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Old 01-05-2013, 12:43 PM   #4921
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does anyone run a S411 in USGT ?
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Old 01-05-2013, 11:54 PM   #4922
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Finally got to the track for the first time in a while, and spent the whole day running through a list of items to test out.

First run, I kept everything as my starting setup, with the exception of the lowered steering. Honestly, car felt like it had a different steering feel, compared to what I remember. It's hard to describe, but it felt more linear, whilst also steering harder. Could be more aggresive and play with the steering during cornering without any weird responses.. Was it any faster? Hard to say, but to me it felt better on track, more natural (for want of a better phrase).

First change of the day was springs, as I wanted to try out the Ride Yellow's vs the Green's that I've settled on as part of my starting setup. (Green is 272gf vs Yellow at 259gf/mm... or 15.2 vs 14.6 in old terms ).
Even with such a small rate change, the car didn't feel as good, felling too soft, with less reaction and corner speed. Moving the shocks back up to holes 3F/4R helped to bring back a more linear feel, and produce similar lap times as with the greens.

Next on the list was trying out narrower hexes again, as the stock hexes do make the car a little wide compared to others out there. In theory, narrower should give more grip, and quicker reaction. To do this I used the 747 -1mm hexes, with some 0.5mm shims. This test didn't really go as expected, car felt really weird on track, and not what I expected. Checking the car over back in the pits, turns out the the hexes were rubbing against the hubs (instant clue was when pulling the tyres off, hexes were super hot!), as they don't have a lip to keep them off the hub. Will have to save testing narrower for when the -0.75 Xray hexes arrive.

Next change on the list was lowering the lower pins 0.5mm compared to standard setup. This has the affect of lowering the roll-centre, so more roll, and in theory, more grip.... which is deffiently did. Interestingly, it seemed to give the car more rear grip than front, and settled the car very well. Corner speed did drop a bit though, and going back to the Green springs (with the shocks in the same position) did help gain that back. Lap times were good as well, and consistency improved too

Next run I wanted to test out the standard V2 motor mount, but with the cut rear brace on the top deck. Interestingly, car felt very similar on track compared to the BD7 style mount I have been using, with the exception of the rear end stepping out when getting aggressive, something that didn't happen previously. I have a theory that, in mod at least, loading up the rear end quickly with the cut rear brace over-flexes the rear end, causing it to get snappy. Might not be so noticeable on carpet, but on asphalt, best setup I've run is still the BD7 style.

Last run, added shims to the outside steering joint (1mm), to see the effect. Straight away car gained mid corner, and with a nicer, more reactive feel, wanting to get into the corner, rather than being forced. Quite suprised at how much a difference made, but will certainly be staying on the car for now

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Old 01-06-2013, 10:43 AM   #4923
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Last run, added shims to the outside steering joint (1mm), to see the effect. Straight away car gained mid corner, and with a nicer, more reactive feel, wanting to get into the corner, rather than being forced. Quite suprised at how much a difference made, but will certainly be staying on the car for now

Regards
Ed
I found a very similar response. I also found that increased mid corner steering response was about 1/2 the amount of removing a .5 mm shim from the steering block with even less effect on initial turn-in. The only difference is I am still playing with the shorter steering arms. Going to do a back to back test this week.

There's no doubt that adjusting steering angles via inner block height and outer mount height is really having a profound result on the way the 411 gets through the corner. Way more so then any other car I have owned.
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:21 PM   #4924
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I tried to fit TRF shocks and they rub against the shock towers. Anyone experienced this?
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:39 PM   #4925
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Originally Posted by Holmenkollen View Post
I tried to fit TRF shocks and they rub against the shock towers. Anyone experienced this?
I've been using them with no issues.... However I've been using the Exotek shock caps. Funny enough, I like the feel of the car with the Serpent shocks best.
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:53 PM   #4926
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pretty good weekend out with the new serpents all told. was sorted in the B main for 17.5 stock and stayed there pretty much the entire weekend. consistant runs all weekend. without needing to really do any adjustment to the car.
started with 30wt in all shocks, 4 holes in front 3 in rear. serpent yellow up front grey in the rear.
stock arm mounting, 4mm upper shims f/r for roll center. 1.0 camber front 1.5 rear. 0.5 toe out front.
5/3 downstops.

mod car was very much the same but 4/3 for droop.
ill fill in a setup sheet maybe.

