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Old 03-22-2011, 06:34 AM   #1051
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Originally Posted by Qatmix View Post
Re-cut motor mount

I think the context of the mod is the important issue. I don't disagree with you that it was the best option at that time. You guys were there and doing it and I wasn't.

I just think people should understand that it was used as a way to explore a possible solution for rear grip on that track, but it's not the absolute route for everyone.

I work in R&D and you would take that fix and analyse the actual effect on the chassis. Following that you would look at how all other components would/could work to achieve that effect. It may be the best solution, but until you investigate the rest it cant be stated that it is. I suppose I also dont like splashing cash around, and the willingness for some to cut a 50 mount without spending some time tuning your car seems odd.

People here are racing all different circuits and classes, it's impossible that a car will be perfect in all situations out of the box. People should spend time tuning their car to their driving style. Forums like this are great as you can get pointers from others but its just that, you may find that to get the best out of a car that you will need a set-up thats against the norm.

I only race at club level, (although usually place in the top 3 every week) But have been racing for over 20 years.

As to the larger mount, I like the stiffness as it means I can tune the suspension and make that do the work, giving me a consistent race car. (again thats just my preference), and also I dont run Mod motors on large asphalt tracks.

I am off to Ardent for a few hours to test the car with a 5.5t and see what I can achieve with and without my cut mount.
I work in R&D too, so we'll leave that there

To give some context to the mount change, by the time the cut mount came around, the team had pretty much been at the track for almost a week, testing a huge varitey of different settings.

I had up to that time also tried a shed load of tuning options (including Jilles lower roll-centre position, which I didn't like), and had been struggling with getting the car consistent enough. Fair enough, other factors were also playing into that consistency issue (serious radio problems that finally I resolved), but after cutting the mount I started to get the car more to my liking... I did actually only change the motor mount after I cut it, as I wanted a clear picture as to the effect.
Whilst the rest of the setup still wasn't perfect, no, but it was certainly an improvement, and step in the right direction.

Since coming back home, and trying it on a low-traction high-speed track, I've seen a marked improvement to my laptimes.... however I should state I have made other improvements to my setup as well, so whilst I am no way proclaiming it to be the be all and end all of a mega setup, it is IMO one part of the jig-saw.

I have to say, whilst I understand the quote about the chassis stiffness for consistent suspension (mainly as in full scale, flex is not a good thing)... IMO, for our cars flex is a tuning aid, much like springs or damplers. Yes, it needs to be controlled properly (flex the wrong way is not good), but when your looking for just a little more, without wanting to make major changes to geometry, damping and so on, it gives you options
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Old 03-22-2011, 07:04 AM   #1052
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Raced my 417 for the first time this past Saturday, and I am very pleased with the performance of this chassis. Ok, very pleased is probably an understatement. I participated in a 17.5 Spec class, so speeds are not super fast. On our grippy indoor asphalt track, I found the 417 to be very easy to drive. I could consistently place the car where I wanted it on the track. Initially, I experienced a bit of push exiting a turn, but after a few adjustments that was resolved.

I was a bit frustrated when I first arrived at the track and discovered that I needed an FDR in the 4.0 - 3.6 range, and could not find a pinion/spur combination that allowed access to one of the motor screws. A couple of friends with 417 helped me get past that hurdle, though.

At the end of the day, I finished 7th in the A Main after getting a bump up from a B Main win. Yeah, it was a good day!
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Old 03-22-2011, 07:45 AM   #1053
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Instead of cutting the motor mount did someone say you could use the 416X motor mount and lay shaft holder instead? Do the hole patterns line up on the bottom and top decks?
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Old 03-22-2011, 08:53 AM   #1054
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Originally Posted by Geppetto View Post
Raced my 417 for the first time this past Saturday, and I am very pleased with the performance of this chassis. Ok, very pleased is probably an understatement. I participated in a 17.5 Spec class, so speeds are not super fast. On our grippy indoor asphalt track, I found the 417 to be very easy to drive. I could consistently place the car where I wanted it on the track. Initially, I experienced a bit of push exiting a turn, but after a few adjustments that was resolved.

