R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-26-2013, 01:02 PM   #5071
Tech Elite
 
corallyman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Edmonds, Wash
Posts: 4,291
Trader Rating: 97 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by valk View Post
so just the shocks and steering you have the new car form a te. that's more reasonable than $489 lol.

Im sure the split blocks would be nice but you could probably achieve the same effect using urethane spacers instead of the metal ones on the old style arm mounts.

but that makes for a lot of sku's for chassis parts. are the new chassis plates going to be compatible with the old arm mount location for those of us who might want to keep older cars running?
I don't really wanna get into having to buy more than one chassis plate or top deck in addition to the car..
though. i guess if I ever get to the competitive level some of you guys are running, i might have a different outlook on that ha.
You of course would also need new towers to go with the shocks. I think alot more info will be available when the new car gets in everyone's hands, but there was a release that said most of the parts would be interchangeable between the different versions. We will soon find out what we need to do.

I myself will be getting a new kit, and I am excited.

Steve
__________________
Team ORCA / ORCA USA / Pro Spec
Serpent America / Team Serpent S411 ERYX / On Point Racing OP12C, S120 / Xceed Products
Hangar 30 / Seattle RC Racers
Fasttrax Racing Series / NORA On Road Series
corallyman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2013, 01:21 PM   #5072
Tech Master
 
valk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 1,921
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Send a message via ICQ to valk Send a message via AIM to valk Send a message via MSN to valk
Default

id love a new kit but i just got these ones lol.
maybe when i pay off the mazda. guess three serpents is ok to have ha.
__________________
My stuff
Sanwa M12 - Xray T4/16 - Xray Nt1/16 - CRC XTI-WC - ProAMPS - Hobbywing - ReVTECH - ORCA
My RC
www.irocc.ca - www.wcics.ca - www.vrcworld.com
valk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2013, 02:20 PM   #5073
Tech Elite
 
Johnny Wishbone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,285
Trader Rating: 6 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by valk View Post
id love a new kit but i just got these ones lol.
maybe when i pay off the mazda. guess three serpents is ok to have ha.
If you follow the past thread with all the mods done to the existing S411 your car will be very competitive as is, only a few of the tuning options are really required, the rest is the fine tune of the existing parts. Option parts are for the most part the one piece motor mount, using the 2 piece leg with it. Replace the second o-ring in the RCM shocks with a 2mm spacers to get less stiction in the shocks and getting the diff freer make the car a potent weapon. (I'd probably upgrade to the composite gears for the diff as well). Run 1mm spacers under your top deck if you don't want to mill the half shaft supports down. As you wear out parts the new will filter into place and you'll end up with a 90% new version car.
__________________
Gary Lanzer
Team VBC HK
Team R1WURKS
Johnny Wishbone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2013, 03:33 PM   #5074
Tech Master
 
valk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 1,921
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Send a message via ICQ to valk Send a message via AIM to valk Send a message via MSN to valk
Default

its quite a long thread so summary view would be nice lol. i think its all the excitment of somthing new with the new car and parts. i just got these 411's so ill probably leave them alone this year. certainly wasnt the car slowing me down. driving style probably had a lot more to do with it as both cars were very well stuck to the ground on the carpet. excited to get them outside as i upped my personal best by two whole laps with the serpents indoors.
It is kind of nice this car has been around for a while now though and it hasn't fundamentally changed much. unlike some other big names in the game. i mean. sure its changed, but nice you dont have to drop $250 on it per year to keep up.
__________________
My stuff
Sanwa M12 - Xray T4/16 - Xray Nt1/16 - CRC XTI-WC - ProAMPS - Hobbywing - ReVTECH - ORCA
My RC
www.irocc.ca - www.wcics.ca - www.vrcworld.com
valk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 05:39 AM   #5075
Tech Champion
 
TryHard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sydney, NSW
Posts: 5,171
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by valk View Post
its quite a long thread so summary view would be nice lol. i think its all the excitment of somthing new with the new car and parts. i just got these 411's so ill probably leave them alone this year. certainly wasnt the car slowing me down. driving style probably had a lot more to do with it as both cars were very well stuck to the ground on the carpet. excited to get them outside as i upped my personal best by two whole laps with the serpents indoors.
It is kind of nice this car has been around for a while now though and it hasn't fundamentally changed much. unlike some other big names in the game. i mean. sure its changed, but nice you dont have to drop $250 on it per year to keep up.
As Gary mentioned, to make the current car's competitive really only needs a few choice upgrades. In my experience, a TE only really needs the following;

