R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

    Hide Wikipost
Old 10-28-2016, 12:43 PM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: 1/12 forum
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: fenton06
This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

Print Wikipost

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-09-2005, 03:27 PM   #14071
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 328
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM
We need some details to get a real picture of whats happening...

Post you replies when you can and we should be able to help you out.

Oh. Sorry about not providing enough info

here's my setup:

RC12L4
5 degree block
2 caster shims forward
Camber approx -1.5
Toe = 0
T-Bar: AE Thin one
Damper Disc lube: nothing or bushing oil
Tyres: Jaco front purple, rear pink
No damping goo on king pin
Dual Rate: 70-75%
Steering Exp: -40%
Front Springs: 0.22
Motor: V2 9 double
CA on tyre sidewall

I'm running the same setup on the outdoor track and also indoor carpet track
Hope i didn't miss anything. Car definitely handle better when tyre diameter is smaller but i don't have access to a tyre lathe so i can't do much about it

btw, another question, if i make the car handles perfectly on the outdoor track, then when i go to race on carpet, would it be better off if i don't change any settings at all compare with i just change the T-bar to a thicker one? At the moment, my car still really like to fishtail when i full throttle at a carpet track but it never happens when i race at outdoor. So trying to find out what i can do to fix it. (already losen the diff a bit)
yellow15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2005, 03:31 PM   #14072
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 814
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by yellow15
anyone?
There are dozen's of things you could do to remedy over steer coming out of the corners.

The general rule of thumb is to do one of two things:

Stiffen up the front suspension or...

Soften the rear suspension.

It could also be something as simple as turning down the steering on your transmitter. We just raced last weekend and as the day got longer and the temperature went up, I had to keep turning my steering down. As the day cooled off in the afternoon, I had to turn my steering back up.

Try putting on stiffer springs in the front and increase the caster slightly. If that makes it better but it is still not comfortable, then try putting on a softer center spring on the shock.

There are a bunch of other things to try. Lighter shock oil. Thinner T bar. Removing the center screw on the T bar. Softer rear tires. Increasing the rear track.

For the front, firmer front tires. No traction compound on the front tires. You just have to start playing with the setup keeping in mind the two rules stated above. Also remember that a loose car is a fast car, if you can keep it between the lines!!
Crashby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2005, 03:45 PM   #14073
Tech Champion
 
AdrianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 5,914
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

For Asphalt:

RC12L4
5 degree block
2 caster shims forward
Change to one in front and one back
Camber approx -1.5
Change to 1 deg then check tire wear you need to set this so your tires wear flat
Toe = 0
This should be ok. I run 0.5 toe out
T-Bar: AE Thin one
This is good. I run all 3 pod mounting screws with a green center shock spring
Damper Disc lube:
Try some diff lube. Get some teflon tape and put it on both sides fo the top pod plate. I bet this is 90% of your problem. I think you are under damped.
Tyres: Jaco front purple, rear pink
Perfect
No damping goo on king pin
Try some Trinity "Red Stuff"
Dual Rate: 70-75%
Should be less than this. Sounds like you are pushing too
Steering Exp: -40%
I usually run this linear. Expo can mask handling problem. You car should be smooth on center on its own without expo.
Front Springs: 0.22
I run .020"
Motor: V2 9 double
CA on tyre sidewall
This is really bad on asphalt. Only do this on carpet. This may be a big part of the problem.

On Asphalt you should use thin suntan lotion as traction compound or Trinity Tire Tweak. Sauce full rear and 2/3 of the inside of the fronts.
__________________
Adrian Martinez
What I run: Schumacher Mi5/Associated RC10R5.1/Associated RC12R5.2/Futaba/HobbyWing/Team EA Motorsports/BSR Racing
Where I run: Florida Indoor R/C Complex/Thunder Racing/Florida On Road State Series
AdrianM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2005, 04:50 PM   #14074
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 328
Default

Thanks Crashby and AdrianM.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM
CA on tyre sidewall
This is really bad on asphalt. Only do this on carpet. This may be a big part of the problem.
Why is it bad on asphalt?

