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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 04-12-2005, 02:22 PM   #12556
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Quote:
Originally posted by jumbo360
www.teamirsrc.com
www.xtremercracing.com

They got some reciever batteries but I would recommend so light bulb batteries.
come here andd tell me next time, lol. no need to post it.
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Old 04-12-2005, 03:19 PM   #12557
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Default Re: Re: new to 1:12

Thanks very much for your reply Trips and Crashby. Your reply is very informative and clear. And i have a few questions.. sorry it probably sound stupid but i really know nothing about 1:12

Quote:
I happen to like cars without t-bars. I find them to be more consistent from one run to the next, and less fragile than t-bar cars
What is T-bar? is it part of the chassis? and what is a "link" car? what's the difference between them? is the RC12L4 or Yok a link car?

Quote:
I'd keep a supply of .020 and .022 front springs on hand, maybe a few .024 as well. I doubt you'll want to go softer than .0209 on asphalt, and I don't think you'll need to go harder than .022, but having the .024 on hand just in case wouldn't hurt. Front springs are cheap.
a supply of .020/.022...etc springs? that's the suspension springs right? Do they wear out fast or why do i need to get a few of them?
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Old 04-12-2005, 04:16 PM   #12558
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The T-bar is a part of the rear suspension on some cars (like the l4, yoke, corally, t fource).

Here is a picture of the L4 which has a T-bar, it's the white plate under the rear shock.

A link car has a different rear suspension.
Here is a picutre of the carpet knife, which has a link style rear suspension.

With A T-bar suspension the T-bar acts like a sort of spring, but a link car has 2 springs, each on one side to to that.
I guess the pictures say enough...
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Old 04-12-2005, 04:27 PM   #12559
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I just thought I would make one more quick guest appearance over here.

I got this suggestion from a racer on another message board and thought I would bounce this idea off you guys:

"Its like advertising a race for 1970's. pacers..yeah there will be some who will have interest but how many gonna tow them to Texas! to race?

I think not. bowy.

US PanCar Guy.. heres what you should do.

Look throughout the US and have areas where poklep actually run these cars./. then have a local race there.. go to the poeple and create a series.. like the rc pro dirts series or TCS.. then have a nationals after that. Just haveing a antional champs don't mean anything.

You need to build on local racer scenes first then have a big meet in the middle.

You should call your texas race us pan car champs series race #1 then have one or two on the west coast , central and east and south east. each race has a winner and runners up. you build momentum that way to lead up to a nationals.

Without local support in different areas it makes no sense for anyone to go that far for a club race.

Take a look at the rcpro sereis, TCS or HPI Challenge.. then you understand."

In short, what do you think of "The Road to the US Pan Car Championships" There would be regionals across the country over the next year with a big final race as opposed to just having one big race in a location that not everyone can get to?
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Old 04-12-2005, 05:01 PM   #12560
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Quote:
Originally posted by JDXray
what are the size of the cells for reciever packs? Where to maybe get some cells?

Thanks

Jon
Cells for servo packs are 150-160 Mah NMHD. You can find them at www.cheapbatterypacks.com
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Old 04-12-2005, 06:23 PM   #12561
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Default New to 1/12th

I'm looking to start racing 1/12th scale on a rough asphalt track. What chassis, servo, tires, and body will be the best suited for my application?

Thanks in advance

-Chad
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Old 04-12-2005, 07:54 PM   #12562
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Default Re: New to 1/12th

Quote:
Originally posted by Pro4Capece
I'm looking to start racing 1/12th scale on a rough asphalt track. What chassis, servo, tires, and body will be the best suited for my application?

Thanks in advance

-Chad
There's no one "best" combination of car and parts from what is available today. Most of the kits available are designed for carpet racing but are usable/adaptable for asphalt. Look at the AE 12L4, CRC T-Fource, or one of the conversion kits, like the Quad 12, IRS Rug Rat, or BMI.
There are some cars meant for asphalt, such as the Yokomo YRX12 WE, or the Kawada (can't recommend the Kawada since parts availability is nill). The Hara 12 conversion kit is designed for asphalt and is really narrow, it could be a good car outdoors.
If you like the CEFX C12, they have a thinner, wider chassis available for running on asphalt.
See? Hardly any choices at all!

Servo: KO 949, hands down. Also consider Futaba 9650 or 9602, or the old standby the Airtronics 94145.
Most people use Pink rears and Purple fronts as a start.
For the body- Parma Speed 8, Protoform Speed 12, CEFX LMP 900,and so on...
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Old 04-12-2005, 07:58 PM   #12563
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thanks odpurple, I'll most likely go with the L4, unless someone suggest otherwise.
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Old 04-12-2005, 08:03 PM   #12564
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pro4Capece
thanks odpurple, I'll most likely go with the L4, unless someone suggest otherwise.
That's a really good choice. A good solid car that works on asphalt, and if you want something new later all of the conversion kits are 12L4 based.
I forgot one: there's a new Hirosaka conversion for the 12L4 from Yokomo that looks good, and is designed for asphalt (it's the car that won the world's in Fla.) should be available soon. I tink I'll try it myself (hell, what's one more car?!!?!)
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Old 04-12-2005, 08:04 PM   #12565
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OD is correct. There are so many choices out there. You have to answer yourself which car would do better on asphalt. Like OD said, the yokomo is a great choice. It has a thinner chassis that helps with asphalt. I ran the car for quite sometime and loved it until I got myself a rugrat conversion. So far the rugrat has been great but a little more time is needed with it since it has damper tubes. The 12l4 is a great choice. Have fun running 1/12th.
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Old 04-12-2005, 09:04 PM   #12566
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Default Re: Re: Re: new to 1:12