Front DCJ's
One-piece motor mount
Hard suspension plastics
1.5 suspension block on the FR position
Extra delrin shims for the shocks (for the single o-ring, but you could use normal shims for this too)

For older cars, I'd add the V2 steering rack to that list, and that's it. Both types of shocks work fine, my TE has RCM's and my other car the RCXX's... can't tell much difference!

That's it, not really a lot of parts. Yes I have a few custom bits and extras on my TE (steering mod, top deck with a front brace, home made servo mount, VBC plastic gears in the diff), but they aren't necessarily must haves, just things I've worked on. Oh, and I don't use Serpent springs, but Ride and HPI's, but that's a personal preference thing.

So certainly can be competitive with the old car... and the fact the new parts will fit to the old relatively easy is a bonus. I do intend to make a test when my new vehicle arrives, and test out old vs new, and if possible, try the old (long) shocks on the new car, and see what the difference is... if I get the time that is!

Ed
__________________
| THard.co.uk | Xray | Hobbywing |
TryHard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 07:36 AM   #5076
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Southfield, MI
Posts: 262
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TryHard View Post
As Gary mentioned, to make the current car's competitive really only needs a few choice upgrades. In my experience, a TE only really needs the following;

Front DCJ's
One-piece motor mount
Hard suspension plastics
1.5 suspension block on the FR position
Extra delrin shims for the shocks (for the single o-ring, but you could use normal shims for this too)

For older cars, I'd add the V2 steering rack to that list, and that's it. Both types of shocks work fine, my TE has RCM's and my other car the RCXX's... can't tell much difference!

That's it, not really a lot of parts. Yes I have a few custom bits and extras on my TE (steering mod, top deck with a front brace, home made servo mount, VBC plastic gears in the diff), but they aren't necessarily must haves, just things I've worked on. Oh, and I don't use Serpent springs, but Ride and HPI's, but that's a personal preference thing.

So certainly can be competitive with the old car... and the fact the new parts will fit to the old relatively easy is a bonus. I do intend to make a test when my new vehicle arrives, and test out old vs new, and if possible, try the old (long) shocks on the new car, and see what the difference is... if I get the time that is!

Ed
The best part about everything that u stated is that even with everything listed its only marginally more than paying for X-ray ecs's.

Any whoo if everything goes as planned I will have the new kit tomorrow I will post some pics.
__________________
Alston Kelso
Serpent•SMC Batteries•Reilly Paint•CEFX
Detroit Racing Team

"Let's See" Open it up.....Chris Goetz
98tahoeboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 01:06 PM   #5077
Tech Master
 
valk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 1,921
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Send a message via ICQ to valk Send a message via AIM to valk Send a message via MSN to valk
Default

only thing id need is the shafts and suspension block. both cars have v2 steering. one car has one peice mount, other two peice.

had the older 411 out with stock equipment last night and the flipped shocks and it was very easy to drive it around the 12th scale course. average amain 17.5 12th scale lap was 9.4-9.8 where i was able to get around in 17.5 touring car in 10.6. so not terrible really.

ill see how it does this outdoor season before i go spending money. ill save the te for mod.
__________________
My stuff
Sanwa M12 - Xray T4/16 - Xray Nt1/16 - CRC XTI-WC - ProAMPS - Hobbywing - ReVTECH - ORCA
My RC
www.irocc.ca - www.wcics.ca - www.vrcworld.com
valk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 01:32 PM   #5078
Tech Fanatic
 
JAM Racing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Baulkham Hills
Posts: 751
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TryHard View Post
As Gary mentioned, to make the current car's competitive really only needs a few choice upgrades. In my experience, a TE only really needs the following;

Front DCJ's
One-piece motor mount
Hard suspension plastics
1.5 suspension block on the FR position
Extra delrin shims for the shocks (for the single o-ring, but you could use normal shims for this too)

For older cars, I'd add the V2 steering rack to that list, and that's it. Both types of shocks work fine, my TE has RCM's and my other car the RCXX's... can't tell much difference!