was racing with eddie pretty much all the time. i think he qualified a few seconds ahead of me in most of my runs.
finished middle of the pack in the B, but the A guys are really just damn good and i might need to try different driving styles to get a handle on it. their cars seemed to be more abrupt in their movements. i treid to keep it smooth and in the black at all times which might have been slower than power up, turn in, power out. ill practice some more.

all i changed all weekend with that car though was shock position. let the fronts in the second hold but moved the rears out to the 4th. lots of traction, rear end never kicked out and i like a lot of steering =)

mod was alright. same setup mostly but i ended up swapping to a 350k dif in the front and 1.4 f/r ARBS which was a gamble. pretty sure all my qualifying was without rear but couldnt remember when i hooked it back up.

qualified pole on the B and ended up as a 1v1 with a very good vancouver driver. basically came down to who made the mistake first as i was 2 seconds behind him for a good bit of the race. he was just so smooth i had to drive super hard to catch up.
somehow i got by and bumped to the A as he had a crash near the end. not the way id like to win a race but everyone in the building was watching. pretty exciting dispite only two cars.

of course, i didnt inspect my car completely being so busy afterward, but my mesh went off and i roasted my spur a few laps into the A. was looking forward to seeing how id stack up to Kody, Korgae and Peter but there is always next time.

nice to try out mod and did a lot better than expected.

i ran 4 classes this weekend. was very busy so didnt test a lot of things. but imo that makes this car great, cause i set it up stock and it worked very well with little need for adjustment.

cant wait for speedweekend ashphalt. or.. maybe ill shmooz the wife into letting me go to WCICS finals in calgary!
kinda miss calgary... dispite the snow... and the -50 windchill, and walking down 37ave sw at 4 am in it...
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:05 PM   #4927
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duckman996 View Post
I've been using them with no issues.... However I've been using the Exotek shock caps. Funny enough, I like the feel of the car with the Serpent shocks best.
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:10 AM   #4928
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duckman996 View Post
I've been using them with no issues.... However I've been using the Exotek shock caps. Funny enough, I like the feel of the car with the Serpent shocks best.
Ok, I will try another cap. Now they rub against the shock tower.

I got 3 out of 4 Serpent dampers really smooth but the 3rd one is a problem. Ive replaced the o-rings but its still a lot of friction. Maybe I have to replace the shaft too.
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Old 01-07-2013, 02:50 AM   #4929
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holmenkollen View Post
Ok, I will try another cap. Now they rub against the shock tower.

I got 3 out of 4 Serpent dampers really smooth but the 3rd one is a problem. Ive replaced the o-rings but its still a lot of friction. Maybe I have to replace the shaft too.
I've been playing with the shocks again today, and have settled on the following parts and build method for the RCM shocks. Got all 4 built the same, and very nice and smooth.

Extra Parts;
Tamiya black bladders (TAM53576)
Extra delrin spacers (#160109)
Tamiya 4mm shim set (TAM53586)

Build technique;
  1. Assemble shock as per kit, but in bottom put the following - 0.4mm of 4mm shims, Delrin spacer, clear o-ring, 2x Delrin spacer (see pic), then put on bottom cap. Use a little oil or Green Slime on the o-ring.
    The extra shims are used to take up the slack, as the delrin spacers are thinner than the o-rings.
  2. Put on lower ball joint, and wind it up so there is a distance of 10mm from bottom cap to top of ball joint (measurement method is the same as the TE manual)
  3. Fill up shock with oil, and remove air with shock pump (I use Losi90 with 6hole pistons)
  4. Push piston all the way into body (or to where you want your rebound setting), and put on bladder. With the ball joint wound up to 10mm, the piston won't push into the bladder, which can cause issues with the rebound setting.
  5. Drill a 1mm hole in plastic top cap (if not already done), then put on top of bladder.
  6. Screw on alloy cap, keeping piston pushed in. To get easily tight, use a 13mm spanner.
  7. Now unwind the lower ball cup to allow droop to be set. Not unwinding the joint can mean holding the arm up, and not hitting the droop screws, especially with big droop settings. I currently have the front's at 10.5mm and the rear's at 11mm. (5F/4R Droop).

