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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 08-10-2010, 05:25 AM   #34186
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Default Testing

Quote:
Originally Posted by GWH74 View Post
Here is some testing that i did last year with boosters and the Tekin.
http://www.rctech.net/forum/6357275-post303.html
One day when i get my hands on a fried one i will looking into what is sucking all the power.
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Old 08-10-2010, 05:30 AM   #34187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragonfire View Post
A receiver battery pack must only supply power to radio receivers for its operation and the control only of addition equipment listed: speed controls, servos and transponders for their operation.
I think thats pretty clear the receiver battery must only supply power to the radio receiver.
By plugging it into the ESC you are supply power to the esc which is then supplying power to the receiver. There is no way for a scruitneer to be able to tell what the esc is doing with the power.

In my opinion, if it were legal to do that regulatory bodies would need to get sample escs, reverse engineer them and then verify they are legal and put them on a list. Otherwise anyone could rock up with their own esc and you would never know what is happening.

As for the tekin that is something i have said around the tracks. I know functionality is different when the esc is off. It doesnt have a voltage cut off when it is off (which to me would theoretically mean that if the esc is off it is not legal, but then again voltage cut offs dont seem to do a lot in 12th scale). Tekin would have to comment on what other functionality does, doesnt or kind of works when the esc is off.
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Old 08-10-2010, 06:53 AM   #34188
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Regarding my post about the servo in the Yokomo R12, Ive narrowed it down to the JR DS line of servos, but which one is it ? help would be appreciated.

I have a feeling its the DS 3517MG but it only has 51oz at 6v, is that enuff ? ive been running a futaba 9650 in the HB12 and its like 158oz at 6v

edit: rethink.. maybe its the DS3421 as thats 75oz unit..

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Old 08-10-2010, 07:03 AM   #34189
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Default Mephyx

Hi all..
Wanting some info/ feedback on the Mephyx 1/12 from RC Devil?
Any one had a go at this yet?


About booster's/reciever packs...
Just get an LRP SXX Super Stock, and this saves ALL your problems..Works well as a 1/12 speedy, and it has advanced timming/boost as well....

My thoughts any way....
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Old 08-10-2010, 07:08 AM   #34190
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I get 3 runs out of a 180mah lipo receiver pack on my BD. So apparently not only is my 180mah pack powering my car, but the BD is charging it as I run.

And for a guy like me that does not own a laptop, a tekin will cost me as much as 2 BD's.

Tekin+Hotwire+laptop = 2 Advanced speed controls.

It is a year later and the same conversation is still going on.
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Old 08-10-2010, 07:20 AM   #34191
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eichkay View Post
Regarding my post about the servo in the Yokomo R12, Ive narrowed it down to the JR DS line of servos, but which one is it ? help would be appreciated.

I have a feeling its the DS 3517MG but it only has 51oz at 6v, is that enuff ? ive been running a futaba 9650 in the HB12 and its like 158oz at 6v

edit: rethink.. maybe its the DS3421 as thats 75oz unit..

that servo has plenty of speed/torque and is a popular choice, but as the Z3659.

the JR Z3650 is the car version of the 3517. they have identical specs. if you can get the 3650 for the same price it might be the better choice. the only difference between them is the sticker color and the 3650 has a shorter lead,

a couple years ago, the 3650 sold for $10-20 less than the 3517
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Old 08-10-2010, 08:51 AM   #34192
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.

Last edited by Josh Keller; 08-11-2010 at 05:54 PM.
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Old 08-10-2010, 09:10 AM   #34193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GWH74 View Post
Here is some testing that i did last year with boosters and the Tekin.
http://www.rctech.net/forum/6357275-post303.html
One day when i get my hands on a fried one i will looking into what is sucking all the power.
So according to your test the receiver pack is hooked into the motor in some way. Thats why you see performance increase when the ESC is on as well as the motors 1s voltage is being supplemented by a little extra from the poor rx pack under massive load! Has anyone had a RX pack fail using a Tekin ESC?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mangoman View Post
I think thats pretty clear the receiver battery must only supply power to the radio receiver.
By plugging it into the ESC you are supply power to the esc which is then supplying power to the receiver. There is no way for a scruitneer to be able to tell what the esc is doing with the power.

In my opinion, if it were legal to do that regulatory bodies would need to get sample escs, reverse engineer them and then verify they are legal and put them on a list. Otherwise anyone could rock up with their own esc and you would never know what is happening.

As for the tekin that is something i have said around the tracks. I know functionality is different when the esc is off. It doesnt have a voltage cut off when it is off (which to me would theoretically mean that if the esc is off it is not legal, but then again voltage cut offs dont seem to do a lot in 12th scale). Tekin would have to comment on what other functionality does, doesnt or kind of works when the esc is off.
Are you kidding me? Re read your quote and check the FIRST item in the list that is allowed to be powered by a RX pack.

mikecatts: I generally agree... if run time is not a problem for you then get a booster system to go with your ESC choice or get the SXX SS or the new Hobbywing with built in booster. If a RX pack is a must the BD makes life easy.
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Old 08-10-2010, 09:28 AM   #34194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eichkay View Post
...
edit: rethink.. maybe its the DS3421 as thats 75oz unit..
JR 3421 is 65oz. Been using it in my WGT.
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Old 08-10-2010, 10:32 AM   #34195
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragonfire View Post
Are you kidding me? Re read your quote and check the FIRST item in the list that is allowed to be powered by a RX pack.
Its a two part statement:
A receiver battery pack must only supply power to radio receivers

for its operation and the control only of addition equipment listed: speed controls, servos and transponders for their operation.