That's it, not really a lot of parts. Yes I have a few custom bits and extras on my TE (steering mod, top deck with a front brace, home made servo mount, VBC plastic gears in the diff), but they aren't necessarily must haves, just things I've worked on. Oh, and I don't use Serpent springs, but Ride and HPI's, but that's a personal preference thing.

So certainly can be competitive with the old car... and the fact the new parts will fit to the old relatively easy is a bonus. I do intend to make a test when my new vehicle arrives, and test out old vs new, and if possible, try the old (long) shocks on the new car, and see what the difference is... if I get the time that is!

Ed
Ditto especially the springs... we've gone with Ride...we have never tried the hard arms but that's next on the agenda.... Jeff seems to like higher spring rates and any body who has seen his car makes the same comment....how does it get so much drive...it virtually squats n goes weather this is the normal arms flexing we have yet to find out but that's where Driving Style matters...and racing verses qualifying set up.
Having a Car that performs exactly as good on the track as the opposition presents no opportunity and in a race.
A race has phases

GETTING GOIN
KEEPING GOIN
BE THEIR AT THE END
CROSS THE LINE FIRST (optional)


You now have to add don't hurt the batteries and have the best tires for the last minute to the list and your loo kin up the pointy end of the race

and for that the serpent has surpassed all the other Chassis we've owned

( YEP WERE UP TO 3 ALREADY)....Even the old one drops into stock or 21.5 and halls arse and its got no bling bits on it at all except springs
yes we will get the new car but theirs nothing wrong with it previous generation
Regards Andrew
__________________
Walters Hobbies for all your racing needs
Serpent 411/ERYX
ORCA BATTERIES
Castle Hill Raceway
The Best in the West

Last edited by JAM Racing; 01-27-2013 at 01:33 PM. Reason: typo
JAM Racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 03:40 PM   #5079
Tech Regular
 
AUSCAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 483
Trader Rating: 6 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Wishbone View Post
How long is the track? What are the temps your getting? What are you running for a fdr? Are you running a fan on the motor?

Let us know and we'll try and help you out.
Hi Jonny. Thank you for the reply.
Our track is around 140 metres or 460 feet in length. I am currently running a gear ratio of 3.02 and a roll out of 65.47 and yes I am running a fan on the motor. I was getting temps up around 80 to 85 C (176 to 185 F) so the last time we raced, I used two fans, one blowing the other sucking, to move air through the motor and I dropped the timing back from 40 degrees to about 35 degrees. Doing this I managed to bring the temps down to what I feel are acceptable ie around 65 C (150 F). However, I was still not fast enough in a straight line indicating I need to gear up some more which in turn will raise the temps again. I also recently pulled down the motor and cleaned it and lightly oiled the bearings as I thought the lack of performance might have been due to dirt in the motor and / or bearings. The driveline is free and it's probably only been run for a total of 3 hours or so since I last pulled the car down and cleaned / replaced all the bearings.

So, what do you think? Am I being too cautious as regards the motor temps maybe? I'm thinking of getting a new rotor for the motor to see if that cures the problem.

Any advice would be very much appreciated.

Cheers
__________________
Serpent Eryx 2.0
Serpent Eryx 3.0
Serpent 977E
Walter RC Hobby
AUSCAN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 06:08 PM   #5080
Tech Master
 
valk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 1,921
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Send a message via ICQ to valk Send a message via AIM to valk Send a message via MSN to valk
Default

id try a smaller rotor for sure. on long tracks might help you get a little more top speed.
__________________
My stuff
Sanwa M12 - Xray T4/16 - Xray Nt1/16 - CRC XTI-WC - ProAMPS - Hobbywing - ReVTECH - ORCA
My RC
www.irocc.ca - www.wcics.ca - www.vrcworld.com
valk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 06:17 PM   #5081
Tech Master
 
Benzaah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,966
Trader Rating: 21 (96%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AUSCAN View Post
I was getting temps up around 80 to 85 C (176 to 185 F) so the last time we raced, I used two fans, one blowing the other sucking, to move air through the motor and I dropped the timing back from 40 degrees to about 35 degrees. Doing this I managed to bring the temps down to what I feel are acceptable ie around 65 C (150 F).