I forgot to mention no tracking compound is allowed
yellow15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2005, 04:53 PM   #14075
Tech Master
 
Hyperform Racing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 1,195
Default

Hey guys, our long awaited Hyperform 12 chassis are finally available. I will be posting better pics etc as soon as possible on the website. I'll also post the pics here for you all to look at. To all those who expressed interest, thank you for your patience on this one.
__________________
Hyperform Racing
www.Hyperform-Racing.com
info@Hyperform-Racing.com
(978) 416-2572
Hyperform Racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2005, 05:46 PM   #14076
Tech Regular
 
rcshark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bradenton, Fl.
Posts: 286
Send a message via Yahoo to rcshark
Default

hello guys i have a 12l4 or something like that. i dont realy know what i have ,It was a trade.the guy that i traded with set the track record and it has a broken rear chassis. im looking for help with it to find out what i have?
also it would be cool to find out if i should go total L4 or leave it the way it is!
it has a spring loaded t-plate. meaning it has the ceter pivot with a spring on each side of the pivot that the shock connects the chassis from rear to front.
it has the hardwear of the L4 and the chassis of a L3 but dont know how to tune the t-plate springs and shock. it also has two twick screws on the outer side of the springs of the t-bar.

my set up is black spring on shock and black springs on the t-plate and im going to the .02 springs front and everything else that you do on the l4 like the pink rear tires and the front purple tires with the 5 blocks and the shimes on each side!

if there is anyway to let me know what prings to run on the rear or what system this is or who could tell me somehting fill free to email me! and i will give you my # or call you!

Last edited by rcshark; 08-09-2005 at 06:02 PM. Reason: added pic
rcshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2005, 07:09 PM   #14077
Tech Champion
 
AdrianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 5,914
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by yellow15
Thanks Crashby and AdrianM.



Why is it bad on asphalt?

I forgot to mention no tracking compound is allowed
The CA on the sidewall is there to reduce side bite. This is good on carpet to prevent digging and traction rolling in corners but bad on asphalt. On asphalt it will make your car push if the fronts are ca'd or loose if the rears are ca'd.

Where are you racing? I have never heard of traction compounds being completely outlawed. Usually you use an odorless compound or a completely benign traction compound like suntan lotion.

If no traction compounds are allowed you might want to try platinum compound rear tires for more grip.
__________________
Adrian Martinez
What I run: Schumacher Mi5/Associated RC10R5.1/Associated RC12R5.2/Futaba/HobbyWing/Team EA Motorsports/BSR Racing
Where I run: Florida Indoor R/C Complex/Thunder Racing/Florida On Road State Series
AdrianM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2005, 07:21 PM   #14078
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 328
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM
Where are you racing? I have never heard of traction compounds being completely outlawed. Usually you use an odorless compound or a completely benign traction compound like suntan lotion.
Thanks. I'm racing in New Zealand. No traction compound of any sort is allowed in any class in my club
yellow15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2005, 08:20 PM   #14079
Tech Master
 
Hyperform Racing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 1,195
Default

Give me a call tomorrow afternoon sometime and we can chat about your chassis. My number is on my website. If you can email me a few pics, that would help a bunch also...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcshark
hello guys i have a 12l4 or something like that. i dont realy know what i have ,It was a trade.the guy that i traded with set the track record and it has a broken rear chassis. im looking for help with it to find out what i have?
also it would be cool to find out if i should go total L4 or leave it the way it is!
it has a spring loaded t-plate. meaning it has the ceter pivot with a spring on each side of the pivot that the shock connects the chassis from rear to front.
it has the hardwear of the L4 and the chassis of a L3 but dont know how to tune the t-plate springs and shock. it also has two twick screws on the outer side of the springs of the t-bar.