Quote:
Originally posted by yellow15
Thanks very much for your reply Trips and Crashby. Your reply is very informative and clear. And i have a few questions.. sorry it probably sound stupid but i really know nothing about 1:12



What is T-bar? is it part of the chassis? and what is a "link" car? what's the difference between them? is the RC12L4 or Yok a link car?



a supply of .020/.022...etc springs? that's the suspension springs right? Do they wear out fast or why do i need to get a few of them?
  • T-Bar
    Tekin was on the money with his reply to you. I'd like to go into a bit of detail on why I prefer the link cars. A T-Bar car uses the "springiness" of the fiberglass t-bar as part of its suspension. They usually use a softer shock spring because of the springiness in the t-bar. After a few runs (sometimes VERY few if you do some crashing) the t-bar gets soft and loses its springiness. As the t-bar ages, it gets softer and softer. The car's handling changes subtly as the t-bar ages. The only way to avoid this is to replace the t-bar frequently. I used to replace them after two or maybe three runs. It is'nt a huge hassle to replace a t-bar, but given the amount of between-run maintenance, who needs one more thing to do? The link car's rear pods are hinged with pivot balls. The only spring supporting the rear end is the shock spring. A shock spring is much more consistent than a fiberglass plate. It doesn't change from one run to the next. The link car does take some more fiddling initially to set up the rear links, but once they're set, they generally stay set.
  • Springs
    Yes, the .020, .022, and .024 were referring to front end springs. They do wear out, and it's a good idea to keep an eye on them as they can also compress and take a "set" where they become shorter than when new. A hard hit will sometimes comress a front end spring significantly where the car may feel "tweaked" for the rest of the run. At $2 a pair, I replace them often and keep a good supply on hand. The heavier the spring, the less steering typically. Of the three I mentioned, .020 is lightest, .024 heaviest. They are available down to .018 and .016, but it's rare that you'd use something that light on asphalt.
By the way, I just wanted to mention that that track is absolutely gorgeous. I wish we had facilities like that around here.
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Last edited by Trips; 04-13-2005 at 08:16 AM.
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Old 04-12-2005, 10:00 PM   #12567
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: new to 1:12

Quote:
Originally posted by Trips
After a few runs (sometimes VERY few if you do some crashing) the t-bar gets soft and loses its springiness. As the t-bar ages, it gets softer and softer. The car's handling changes subtly as the t-bar ages. The only way to avoid this is to replace the t-bar frequently. I used to replace them after two or maybe three runs.
Wow replace them every 2-3 runs!!! I checked the T-bar is like 4-5$ each so it definitely isn't cheap to maintain?? is it really necessary to replace them so frequently? it's just for club racing.

Quote:
[*]Springs
At $2 a pair, I replace them often and keep a good supply on hand.
So by "often", you mean like every 2-3 runs? or more like every 10 runs or every 50 runs or so??
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Old 04-12-2005, 10:01 PM   #12568
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: new to 1:12

Quote:
Originally posted by Trips
[list][*]T-Bar
Tekin was on the money with his reply to you. I'd like to go into a bit of detail on why I prefer the link cars. A T-Bar car uses the "springiness" of the fiberglass t-bar as part of its suspension. They usually use a softer shock spring because of the springiness in the t-bar. After a few runs (sometimes VERY few if you do some crashing) the t-bar gets soft and loses its springiness. As the t-bar ages, it gets softer and softer. The car's handling changes subtly as the t-bar ages. The only way to avoid this is to replace the t-bar frequently. I used to replace them after two or maybe three runs. It is'nt a huge hassle to replace a t-bar, but given the amount of between-run maintenance, who needs one more thing to do? The link car's rear pods are hinged with pivot balls. The only spring supporting the rear end is the shock spring. A shock spring is much more consistent than a fiberglass plate. It doesn't change from one run to the next. The link car does take some more fiddling initially to set up the rear links, but once they're set, they generally stay set.
[*]Springs
Yes, the .020, .022, and .024 were referring to front end springs. They do wear out, and it's a good idea to keep an eye on them as they can also compress and take a "set" where they become shorter than when new. A hard hit will sometimes comress a front end spring significantly where the car may feel "tweaked" for the rest of the run. At $2 a pair, I replace them often and keep a good supply on hand. The heavier the spring, the less steering typically. Of the three I mentioned, .020 is lightest, .024 heaviest. They are available down to .018 and .016, but it's rare that you'd use something that light on asphalt.

By the way, I just wanted to mention that that track is absolutely gorgeous. I wish we had facilities like that around here.
[



B]The only spring supporting the rear end is the shock spring.[/B]

did you forget about the two side srings that set the tweak of the rear? these degrade as the front springs do also.....without them you have a side side to side flopper.
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Old 04-12-2005, 10:26 PM   #12569
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Fast,

I have only replaced one broken thicker t-bar on my two 12L3/12L4 cars over the past six months. Was rearended by a TC car during practice on a carpet track.

As far as getting weak, is the thinner t-bar (for asphalt) what you are referring to.

Or am I missing something here?
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Old 04-12-2005, 10:30 PM   #12570
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: new to 1:12

Quote:
Originally posted by yellow15
Wow replace them every 2-3 runs!!! I checked the T-bar is like 4-5$ each so it definitely isn't cheap to maintain?? is it really necessary to replace them so frequently? it's just for club racing.


So by "often", you mean like every 2-3 runs? or more like every 10 runs or every 50 runs or so??

Don't worry about the t-bar, I ran the same one for many races and couldn't tell the difference. On the other hand, they break often enough that you will probably replace it before it wears out. I'm refering to the .063 t-bar which is what you want to use on asphalt.

I've found that .020 springs compress after a race or two, if I shim them to take out the slop they stay ok for awhile. .022 and .024 springs don't collapse so much as .020s.
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