So, what do you think? Am I being too cautious as regards the motor temps maybe? I'm thinking of getting a new rotor for the motor to see if that cures the problem.

Any advice would be very much appreciated.

Cheers
IMO any motor temp consistently under 85c is fine and I usually run outdoors on a track that is anywhere from 45 to 65 c with air temps ranging from 25 to 36c. I am running the D3.5 which handles a bit more temp and I'm running that at mid 90c all the time with a 2 fan set up but with both fans blowing air at the motor. If your temps are consistent and you are not fading at the end of the run then your fine. Max timing and fdr is not always a good thing and having good speed and rip out the corners with no fade at the end of the run is most important if you are aiming for wins. We have a guy here locally who pushes his motors to the extreme(100c plus temp) and no one can catch him for 3 minutes. Then he starts to fade and unless he has had a very clean first 3 minutes everyone catches him back up in the last 3 minutes. He has also burned up 1 motor in 4 club days but with podium finishes he doesn't care about burning them up.


As for old vs new, I'm itching to get my hands on the new car but I am with others on this thread in saying the old car is still very good. Ive got an original s411 still not TE with a V2 motor mount, 1.5 fr toe block, dcj's and a cut top deck that's it. RCCX shocks are better than the RCM IMO as once built right they let little to no air in them. I hope they design a super short RCCX for us to buy.

As for set up I have found going to ride red springs all round has been a massive jump in corner speed and handling and I persisted with the serpent springs for a long time. I have one of ed's cut top decks which i think has helped balance the front and rear out a lot and suggest anyone running the old std top deck to break out the Dremel.. I had the local awesomatix driving state champ struggling to get away from me at yesterday's practice day and he can usually gap me easily. I wish serpent had an easy way to fill in set up sheets and post them like X-ray does. It's the only thing I now miss a bout that brand.

The other thing I love about this Car is the even tyre wear it generates. I am getting zero ring of death on the fronts and around 20 runs on tyres before a noticeable drop in lap times. I have new boots for this coming weeks start to the club champs so its going to be an exciting weekend coming up. Will be even more interesting if I get the new ride this Friday
__________________
AERCCC - ARCR - RRCSA

Adelaide RC

Walter Rc Hobby
Benzaah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:05 AM   #5082
Tech Elite
 
Pattojnr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Perth Australia
Posts: 4,594
Trader Rating: 19 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benzaah View Post
As for old vs new, I'm itching to get my hands on the new car but I am with others on this thread in saying the old car is still very good. Ive got an original s411 still not TE with a V2 motor mount, 1.5 fr toe block, dcj's and a cut top deck that's it. RCCX shocks are better than the RCM IMO as once built right they let little to no air in them. I hope they design a super short RCCX for us to buy.

As for set up I have found going to ride red springs all round has been a massive jump in corner speed and handling and I persisted with the serpent springs for a long time. I have one of ed's cut top decks which i think has helped balance the front and rear out a lot and suggest anyone running the old std top deck to break out the Dremel.. I had the local awesomatix driving state champ struggling to get away from me at yesterday's practice day and he can usually gap me easily. I wish serpent had an easy way to fill in set up sheets and post them like X-ray does. It's the only thing I now miss a bout that brand.

The other thing I love about this Car is the even tyre wear it generates. I am getting zero ring of death on the fronts and around 20 runs on tyres before a noticeable drop in lap times. I have new boots for this coming weeks start to the club champs so its going to be an exciting weekend coming up. Will be even more interesting if I get the new ride this Friday
you may also need to go for a drive up the Hill, grab a setup for November Time ! i believe LH will hold Nats , and the EP layout for the front straight for Mod, could see some destroyed cars against Pit wall. cant wait, just not any serpents i hope .
__________________
Serpent - Walter RC
Serpent E Power ..... Serpent 747 Reds M3T
Serpent 966-TE Reds M7T .... S411ERYX Speedpassion 3.5T, T-Shox
Serpent 811-TE REDs R5T
Pattojnr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 05:12 AM   #5083
Tech Master
 
Benzaah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,966
Trader Rating: 21 (96%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pattojnr View Post
you may also need to go for a drive up the Hill, grab a setup for November Time ! i believe LH will hold Nats , and the EP layout for the front straight for Mod, could see some destroyed cars against Pit wall. cant wait, just not any serpents i hope .
Do i get a hint you are going to come over for this event? The front wall has never posed a problem in any big electric meet ive been to there before. I've only run the car there once and it handled the camber change well. Unfortunately the club does not even run a proper electric class format so it's pointless going there for any practice till this happens. Here's hoping they will start running TC opposite the Gas weekend soon. Seeing as your in the know can you find out if this is going to happen?

