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Old 11-13-2013, 08:10 AM   #1366
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Originally Posted by celt View Post
Vue and I both plan to make it down along with seven to eight others we've introduced to the best racing RC has to offer!

Interesting...

We've had a number of guys say that they dig the mini's, but would like the ease and long run times of brushless. many hate the idea of tweaking motors. We allowed 21.5 and that almost killed the class. Guys were cranking up the timing more and more to the point that there was a huge discrepancy in the competitors speed, that it destroyed the quality of racing - no two cars on the track had even close to similar speeds. Most of the guys just quit because of it. Guys were going so fast, they couldn't drive it or worse yet, they would collect three racers in the sweeper and take them off the track!

The short of it is;

We desperatly want to allow brushless for all the obvious reasons, but need some help / advice in how to maintain the qaulity of racing silver cans offer. Looking for ideas from anyone...I suspect we will have to deal with the brushless question sooner than later.
Interesting.. because where I race, I am the only one with a 21.5 brushless, everyone else runs silvercan and they were all walking past me on the back straight that's why I ended up advancing the timing past the motors hash marks.

The only option I see would be to spec a brushless motor that doesn't have timing adjustment on the end bell.
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:12 AM   #1367
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Just to clarify, I race in Omaha every Wednesday evening.
For those races, we run 21.5 brushless. Blinky ESCs and and the motor timing must be left at the factory out-of-the-box setting. It's very close racing and a lot of fun. We don't send someone home if they show up with a silver can, but we encourage them to change if they plan to run weekly.

For the "HobbyPLEX Winter Carpet Onroad Series" (which is a series of 5 races over the winter) Tim is allowing silver cans as well as 21.5. This must be where howardcano ran last weekend.

Since I don't run in that series, I don't know what Tim's going to do to even out the playing field.
Yes, Sunday's winter series race. The odds of me making it on a Wednesday night are nil, as it's a four hour drive.

Last year I just turned down my throttle until I couldn't turn the fastest lap in each heat. It was a bunch more fun than lapping everybody, so I'll probably do it again.

I would fully support going only brushless, as long as there is an RPM limit. Otherwise it's just a matter of finding the 21.5 with the highest RPM at the factory timing setting.

I can provide the tachometer at the series races to measure brushless motor RPM while the motor is in the car.

My apologies here, as this is sort of off subject.
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:21 AM   #1368
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What motor do you like?

I think guys were cranking the timing past the factory maximum - they were pretty fast.
I'll get anything that doesn't have mechanical stops on the timing adjustment. (And used, since I'm cheap!) The Novak Ballistic comes to mind (as Raman uses), but there may be others. Advancing the timing far enough to get the same top speed as a silver can will reduce the efficiency and power output, but it should still be quite sufficient. However, it is very hard on the ESC, as the ripple currents go way up, so one needs to be careful.
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Old 11-13-2013, 10:07 AM   #1369
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Originally Posted by howardcano View Post
I'll get anything that doesn't have mechanical stops on the timing adjustment. (And used, since I'm cheap!) The Novak Ballistic comes to mind (as Raman uses), but there may be others. Advancing the timing far enough to get the same top speed as a silver can will reduce the efficiency and power output, but it should still be quite sufficient. However, it is very hard on the ESC, as the ripple currents go way up, so one needs to be careful.
I have the Revtec, the one on the TCS allowed motor list. If I leave the timing at 40 Deg., which is factory max, it's the perfect amount of speed and and heat.
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Old 11-13-2013, 10:18 AM   #1370
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Originally Posted by howardcano View Post
I'll get anything that doesn't have mechanical stops on the timing adjustment. (And used, since I'm cheap!) The Novak Ballistic comes to mind (as Raman uses), but there may be others. Advancing the timing far enough to get the same top speed as a silver can will reduce the efficiency and power output, but it should still be quite sufficient. However, it is very hard on the ESC, as the ripple currents go way up, so one needs to be careful.
Since its a 21.5 I can't imagine it being very hard on ESC's. I run a Novak Edge and had little issues.
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Old 11-13-2013, 10:39 AM   #1371
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Since its a 21.5 I can't imagine it being very hard on ESC's. I run a Novak Edge and had little issues.
I'll also be using the Edge, since I have one.

21.5 motors aren't hard on ESC's until the timing is really advanced. At 90 degrees, any ESC will go poof. And the motor won't turn at all! So I won't do that.

If I get a Ballistic, I'll measure how far the timing must be advanced to get the same kV rating as the TCS-spec silvercan, and post the result. Or perhaps you can do this, and save me some effort? I'd appreciate it!
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Old 11-13-2013, 10:54 AM   #1372
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I'll also be using the Edge, since I have one.

21.5 motors aren't hard on ESC's until the timing is really advanced. At 90 degrees, any ESC will go poof. And the motor won't turn at all! So I won't do that.

If I get a Ballistic, I'll measure how far the timing must be advanced to get the same kV rating as the TCS-spec silvercan, and post the result. Or perhaps you can do this, and save me some effort? I'd appreciate it!
My cars are all in storage at the moment.. But I can tell you it wasn't 90 degrees.. Yikes. I think the Novak timing sticker goes upto 45 degrees. The max I went was another 15 degrees.. So 60 if my memory serves well is more than enough
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Old 11-28-2013, 07:06 PM   #1373
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I would assume that they are talking about these red anodized lower shock mounts.