And on that point, also wanted to share some pics of my ride at the moment... just awaiting new motor, otherwise ready to rock.
Attached Thumbnails
Serpent S411-shock.jpg   Serpent S411-spacers.jpg   Serpent S411-car.jpg   Serpent S411-front.jpg   Serpent S411-rear.jpg  

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Last edited by TryHard; 01-07-2013 at 02:57 AM. Reason: list issue!
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:16 AM   #4930
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Hi !
I bought the 733 light gear diff ( nylon ) gear set. I only used 4 small nylon gears and changed them with the stock ones.So, now in my gear diff there are 6 gears, 4 small nylon and 2 big stock ones.But i didnt like the feeling while i was playing with it on my hands.It did not feel smooth.I know i have to try at the track.But is it because i used 4 small gears ? Shall i use 2 nylon small gears to have a better feeling ? With the stock gears it felt smoother ?
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:44 AM   #4931
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Hi !
I bought the 733 light gear diff ( nylon ) gear set. I only used 4 small nylon gears and changed them with the stock ones.So, now in my gear diff there are 6 gears, 4 small nylon and 2 big stock ones.But i didnt like the feeling while i was playing with it on my hands.It did not feel smooth.I know i have to try at the track.But is it because i used 4 small gears ? Shall i use 2 nylon small gears to have a better feeling ? With the stock gears it felt smoother ?
The plastic gears will take a little while to break in, but one suggestion to help is remove a shim from behind one of the big gears. This will help to loosen the mesh a little.
I don't recommend running only two plastic gears though... Experience shows them to strip easy... (Don't ask!)

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Old 01-07-2013, 06:42 AM   #4932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TryHard View Post
The plastic gears will take a little while to break in, but one suggestion to help is remove a shim from behind one of the big gears. This will help to loosen the mesh a little.
I don't recommend running only two plastic gears though... Experience shows them to strip easy... (Don't ask!)

HiH
Ed

All right then, i will try to break in it first if it won't work i will remove a shim. Thanks a lot !
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Old 01-08-2013, 06:30 AM   #4933
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I have a LE roller with a standard chassis for sale if anyone is keen. Serpent S411 LE Roller
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Old 01-08-2013, 03:36 PM   #4934
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Originally Posted by valk View Post
pretty good weekend out with the new serpents all told. was sorted in the B main for 17.5 stock and stayed there pretty much the entire weekend. consistant runs all weekend. without needing to really do any adjustment to the car.
started with 30wt in all shocks, 4 holes in front 3 in rear. serpent yellow up front grey in the rear.
stock arm mounting, 4mm upper shims f/r for roll center. 1.0 camber front 1.5 rear. 0.5 toe out front.
5/3 downstops.

mod car was very much the same but 4/3 for droop.
ill fill in a setup sheet maybe.

was racing with eddie pretty much all the time. i think he qualified a few seconds ahead of me in most of my runs.
finished middle of the pack in the B, but the A guys are really just damn good and i might need to try different driving styles to get a handle on it. their cars seemed to be more abrupt in their movements. i treid to keep it smooth and in the black at all times which might have been slower than power up, turn in, power out. ill practice some more.

all i changed all weekend with that car though was shock position. let the fronts in the second hold but moved the rears out to the 4th. lots of traction, rear end never kicked out and i like a lot of steering =)

mod was alright. same setup mostly but i ended up swapping to a 350k dif in the front and 1.4 f/r ARBS which was a gamble. pretty sure all my qualifying was without rear but couldnt remember when i hooked it back up.

qualified pole on the B and ended up as a 1v1 with a very good vancouver driver. basically came down to who made the mistake first as i was 2 seconds behind him for a good bit of the race. he was just so smooth i had to drive super hard to catch up.
somehow i got by and bumped to the A as he had a crash near the end. not the way id like to win a race but everyone in the building was watching. pretty exciting dispite only two cars.

of course, i didnt inspect my car completely being so busy afterward, but my mesh went off and i roasted my spur a few laps into the A. was looking forward to seeing how id stack up to Kody, Korgae and Peter but there is always next time.

nice to try out mod and did a lot better than expected.

i ran 4 classes this weekend. was very busy so didnt test a lot of things. but imo that makes this car great, cause i set it up stock and it worked very well with little need for adjustment.

cant wait for speedweekend ashphalt. or.. maybe ill shmooz the wife into letting me go to WCICS finals in calgary!
kinda miss calgary... dispite the snow... and the -50 windchill, and walking down 37ave sw at 4 am in it...
It was really great racing with you guys . I think there was a total of about six s411 and a couple of 120ltxs . I really like the stock 17.5 classs .
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Old 01-10-2013, 10:08 AM   #4935
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The new split block parts are listed on the Serpent site now.....split blocks, chassis, etc.
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