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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 07-30-2014, 09:54 PM   #41026
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I have a tire question for you guys. When would you choose a hi-rubber content over a low-rubber content? I see some companies have "Medium compound low-rubber content" tires, and also "Medium compound hi-rubber content". I'm guessing the hi-rubber content tires will heat up as the race goes on, maybe getting gummed up?
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Old 07-31-2014, 04:51 AM   #41027
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Originally Posted by EDWARD2003 View Post
Thank you for your response. But, the primary adjustment is to adjust the ride height and secondary is roll center?
That depends on how the spacers are placed. If you are moving the entire spindle up or down to maintain a given ride height as the tires wear, leaving the angle and height of the arms unchanged, then the roll center doesn't change. If the angle or height of the arms change, then the roll center will change.

Changing the roll center on the front of a 1/12 scale car usually gives a relatively minor change in handling, with the spring rate and ride height dominating the effects. Interestingly, changing the reactive caster setting on a "dynamic strut" (upside-down MacPherson strut) has a pretty substantial effect on the roll center, but nobody ever seems to mention it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EDWARD2003 View Post
I also heard going to softer springs will result in more roll. Which is interesting.
That's almost always the case. But if the roll center way is up at the CG, then the chassis won't lean at all during cornering, no matter how soft the springs. (Formula Vees have long used NO springs for roll stiffness on the rear, since the roll center is so high. This is called, appropriately enough, a "zero roll" rear end.)
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:48 AM   #41028
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Hi

Has anyone tried fitting the new Trinity D4 in a 1:12 car? I looks from the pictures that they have excluded som mounting holes that will make it a difficult fit in a standard pod, am i mistaken?
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:29 AM   #41029
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Originally Posted by CanyonCarverR1 View Post
I have a tire question for you guys. When would you choose a hi-rubber content over a low-rubber content? I see some companies have "Medium compound low-rubber content" tires, and also "Medium compound hi-rubber content". I'm guessing the hi-rubber content tires will heat up as the race goes on, maybe getting gummed up?
http://www.brca.org/sites/www.brca.o..._Compounds.pdf
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Old 07-31-2014, 02:23 PM   #41030
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Originally Posted by EDWARD2003 View Post
Thank you for your response. But, the primary adjustment is to adjust the ride height and secondary is roll center?

I also heard going to softer springs will result in more roll. Which is interesting.
If you are running the Yokomo car then maybe those spacers can be used for ride height. On an AE dynamic front end they are never used to adjust ride height. They are only used to set the droop on the front suspension by assuring the correct preload on the spring, or to place under and over the top suspension arm to adjust the roll centre.

Contrary to popular myth, although raising the outer end of the moving suspension does have some impact on the camber change, it is minimal to nothing. The front suspension moves about 1mm during racing on AE20 springs, so a 0.35mm change in the height of the top link when moved through a 1mm arc means the change in camber angle in roll is about two-tenths of bugger all. Softer springs allow more suspension movement so camber change could be altered as much as four-tenths of bugger all!

The change to roll centre by moving the arm up or down has far more impact on the handling. The stiffer you make the front end (higher roll centre) the more grip you will get. If the front of the car is snatchy and trends to grip roll, lowering the roll centre will help tame that.

This is not dissimilar to fitting a softer front tyre. Although a softer tyre will give more grip, it will also compress more - much the same effect as a softer spring. If you allow the car to roll more then you will get less tendency to grip roll. As the chassis can roll more, it lowers the CofG in a corner and reduces the tendency to grip roll.

It all sounds counter-intuitive, but fitting softer tyres when the grip comes right up, and lower the front (and rear, if you can) roll centres helps tame grip roll. HTH
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:57 PM   #41031
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Guys,

What is your perfect/ideal 12th scale setup?

I am a long time nitro on-road 8th scale racer, looking to give 12th a go.

There is virtually no trackside support, so I can really choose any brand.

Money is not a concern , I tend to overspend on RC

So in an ideal world, what brand/model would you choose:

Chassis?
Motor (4.5T)?
ESC?
Battery?
Servo?
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:25 PM   #41032
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Originally Posted by implusepro View Post
Guys,

What is your perfect/ideal 12th scale setup?

I am a long time nitro on-road 8th scale racer, looking to give 12th a go.

There is virtually no trackside support, so I can really choose any brand.

Money is not a concern , I tend to overspend on RC

So in an ideal world, what brand/model would you choose:

Chassis?
Motor (4.5T)?
ESC?
Battery?
Servo?
Speedmerchant Rev 8 w/ new school front end.
4.5 motor all are fast (Orca, Team Orion, Reedy, Trinity doesn't matter too much)
Team Orion R10 1s or Orca 1s ESC
R1 Wurks 7000mah battery
KO Propo 951 servo
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Old 08-03-2014, 11:20 PM   #41033
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After reading up on the Yokomo C3 U.K Knowledge Base for the 50th time . I read a comment by Mark Panye where he added 1 mm shims to offset the motor to achieve perfect pod balance. I thought I would give it a try myself, but with three different motors; Trinity D3.5, ORCA TX, and R1 Wurks.

The first motor was the ORCA TX. This motor is known for it's lightweight design, and thus, in my mind should balance fairly easily. I was dead wrong. In order to balance the ORCA TX I would have to offset the motor by 4~5 mm! Upon further inspection, a good chunk of the TX weight is allocated on the pinion side of the motor. I guess this makes it an ideal motor balancing 1/10 touring cars. This design will help keep the weight relatively central.