Here is the track Patto is talking about. 1/8th gas track on the side of a hill with big off camber sections. Certainly a challenging track to set the car up on!
__________________
AERCCC - ARCR - RRCSA

Adelaide RC

Walter Rc Hobby
Benzaah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 09:52 AM   #5084
Tech Elite
 
Johnny Wishbone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,285
Trader Rating: 6 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AUSCAN View Post
Hi Jonny. Thank you for the reply.
Our track is around 140 metres or 460 feet in length. I am currently running a gear ratio of 3.02 and a roll out of 65.47 and yes I am running a fan on the motor. I was getting temps up around 80 to 85 C (176 to 185 F) so the last time we raced, I used two fans, one blowing the other sucking, to move air through the motor and I dropped the timing back from 40 degrees to about 35 degrees. Doing this I managed to bring the temps down to what I feel are acceptable ie around 65 C (150 F). However, I was still not fast enough in a straight line indicating I need to gear up some more which in turn will raise the temps again. I also recently pulled down the motor and cleaned it and lightly oiled the bearings as I thought the lack of performance might have been due to dirt in the motor and / or bearings. The driveline is free and it's probably only been run for a total of 3 hours or so since I last pulled the car down and cleaned / replaced all the bearings.

So, what do you think? Am I being too cautious as regards the motor temps maybe? I'm thinking of getting a new rotor for the motor to see if that cures the problem.

Any advice would be very much appreciated.

Cheers
Quote:
Originally Posted by valk View Post
id try a smaller rotor for sure. on long tracks might help you get a little more top speed.
I'd have to agree with the rotor change, the Reedy motor seems to be more of a torque motor in the stock configuration, so I'd be temped to change the rotor to a rpm type. The rest of what you posted seems to be okay. See Benzaah post below for more solid info.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Benzaah View Post
IMO any motor temp consistently under 85c is fine and I usually run outdoors on a track that is anywhere from 45 to 65 c with air temps ranging from 25 to 36c. I am running the D3.5 which handles a bit more temp and I'm running that at mid 90c all the time with a 2 fan set up but with both fans blowing air at the motor. If your temps are consistent and you are not fading at the end of the run then your fine. Max timing and fdr is not always a good thing and having good speed and rip out the corners with no fade at the end of the run is most important if you are aiming for wins. We have a guy here locally who pushes his motors to the extreme(100c plus temp) and no one can catch him for 3 minutes. Then he starts to fade and unless he has had a very clean first 3 minutes everyone catches him back up in the last 3 minutes. He has also burned up 1 motor in 4 club days but with podium finishes he doesn't care about burning them up.
Good info here as well.
__________________
Gary Lanzer
Team VBC HK
Team R1WURKS
Johnny Wishbone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2013, 01:03 AM   #5085
Tech Fanatic
 
JAM Racing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Baulkham Hills
Posts: 751
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pattojnr View Post
you may also need to go for a drive up the Hill, grab a setup for November Time ! i believe LH will hold Nats , and the EP layout for the front straight for Mod, could see some destroyed cars against Pit wall. cant wait, just not any serpents i hope .
OK wheres LH
Sounds like a place to prrctise...maybee a mentoring day
__________________
Walters Hobbies for all your racing needs
Serpent 411/ERYX
ORCA BATTERIES
Castle Hill Raceway
The Best in the West
JAM Racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Batu Kawan Rc Track Tongga Malaysian R/C Racers 10418 06-28-2016 11:34 PM
DRCW Raceway Chesapeake, VA // Asphalt / Indoor Off Road / Outdoor Off Road stiltskin Racing Forum 10278 11-14-2014 07:39 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 07:01 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0