I was a bit frustrated when I first arrived at the track and discovered that I needed an FDR in the 4.0 - 3.6 range, and could not find a pinion/spur combination that allowed access to one of the motor screws. A couple of friends with 417 helped me get past that hurdle, though.

At the end of the day, I finished 7th in the A Main after getting a bump up from a B Main win. Yeah, it was a good day!
At the 'Coliseum' the high bite asphalt track actually favors the stiffer rear characteristics of the 417. With my 416x using the LiPO chassis I always struggled with the car pushing and not rotating enough. The 417 seems to rotate much better IMHO. We'll see how it works in medium to low grip conditions when we start heading outdoors for the summer.

Oh yeah great job this past weekend
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Old 03-22-2011, 05:52 PM   #1055
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Originally Posted by Electro-MAX RC View Post
Instead of cutting the motor mount did someone say you could use the 416X motor mount and lay shaft holder instead? Do the hole patterns line up on the bottom and top decks?
Unfortuantley not, the holes don't line up properly, and the top deck is in a higher position (although nothing that couldn't be solved with shims if the holes did line up).
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Old 03-23-2011, 01:04 AM   #1056
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Hy all!

I have a base question about the steering setup of you guys.

How much steering did you all use. I allways used the maximum steering, (so that the steering knuckle slightly touches the C-Hub.

With this setup with no wheels on, there is no chattering on the axles. When i put the whels on, and try it again, than it chatters.

This will cost cornerspeed. So should i try to run less max steeringabout 70% to avoid chattering? Or do you also run 100%

Who has experience with this things?

Greetings Blueman
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Old 03-23-2011, 05:58 AM   #1057
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How much steering did you all use. I allways used the maximum steering, (so that the steering knuckle slightly touches the C-Hub.
I always set the endpoints to max throw, but dial the dual rate down to somewhere between 18 - 22 deg's throw (no scrubbing of corner speed)... But I know others like it max'ed out all the time..... Personal preferences!
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Old 03-23-2011, 11:24 AM   #1058
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Why are they cutting the motor mount. on this car..
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Old 03-23-2011, 11:34 AM   #1059
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Originally Posted by GeorgePravata View Post
Why are they cutting the motor mount. on this car..
To go faster-er and get more traction.
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Old 03-23-2011, 11:41 AM   #1060
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Does anybody have any pic's of this done. And where would you cut it..
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Old 03-23-2011, 12:00 PM   #1061
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Default Basically gives a little more rear traction

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Old 03-23-2011, 02:54 PM   #1062
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Guys,

I assume the gear diff is popular for the rear of the 417, how about the front, gear/ball/one way/spool?

I have a tb03r ready to build, but trf is oh so tempting!
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Old 03-23-2011, 03:07 PM   #1063
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I have the gear diff at the front with 20k 50k or 100k oil and the ball diff at the rear. I race on carpet with a 10.5t. The ball diff is excellent, really smooth and easily adjustable.

The steering and corner grip is amazing with this car, and it's pretty to boot... Go on Dave.. Buy one
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Old 03-23-2011, 06:15 PM   #1064
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Guys,

I assume the gear diff is popular for the rear of the 417, how about the front, gear/ball/one way/spool?

I have a tb03r ready to build, but trf is oh so tempting!
Haha... oh the blue
Front for me has always been spool. The front gear diff is something I have wanted to try, but just haven't got around to it yet. It's one of those things that I think will work for some tracks and people better than others, but is still certainly worth a go.

One-ways.. haven't run one of them since the old 27t stock days!

HIH
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Old 03-24-2011, 12:20 AM   #1065
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One-ways.. haven't run one of them since the old 27t stock days!
aahhh (sigh)
The good ol' days
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