R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

    Hide Wikipost
Old 10-28-2016, 12:43 PM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: 1/12 forum
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: fenton06
This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

Print Wikipost

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-01-2005, 09:38 PM   #11476
Tech Master
 
dakrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: 96th ABW
Posts: 1,581
Default

blake, u can only run so much amps on a certain wire size, i think i remember reading something about that at cheapbatterypacks.com . currently im using 14g. depends on your application, if ur running modified then u need to use thicker wires like. not really sure though.
dakrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 09:57 PM   #11477
Tech Elite
 
dr_hfuhuhurr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Westchester, NY
Posts: 4,422
Trader Rating: 69 (100%+)
Default

I remember seeing several of the pros running smaller than 14 with mod in 1/12th so I'm sure I'd be fine for stock.

Blake
__________________
"There is a fine line between hobby and mental illness. Which side are you on?"

“Life is hard; it's harder if you're stupid.” - John Wayne
dr_hfuhuhurr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 09:58 PM   #11478
Tech Master
 
dakrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: 96th ABW
Posts: 1,581
Default

16g is good for 25-75 amps
dakrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 10:20 PM   #11479
Tech Champion
 
Still Bill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 7,016
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by dakrat
16g is good for 25-75 amps
Hi dakrat,

How are you coming up with 25-75 amps for the 16g wire? Is that solid core wire or stranded?

I am looking at some electrical wire calculators on the internet; but, haven't been able to find a definitive answer...yet.
__________________
Constantly evolving CRC WGT and WGT-R/T...Carpet & Asphalt...All thanks to Team CRC.
Still Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 10:33 PM   #11480
Tech Elite
 
fatdoggy's Avatar
R/C Tech Charter Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: MD USA
Posts: 3,642
Default

dr_hfuhuhurr - Look to the slotcar section of your local track. TQ Leadwire, it's copper wire either in a clear or orange insulation. I think it's 18awg; it works great for stock 12th(very flexible). I hav'nt seen it run in mod, it might be able to handle it?
fatdoggy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 10:38 PM   #11481
Tech Champion
 
Still Bill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 7,016
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by fatdoggy
dr_hfuhuhurr - Look to the slotcar section of your local track. TQ Leadwire, it's copper wire either in a clear or orange insulation. I think it's 16awg; it works great for 12th(very flexible). I havn't seen it run in mod, but it should be able to handle it.
What shop in California still has a slot car section???

I do use 16awg on my 12th stock; but, have been wondering if it will handle mod motors.
__________________
Constantly evolving CRC WGT and WGT-R/T...Carpet & Asphalt...All thanks to Team CRC.
Still Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 10:39 PM   #11482
Tech Champion
 
Kevin K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: In a land of mini-mighty mental giants
Posts: 8,754
Trader Rating: 32 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to Kevin K Send a message via Yahoo to Kevin K
Default

The Novak guys have stated that when you go to smaller guage wire like 16g you will get a little more run time but loose a little punch. The larger size the wire from 16g you will decrease run time but gain punch. Just keep that in mind when you go to a smaller guage wire.
__________________
2013 USVTA World Champion of the World
MOTIV RC presents the Midwest All-Star Carpet Series....14th year running 2016/17!!!
USVTA National Championship....check it out!!!
Im only responsible for what I say NOT what you understand.
Kevin K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 10:46 PM   #11483
Tech Elite
 
odpurple's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 2,187
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by fatdoggy
dr_hfuhuhurr - Look to the slotcar section of your local track. TQ Leadwire, it's copper wire either in a clear or orange insulation. I think it's 16awg; it works great for 12th(very flexible). I havn't seen it run in mod, but it should be able to handle it.
Slot car lead wire is 18 guage. It'll probably work but I don't know of anybody using it; it's definately not for modified. I use it (18ga) for wiring caps and schottky boards. You can buy 18 guage wire from cheapbatterypacks.com much cheaper than slot car lead wire.

You can get pretty good 16ga wire at cheapbatterypacks.com also. The 16ga with the thinnest jacket is from Castle Creations. It's a little stiffer than some but works well.

16ga handles mod motors just fine, no difference in punch or anything else (for 1/12th)
odpurple is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 10:51 PM   #11484
Tech Fanatic
 
primusblowsgoat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Pingree Grove, IL
Posts: 987
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to primusblowsgoat Send a message via Yahoo to primusblowsgoat
Default

on the topic of wire....