Both the R1 and D3.5 balanced out using 2 mm spacers. I do wish I didn't have to use spacers. I have to wonder whether or not the C3's rear pod balance point was designed around Yokomo's line of motors.
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Old 08-04-2014, 02:14 PM   #41034
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Originally Posted by EDWARD2003 View Post
After reading up on the Yokomo C3 U.K Knowledge Base for the 50th time .
Hi
Do you have a link to this knowledge base?
Thanks
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Old 08-04-2014, 02:27 PM   #41035
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Originally Posted by EDWARD2003 View Post
After reading up on the Yokomo C3 U.K Knowledge Base for the 50th time . I read a comment by Mark Panye where he added 1 mm shims to offset the motor to achieve perfect pod balance. I thought I would give it a try myself, but with three different motors; Trinity D3.5, ORCA TX, and R1 Wurks.

The first motor was the ORCA TX. This motor is known for it's lightweight design, and thus, in my mind should balance fairly easily. I was dead wrong. In order to balance the ORCA TX I would have to offset the motor by 4~5 mm! Upon further inspection, a good chunk of the TX weight is allocated on the pinion side of the motor. I guess this makes it an ideal motor balancing 1/10 touring cars. This design will help keep the weight relatively central.

Both the R1 and D3.5 balanced out using 2 mm spacers. I do wish I didn't have to use spacers. I have to wonder whether or not the C3's rear pod balance point was designed around Yokomo's line of motors.
Hi Edward, This issue comes up from time to time. The last time it came up to my knowledge there were a lot of learned and well-reasoned posts about how the weight distribution did this and the motor position did that and so on.

Then, along comes Mike Blackstock, multiple US National Champion and Worlds A Finalist in 12th, who says he has tried all this and it made his car handle worse with a balanced rear pod! That stopped the discussion stone dead!

Ignore it. Most of us won't be able to tell the difference, but Mike can and he says he leaves the motor where it is in the pod with no spacers. That's good enough for me! HTH
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Old 08-04-2014, 02:36 PM   #41036
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Originally Posted by SlowerOne View Post
Hi Edward, This issue comes up from time to time. The last time it came up to my knowledge there were a lot of learned and well-reasoned posts about how the weight distribution did this and the motor position did that and so on.

Then, along comes Mike Blackstock, multiple US National Champion and Worlds A Finalist in 12th, who says he has tried all this and it made his car handle worse with a balanced rear pod! That stopped the discussion stone dead!

Ignore it. Most of us won't be able to tell the difference, but Mike can and he says he leaves the motor where it is in the pod with no spacers. That's good enough for me! HTH
I'd like to read that myself. Just having a hard time buying the idea that an unbalanced pod would handle better than a balanced pod.
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Old 08-04-2014, 06:21 PM   #41037
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Originally Posted by SlowerOne View Post
Hi Edward, This issue comes up from time to time. The last time it came up to my knowledge there were a lot of learned and well-reasoned posts about how the weight distribution did this and the motor position did that and so on.

Then, along comes Mike Blackstock, multiple US National Champion and Worlds A Finalist in 12th, who says he has tried all this and it made his car handle worse with a balanced rear pod! That stopped the discussion stone dead!

Ignore it. Most of us won't be able to tell the difference, but Mike can and he says he leaves the motor where it is in the pod with no spacers. That's good enough for me! HTH
It was nice of Mike Blackstock to chime in about his experiences with pod balancing. However, it's rather strange that we go through all the effort to balance the main chassis. Yet, we completely disregard the balance of the rear pod.

The only benefit I see of balancing the rear pod is even tire wear and weight distribution on the rear tires.

What is the rear pods function? Function with the main chassis, ect.
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Old 08-04-2014, 07:05 PM   #41038
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http://www.rctech.net/forum/9902334-post3306.html

Quote:
Here is what happend to me on the whole balance the pod thing.. I noticed the pod was off balance with the motor so i added 3mm worth of shims and the pod was correct. Then i went out and practiced and the car was horrible. So i took the shims out and ran the car again and she was back to good. So i am not sure it really matters and i will not be doing it in the future..

The last few races my car has been the best driving car i have had since 1s lipo's have come out.


Again this is all my opinion.

Mike Blackstock
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Old 08-04-2014, 08:02 PM   #41039
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RedBullFixx - Thanks . I really do appreciate a professional opinion on this topic, but that's all that he's provided. There wasn't any reasoning behind it nor did he comment on the differences in handling.

But really...Why do 1/12th designers disregard achieving perfect rear pod balance? Doesn't make much sense now does it.

Maybe, I'm just speculating here... The distance of 3 mm he used in his test was probably too much of an offset. With this offset and the weight of the motor could of caused the screws to generate elastic characteristics (spring effect). This is all just speculation.
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Old 08-04-2014, 08:05 PM   #41040
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RedBullFixx - Thanks . I really do appreciate a professional opinion on this topic, but that's all that he's provided. There wasn't any reasoning behind it nor did he comment on the differences in handling.

But really...Why do 1/12th designers disregard achieving perfect rear pod balance? Doesn't make much sense now does it.
Go to the top of the page, and read all the comments
I think it was a fairly well covered topic
See for yourself

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