Even if you read it thus, it still doesnt say the battery pack can supply power to the esc:
A receiver battery pack must only supply power to radio receivers for its operation
and the control only of addition equipment listed: speed controls, servos and transponders for their operation.



Like i said otherwise how is it possible to scruitineer what the receiver pack is doing when its plugged into the esc.


With regards to the tekin, to me it seems certain parts of the esc are not fully functional and thus not powered when the esc is off. Hence the fact that the VC does not operate. I suspect that is one of the reasons why there is an extra current draw.
But the draw is quite significantly larger, i dont know what it is doing. But the tekin does seem to pull massive load of a 1s pack so it is possible the esc is browning out (something which to me is shown by the fact that a novak smartboost cant maintain voltage with the tekin to operate) and needing to draw more power from the receiver pack to keep it going at full strength.
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Last edited by mangoman; 08-10-2010 at 10:46 AM.
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Old 08-10-2010, 10:49 AM   #34196
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Those tests were with a BOOSTER, not a receiver pack. A booster is boosting the voltage and to do that, it has to draw more current so I am not surprised to see the higher amp draws. With the switch off, it is not supplying the esc but turn the switch on and not only does it have to supply the esc with power but it has to boost the voltage, effectively doubling the current it draws.

I run with the switch on with a receiver pack and have never seen more than 80mah in one 8 minute run.
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Old 08-10-2010, 11:48 AM   #34197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dumper View Post
And for a guy like me that does not own a laptop, a tekin will cost me as much as 2 BD's.

Tekin+Hotwire+laptop = 2 Advanced speed controls.
Not quite (From Stormer Hobbies prices):

Tekin RS - $160
Hotwire - $38
Netbook - $220 (from Best Buy)

Total: $418

Black Diamond (1s): $349

So the price difference isn't anywhere near 2 Black Diamonds...not only that the RS at that will also run 2s where that version of the Black Diamond will not. So a better comparison would be with the 2s Black Diamond at $400. Plus many people already have a laptop already that they can use. If not they will have a desktop at home they can use. You don't have to have a laptop and haul it around with you. It is nice to have but not necessary. Fortunately I do but I find that once I get the setup where I want I stop bringing the laptop and only to minor changes at home.
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Old 08-10-2010, 12:56 PM   #34198
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Actually it does run 2s lipo. Quite well as a matter of fact.

http://www.teamcrc.com/crc/modules.p...rticle&sid=121

Also I tested 2s as hot as 10.5 with that speed control. It does not get warm at all. I pulled 10-15 feet on the straight over the "laptoppers". I ended up running back to back heats with the same motor and speed control (had 5 minutes to change battery and tires), the motor came off 125, speed control, had no heat. It was 95 degrees. I saw alot of the "laptoppers" letting out magic smoke out of both motors and speed controls trying to keep up.
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Old 08-10-2010, 01:06 PM   #34199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InspGadgt View Post
Not quite (From Stormer Hobbies prices):

Tekin RS - $160
Hotwire - $38
Netbook - $220 (from Best Buy)

Total: $418

Black Diamond (1s): $349

So the price difference isn't anywhere near 2 Black Diamonds...not only that the RS at that will also run 2s where that version of the Black Diamond will not. So a better comparison would be with the 2s Black Diamond at $400. Plus many people already have a laptop already that they can use. If not they will have a desktop at home they can use. You don't have to have a laptop and haul it around with you. It is nice to have but not necessary. Fortunately I do but I find that once I get the setup where I want I stop bringing the laptop and only to minor changes at home.
Or you can just hit up one of the guys at the track with the laptop and software. I dont like carrying the extra baggage to the track and there is always at least 3 or 4 guys there who can set you up. So now its down to just buying the speedo and the hotwire to mess with at home.
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Old 08-10-2010, 01:58 PM   #34200
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May I allow a couple of facts to get in the way of all these stories about receiver packs and what they power? Thank you...

Most people use about 3000 to 4000 mAh from their main packs. Using the 4k figure to make the maths easy, that's about 500mAh per minute. At which rate, if the receiver pack were providing anything other than power for speedo, receiver, servo and PT, then it would last all of 30 seconds for a 250mAh pack. Since they last at least eight minutes...

As for the speedo re-charging the receiver pack, that is going to be a little on the difficult side. The speedo is a three-phase controller with BL, not a single phase controller. Unless it had a converter in it, there isn't any way a three phase supply can charge a battery. Since the converter would occupy as much space as the current three phase controller, speedos would be a lot bigger. Since they aren't...

What BD have done is to provide a plug for the incoming power to give life to all the electrics in the car bar the motor. This is no different to using the power from the main battery, which is how all the other speedos do it. The difference seems to be that BD will allow this power to come from either source, or maybe it just adds the receiver pack to the incoming cell and its regulator will take inputs up to 12v (2S + 1S) as the Tekin can.

Sorry that these facts may blow quite a few posts out of the water. I wait for the flaming to begin, but honestly chaps, these are the facts. HTH
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