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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 08-25-2009, 07:21 AM   #31876
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4 Cell NiMH 4600's, 4 cell GTB, and a 60x40 track.
With your 13.5 I'd start at 70-75mm rollout and work my way up to 80-85mm paying attention to temps and lap times along the way. Our track is 65X40 so just a nick longer straight.

One of these years I have to make it up to Saskatoon and/or Regina. I know Bob has a great time racing with you guys.
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Old 08-25-2009, 07:59 AM   #31877
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while were on rollouts. what should i start with for a 10.5 brushless running 4600 4 cell batteries and a 4cell GTB. track is around 30 x 30 meters. i was thinking start around 50mm? and go from there

anyone agree/disagree?
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Old 08-25-2009, 08:40 AM   #31878
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With your 13.5 I'd start at 70-75mm rollout and work my way up to 80-85mm paying attention to temps and lap times along the way. Our track is 65X40 so just a nick longer straight.

One of these years I have to make it up to Saskatoon and/or Regina. I know Bob has a great time racing with you guys.
Ok, thanks.
Yeah, I've got to make it down to a race there. Maybe Minot.
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Old 08-25-2009, 08:48 AM   #31879
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@HaraR40: I would personally start with 45mm. Better to work your way up than the other way around. With working the roll-out up you can monitor heat better than starting high...
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Old 08-25-2009, 08:52 AM   #31880
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Ok, thanks.
Yeah, I've got to make it down to a race there. Maybe Minot.
As we always say, "Why not Minot?"

Their 2-day in December always has a GREAT 1/12 turnout (they're predominantly a 1/12 club).

Our own 2-day in March always has a very good 1/12 turnout. And is always a fair bit warmer.
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Old 08-25-2009, 09:03 AM   #31881
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@HaraR40: I would personally start with 45mm. Better to work your way up than the other way around. With working the roll-out up you can monitor heat better than starting high...
45mm it is. this is the first i've ever dealt with rollout since 1/10th tires dont shrink. what sort of temps is the motor allowd to reach?
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Old 08-25-2009, 09:12 AM   #31882
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45mm it is. this is the first i've ever dealt with rollout since 1/10th tires dont shrink. what sort of temps is the motor allowd to reach?
For brushless 170*F is absolute max. Optimum is probably around 150-160.
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Old 08-25-2009, 09:42 AM   #31883
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45mm it is. this is the first i've ever dealt with rollout since 1/10th tires dont shrink. what sort of temps is the motor allowd to reach?
I wouldn't be nervous at all starting at 60mm with a 10.5 on a 100' X 100' track and plan on working my way up to 70-75mm. Maybe stop a couple times in your first run and check the temps, but I'd say starting at 45 is a bit TOO conservative unless testing time is unlimited for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny-b23 View Post
For brushless 170*F is absolute max. Optimum is probably around 150-160.
I'd certainly agree with this. The other thing I've seen is that temps creep up and creep up until you get to or past the gearing "sweet spot" at which point they seem to ramp up pretty quickly to those middle 150's and beyond. It also seems (this on medium-sized tracks anyway) that if I'm in the 150's that I'm MAYBE a bit faster, lap time wise, than at lower temps but that the acceleration has decreased enough that I'm having to really sweep my corners to make those times. That's fine on your own but leaving the inside THAT exposed when you're dicing for position is just BEGGING somebody to barge up the inside and either a) take the line away from you (best that can happen), or b) drill you in the side as you turn in.

That's where the compromises begin to creep in to setup choices.
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Old 08-25-2009, 12:21 PM   #31884
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Anybody have any idea where I can get some retardedly small 48p spur gears?
Like smaller then the Kimbrough 69T. 72mm rollout has me running a 32T pinion. I don't even think I can fit that on a 3.2R.
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Old 08-25-2009, 12:40 PM   #31885
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Anybody have any idea where I can get some retardedly small 48p spur gears?
Like smaller then the Kimbrough 69T. 72mm rollout has me running a 32T pinion. I don't even think I can fit that on a 3.2R.
Those SHOULD fit.

I was testing with my 3.2R over the weekend. I run 64p gears, but I had a 88T spur and 53T pinion combination in it at one point and was running pretty small tires (was down to 42.25mm at that point). The rollout I had at that combo was 79.94mm. These gears were about the absolute max that would fit and I had to clock the motor to one specific position to make that fit. One way of measuring that would be to add the pinion and spur teeth together to find a "max teeth" (not exact, but pretty close) and that is 141 teeth.