Recently at work a snow plow destroyed an extension cord i was using to heat the block of one of my trucks. So me being thrifty i took the thing inside, and spent alot of the day at work ripping the orange cover off and taking the wire, ended up with around 10 ft of white black and green, it seems pretty flexible but i havent used it yet.
__________________
Schumacher Racing
Schumacher Cat SX2
Schumacher Cougar SV
primusblowsgoat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2005, 11:45 PM   #11485
Tech Champion
 
Still Bill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 7,016
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default Wire

Still no definitive answers about the wire issue...Looking to the internet.
__________________
Constantly evolving CRC WGT and WGT-R/T...Carpet & Asphalt...All thanks to Team CRC.

Last edited by JRX-S Bill; 03-01-2005 at 11:55 PM.
Still Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2005, 12:03 AM   #11486
Tech Champion
 
Still Bill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 7,016
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

Using "wire gauge" as my search on the Internet, I found three charts indicating amp limits for 12/14/16 AWG wires; but, feel that voltage applied and length of wire should be taken into account. The info from the three charts follows:

------------"A" "B" "C"

16 AWG @ 13A 15A 22A

14 AWG @ 17A 25A 32A

12 AWG @ 23A 40A 41A

Hoping that chart "C" is more correct than the others...he, he...

By the way, how many amps can four NIMH cells output anyway?
__________________
Constantly evolving CRC WGT and WGT-R/T...Carpet & Asphalt...All thanks to Team CRC.
Still Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2005, 12:24 AM   #11487
Moderator
 
Pro ten Holland's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Druten/Holland (Europe)
Posts: 1,658
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

At what voltage were these amp numbers rated? i.e. at 200volts, 20 amps is a whole lot, at 2volts it isn't. I think you should be fine with 18 to 16AWG wire. Just trie and feel how warm the wires are after a few minutes. If they are sizzling hot you better go up a notch.
A thinner wire has more electrical resistance, so it will not let current through as easily, and it will heat up faster. The resistance is not only determined by wire thickness and lenght, but also by the properties of the material used. Copper has more resistance per inch of material than for example silver, but less than iron. So make sure you use the best quality of wire you can find, and make sure you keep the wiring as short as possible.
For very short instances, a battery should be able to put out more than 80amps. It's actually not the momentary current that causes the problem, it's the average current during a run. This is because a wire can't heat up as fast as the current can change.
__________________
http://www.rc-lemans.de/
Pro ten Holland is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2005, 12:33 AM   #11488
Tech Fanatic
 
crimson eagle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Nor Cal
Posts: 841
Send a message via ICQ to crimson eagle
Default

Pro Ten,

Ampacity is ampacity regardless of the voltage. a wires can only take so many amps. You are correct about temperature and the rest of it but cable ampacity is regardless of voltage.

Bill,

I use 16 gauge on my mod it's no problem. Average amps in 12th is around 20-24 I think.

Chris
crimson eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2005, 12:40 AM   #11489
Moderator
 
Pro ten Holland's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Druten/Holland (Europe)
Posts: 1,658
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

If a wire has as certain resistance, it will heat up according to Ohm's law : Power is Voltage times Currnet. That's what will your make your insulation melt. It is however indeed true that a certain diameter of wire can only carry a certain current, so I partially agree. Just keep the power consumption in mind, because every Watt that is lost in heat in the wires won't make your car go forward.
__________________
http://www.rc-lemans.de/
Pro ten Holland is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2005, 01:58 AM   #11490
Tech Elite
 
theisgroup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 3,191
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

pro ten you are not entirely correct. ohm's law states that voltage = current * resistance. The R(resistance) is what creates the heat and therefore is what causes your wire to melt. not the power.
__________________
yang lai

Team Tamale | Team Tekin | RCAmerica | Speedmerchant | Speedzone RC | EA Motorsports | Ko Propo USA | eXpress Motorsports | Parma/PSE
theisgroup is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New to the forum mig rod Electric Off-Road 1 01-05-2008 05:23 PM
hi i need help and im new to the forum racer4 Rookie Zone 4 01-21-2007 02:37 PM
Why is this forum listed under the On Road Forum? sport10 Onroad Nitro Engine Zone 0 01-11-2007 08:06 AM
Forum Changes... futureal Wisconsin & Illinois Racing 3 10-28-2002 09:26 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 3 (2 members and 1 guests)
antlockyer, kiwiazbro
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 02:57 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0