my set up is black spring on shock and black springs on the t-plate and im going to the .02 springs front and everything else that you do on the l4 like the pink rear tires and the front purple tires with the 5 blocks and the shimes on each side!

if there is anyway to let me know what prings to run on the rear or what system this is or who could tell me somehting fill free to email me! and i will give you my # or call you!
__________________
Hyperform Racing
www.Hyperform-Racing.com
info@Hyperform-Racing.com
(978) 416-2572
Hyperform Racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2005, 12:27 PM   #14080
Tech Adept
 
Sokool's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sarasota, FL
Posts: 109
Send a message via AIM to Sokool Send a message via Yahoo to Sokool
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM
Get some tweak screws and down load a RC12L4 setup. Use Trinity Red stuff in the damper tubes.
No luck on the setup sheets cant seem to find any for asphalt.... Was just looking for a little more steering mid corner.
Sokool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2005, 12:51 PM   #14081
Tech Champion
 
AdrianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 5,914
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sokool
No luck on the setup sheets cant seem to find any for asphalt.... Was just looking for a little more steering mid corner.
This is Mike Lufaso's website:

http://home.sc.rr.com/mlufaso/rc/12l4/index.html

There is a huge tuning section and dozens of L4 setups there. FYI, all the L3 setups work on the L4. The L4 has some improvements but all the settings are pretty much the same for both cars.
__________________
Adrian Martinez
What I run: Schumacher Mi5/Associated RC10R5.1/Associated RC12R5.2/Futaba/HobbyWing/Team EA Motorsports/BSR Racing
Where I run: Florida Indoor R/C Complex/Thunder Racing/Florida On Road State Series
AdrianM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2005, 04:39 PM   #14082
Tech Adept
 
Sokool's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sarasota, FL
Posts: 109
Send a message via AIM to Sokool Send a message via Yahoo to Sokool
Default

One last question... Do the AE T-bars fit the T-fource?
Sokool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2005, 04:50 PM   #14083
Tech Champion
 
Kevin K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: In a land of mini-mighty mental giants
Posts: 8,755
Trader Rating: 32 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to Kevin K Send a message via Yahoo to Kevin K
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sokool
One last question... Do the AE T-bars fit the T-fource?
Yes they do......
__________________
2013 USVTA World Champion of the World
MOTIV RC presents the Midwest All-Star Carpet Series....14th year running 2016/17!!!
USVTA National Championship....check it out!!!
Im only responsible for what I say NOT what you understand.
Kevin K is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2005, 06:48 PM   #14084
Tech Champion
 
AdrianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 5,914
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

I have been running 34/96 with a Reedy QM19 and 1.85 tires. What would be a good ratio to start with when running a Trinity C2?
__________________
Adrian Martinez
What I run: Schumacher Mi5/Associated RC10R5.1/Associated RC12R5.2/Futaba/HobbyWing/Team EA Motorsports/BSR Racing
Where I run: Florida Indoor R/C Complex/Thunder Racing/Florida On Road State Series
AdrianM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2005, 07:15 PM   #14085
Tech Fanatic
 
crimson eagle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Nor Cal
Posts: 841
Send a message via ICQ to crimson eagle
Default

Adrian,

As I understand these motors you will need to go down three or four teeth from the reedy quad mag. OD will probably be able to give you a more accurate answer.

Sokool,

I have been running my t-fource for the last few weeks, I am having some pretty good success, I'm running the thin ae t-bar on asphalt with dbl pinks up front and greens on tha back.

Chris.
crimson eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New to the forum mig rod Electric Off-Road 1 01-05-2008 05:23 PM
hi i need help and im new to the forum racer4 Rookie Zone 4 01-21-2007 02:37 PM
Why is this forum listed under the On Road Forum? sport10 Onroad Nitro Engine Zone 0 01-11-2007 08:06 AM
Forum Changes... futureal Wisconsin & Illinois Racing 3 10-28-2002 09:26 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 11:01 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0