Your 69T spur (48p) would be equivalent to a 92T spur in 64p and your 32T 48p pinion is (roughly, rounding up 1/3 tooth...those 42.6666667 tooth pinions are NOISY SOB's) equivalent to a 42T pinion in 64p. That is only 134 teeth.

I think you should have a LOT of room to go. Well, a fair bit anyway.

I ultimately ended up with 78T spur, 54T pinion, (132 total teeth) and the tires were touched on the truer down to 41.5mm for a rollout of just over 90mm. Was testing 1s / 13.5 combos and it seemed like I still need to gear up a bit more but ran out of testing time.
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Old 08-25-2009, 01:08 PM   #31886
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It works. But I'm thinking the biggest I could go is maybe 34T without having the solder tabs hit the damper tube or the cross brace.
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Old 08-25-2009, 01:11 PM   #31887
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It works. But I'm thinking the biggest I could go is maybe 34T without having the solder tabs hit the damper tube or the cross brace.
I moved the damper tubes forward to clear the brushless. See my pics a few post back.

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Old 08-25-2009, 01:29 PM   #31888
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It works. But I'm thinking the biggest I could go is maybe 34T without having the solder tabs hit the damper tube or the cross brace.
With the motor THAT far forward I was able to "clock" the tabs back to where the "C" tab was actually under the top pod plate at the RR corner. This with my Novak motor which has had the fiberglass plate under the tabs trimmed so the tabs sit closer to the can. To do this (if you haven't already) straighten the tabs so they don't bend back along the can, CAREFULLY use your Dremel and cutoff wheel to trim the fiberglass backing tab so there's only about 1mm or so of fiberglass above the can even with the "B" (middle) tab. I stick a piece of servo tape to the can now to insulate the tabs from the can (leaving the backing on the other side of the tape) and carefully bend the tabs back down being careful to keep them parallel with each other.

If you similarly orient your motor you should be able to get at least a 36T pinion in there and quite possibly a 37T. That without re-locating the dampener tubes.

The key is that regardless the pitch of gears (unless I'm REALLY missing something) you SHOULD be able to get the same roll-out I'm getting.
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Old 08-25-2009, 01:56 PM   #31889
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I ultimately ended up with 78T spur, 54T pinion, (132 total teeth) and the tires were touched on the truer down to 41.5mm for a rollout of just over 90mm. Was testing 1s / 13.5 combos and it seemed like I still need to gear up a bit more but ran out of testing time.
I found that before I went to an adjustable boost/turbo esc that around 95mm rollout was best for 13.5. Now that I've switched to the Tekin I'm down to low 80's rollouts.
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Old 08-25-2009, 01:56 PM   #31890
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Anybody have any idea where I can get some retardedly small 48p spur gears?
Like smaller then the Kimbrough 69T. 72mm rollout has me running a 32T pinion. I don't even think I can fit that on a 3.2R.
Danny,

I just worked backwards a bit from the dimensions you've given here and find that you're talking about a 49+mm diameter tire?

69T Spur / 32T pinion gives a 2.156 gear ratio.

72mm rollout X 2.156 gear ratio = 155.232

155.232 / pi = 49.41mm tire diameter to get that rollout with that gear combo

This points to a couple problems. Firstly, "modern" tires are cut to 48mm out of the box, and most folks cut those a bit more to start out (commonly 45mm + or -). Secondly, as the tires wear you'll (obviously) need to gear up to maintain rollout.

Using the 36T pinion as the likely max you can fit in there with the 69T spur that means a minimum tire diameter of right at 44mm to maintain your targeted 72mm rollout. IF the 37T can fit you're still looking at a minimum a bit under 43mm.

You would definitely be better served with a smaller pinion because a) you can DEFINITELY run your tires smaller than that (and you want to!), and b) because I'm not convinced you won't want to be rolling out higher than 72mm once you've had the opportunity to test. If you ABSOLUTELY insist on sticking with 48p gears (64p really IS the better way to go in 1/12 for a variety of reasons) then RW Racing does offer a 58T spur gear. BMI indicates they have them in-stock http://www.bmiracing.com/webstore/ca...ee3d95a014ff99
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