Hi, kukride.what's the weight on the brass clamps
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Old 11-29-2013, 09:12 AM   #1374
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Hi, kwkride.what's the weight on the brass clamps
They are each 12 grams
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Old 12-01-2013, 01:16 AM   #1375
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Ok, never messed with a M06, but I just bought the "R" model and need to know about shock length. It's going to be used on high traction carpet and I know about the oring trick for the other minis, but this R has be baffeled. I know it has the two different length shocks for front and back, but the rear hop up mounts makes be wonder if I change any length. So can I get some thought on it? Thank you.

Fuzz
Just build it per the manual, use the longer rods on the back shocks and fit the 2 black o-rings on the outside of the shock. This is the opposite of the "trick" on the FWD cars, on them they sit too high so you put the o-rings inside the shocks to limit the droop and give a low ride height. The 06 rear end runs low anyway and we find that if you run 50D tyres on the high bite carpet the rear end tends to bottom out and you loose traction badly when powering out of corners. Reason for this is being rear drive it exacerbates weight transfer/rear end squat to the already rear-biased back end and the car is basically sledging on the chassis plate. Running something like a Pit Shimizu 60D Soft slick (PS-0452) will sort this out. I don't recommend their Super Soft though, it's a fantastic tyre gripwise and makes the car so easy to drive its unreal but the inner walls on mine came apart after 2 heats as they're so thin which is pretty poor.
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Old 12-01-2013, 01:18 AM   #1376
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I'm foreseeing (wishfully) an M06 release with the Alfa Romeo 4C. It would be a perfect fit, rear wheel drive, super light weigh small sports car. Perfect for an M chassis
It'd never happen. Look at the rear overhang on a 1:1 4C to see why, it's basically hasn't got one so there'd be nowhere to put the motor, it'd have to be stuck out of the rear of the shell which would just be wrong.

Now a DeLorean on the other hand...
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Old 12-03-2013, 05:47 AM   #1377
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Hy guys,

some update on my personal carpet setup.

last weekend , 1st carpet TCS was held in our local Series.
M-Chassis was the class with most entries

The Carpet had a very high grip level , and only non-oil additives were allowed. ( SXT 3.0, Mighty Gripper V3...)
After struggling the whole training day and the first two Qulifiying Heats for finding the right setup (i had so much understeering) , following setup made me smile

M-06R :
Front:
Type A (glued on the side)
SXT 3.0 Additive on the inner side of the Tire (for 20 minutes)
tires not heated
300 oil
blue springs
no sway bar

Rear:
Gear Diff
S-Grip (full Additive for 30 minutes)
400 oil
Red Springs
no sway bar
carbon Damper Stay - dampers on the outest position (straight up)
AND:
Red HUBS mounted reverse !!! Left on the right side and right on the left side- for nearly 0 degree on the rear.

And guys believe me, that was really awesome.
fastest lap times and fastest heat.

finally ended up in 2nd position, because i lost a tire in the finals *g* because it was not tightened strong enough -> i feel ashamed , because i was in first position with about 6-7 seconds ahead of the second one...

nevertheless i was that happy, because i knew the car is so fantastic , as long as the setup works fine...

maybe this may help one of you
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Old 12-03-2013, 08:17 AM   #1378
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Aitutaki congrats, what wheelbase and body? Hope there are videos

I agree with the gear diff
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Old 12-03-2013, 12:48 PM   #1379
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Congrats to you also from me, Aitutaki!

For sure we want to know every detail of your setup.
Spring set from the R-Kit I guess?
Shock length/ground clearance?

Last time I raced TCS 2 years ago, only Type A Slicks were allowed. Are you allowed to use M-grips in Austria?
Tough job you did chasing the FWDs, too bad with the tire.
What motor did you run, and which battery?

Our spec racing class changes to Lipo next year, so Im just thinking about taking the M06 back out and try to bring the power of the Lipo on the carpet.
Also thinking about new tire choices, so Ill probably have to try your mixed setup with Slicks and Radials!

Keep on the good work,
Br Matthias
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Old 12-03-2013, 02:51 PM   #1380
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Originally Posted by rccartips View Post
Aitutaki congrats, what wheelbase and body? Hope there are videos

I agree with the gear diff
thanks
but i am sorry, no chance to make some movies during driving
i will ask some other driver to make a video next race in january...
but i attached a photo before starting the finals

and i switched from m-05 ball diff to gear diff during finding the right setup. there is no need for balldiff on a high grip carpet track i guess..

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Originally Posted by ruebiracer View Post
Congrats to you also from me, Aitutaki!

For sure we want to know every detail of your setup.
Spring set from the R-Kit I guess?
Shock length/ground clearance?

Last time I raced TCS 2 years ago, only Type A Slicks were allowed. Are you allowed to use M-grips in Austria?
Tough job you did chasing the FWDs, too bad with the tire.
What motor did you run, and which battery?

Br Matthias
thanks also
kit springs (the black ones) you are right.
shocks are build as mentioned in the manual.the length depends on the ground clearance.
clearance : about 5mm, sorry can't remember in detail...

yes in Austria , normally Type A are allowed. but also kit tires are allowed, and all kits have different tires, thats why all tamiya radials are allowed too (standard , Ms and S Grips)
this is made to increase the number of racers in this class ...
and personally i think this is a step in the right direction...
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