make production though.
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Old 08-13-2013, 04:35 PM   #5790
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Any guys having a problem with the bearings on the middle shaft?

My friend and I both picked up Eryx's last month and both of us have had a bearing fail on the middle shaft that holds the spur and belt pulleys.
My friends bearing went out on him on the first day of driving it and mine went a week or 2 after that. Both bearing failures resulted in the middle shaft needing to be replaced due to damage on the ends where the bearing fits on too. We both run Mod class, 4.5T motors.

Im just curious are other guys(especially mod) having any similar problems?
one thing I noticed when ordering new bearings is that when searching for replacement bearings using the Serpent part number is that a flanged bearing comes up. Both our kits came with standard non flanged bearings.
Could this help explain the bearing failures? and maybe explain the spur side play that I see most people on here have?

I ordered the flanged bearings and also have some non flanged bearings like the ones that came with the kit. im waiting for them to come in along with the new center shaft. Any advice on which style bearing to use? we really don't want to keep replacing center shafts.



thanks
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