R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

    Hide Wikipost
Old 10-28-2016, 12:43 PM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: 1/12 forum
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: fenton06
This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

Print Wikipost

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 06-09-2003, 08:42 AM   #3121
Tech Champion
 
rayhuang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Cleveland Heights, Ohio
Posts: 6,511
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to rayhuang
Default Old skool front end.

Hey guys,

for those guys looking to covert there cars to the old style Associted front end, Bruce Carbon has put together the "old skool" front end kit #1296 that has everythning needed to do the conversion, including the caster shim kit, axles, springs.... He also has an on-line shop on his website now.

Hope this helps make it easier for you guys,
Ray
rayhuang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2003, 09:09 AM   #3122
Tech Master
 
stormperson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: MA
Posts: 1,185
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to stormperson
Default

rayhuang- you going to the asphault nats in a few weeks?
stormperson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2003, 09:57 AM   #3123
Tech Champion
 
rayhuang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Cleveland Heights, Ohio
Posts: 6,511
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to rayhuang
Default

I am afraid not!!! Would be fun though. I think my Speedmerchant and my XRay would be very competitive outdoors. Now me-Thats another story!!
rayhuang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2003, 10:12 AM   #3124
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 775
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by racerdx6
Would it be ok to use the Trinity Real Time 2 for discharging 4 cell packs? I think the voltage cut off per cell is .9 volts, so that would be 3.6 volts for the whole pack, would that be ok? That's pretty darn close to 3.5 volts .
Looks like your question got overlooked, so I'll take a shot....

The dischargers we are talking about discharge the majority of the energy from the pack at a rapid rate, usually 20 or 30 amps. Then we may put them into a discharge tray, like the one you mentioned, to further discharge the pack and even out the individual cells. If your packs are coming off the track nearly dumped, then you could go to the tray directly. This would work well in 8 min. racing.

At my track, they only run 5 min. heats and mains, so I was interested in making sure any residual energy was dumped.

Using the tray would work to discharge a partially charged pack (say half or more charged) , but it will discharge the cells at a slower rate ( say like 2 to 5 amps) and is not what the tray was designed to do. Additionally, it would take longer than a discharge device and would generate a lot of heat in the tray, so you would be advised to use a fan to keep it cool.

Note: It is NOT necessary to tray the pack every run. I usually do it once a day. Others have their own order of doing things, which are just as correct.

And YES!, you are right about the voltage 3.6 vs. 3.5 volts. That is close enough!

Hope this helps. LC

Last edited by Graphitedust; 06-09-2003 at 10:21 AM.
Graphitedust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2003, 03:08 PM   #3125
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 303
Default

Hey guys,
been offered a Switchblade in a trade, and Im tempted to take it, but Ive got one reservation. Can you use AE t-plates? And AE ride height adjusters?

Im not really concerned about the front end, because if I break it, Ill still; have my L3, but the T-plate seems to break most often, so I want to make sure those are readily available

Thanks
RC Paperboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2003, 04:20 PM   #3126
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: seattle, WA
Posts: 864
Default

Thanks for the reply graphitedust, it was very helpful. I usually only run my Nimh packs once a day because I have three and there are 2 qualifying races and one main. I tray my packs at the beginning of a day to remove the storage energy, but I usually don't need to recharge them again so I only need to tray them once. But if I get bumped up to the A main or something than I don't usually have time to tray them. So generally I only tray once per day.
After storage when there is about half charge in a pack, would it be ok to dump the pack on bulbs until the lights begin to dim, than put it on a tray. Because it takes a little while to dump a half charged pack on a tray, I think it would go a lot faster if I could dump a pack on bulbs till the lights dim and than put it on a tray. If I took my pack off the bulbs before the bulbs went out than I wouldn't be at risk of reversing my cells...... right ? After you did that than you could put the pack on the tray. Do most of you guys discharge the pack on a discharger with an automatic cut off before you tray your battaries? Thanks for any more help.
racerdx6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2003, 11:52 PM   #3127
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 775
Default

Racerdx6:

Yup...you have got it figured out! I'm going to build one of those cutoff devices for four cell, looks real easy and inexpensive. Running the lights till they dim is a standard practice. Just don't forget to remove the battery when the lights dim. If your an old guy like me, its better to have a cut-off device, cause the mind has begun to dim.....

To the guy who originally posted the cutoff device:

If you read this, could you repost the schematic so these guys can see it? Thanks again! LC
Graphitedust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2003, 04:24 AM   #3128
Tech Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 593
Thumbs up Reciever Pack

I just read this on CRC website.

For extra servo power, run ONE extra AAA battery from + of your pack directly to the reciever "batt" plug or an extra plug. NO gain in run time, but a gain in servo and reciever power when the amp draw is high or when your batts are low.

DON"T use the switch. (keep it off)

If you don't completly understand I do not recomend doing this you could let some smoke out.

This will give you a full 6 volts to the reciever and servo.

Here is the link:

http://www.teamcrc.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=2888#2888
David Root is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2003, 05:54 AM   #3129
Tech Adept
 
Finsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 123
Default Re: Reciever Pack

Quote:
Originally posted by David Root
I just read this on CRC website.

For extra servo power, run ONE extra AAA battery from + of your pack directly to the reciever "batt" plug or an extra plug. NO gain in run time, but a gain in servo and reciever power when the amp draw is high or when your batts are low.

DON"T use the switch. (keep it off)

If you don't completly understand I do not recomend doing this you could let some smoke out.

This will give you a full 6 volts to the reciever and servo.

Here is the link:

http://www.teamcrc.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=2888#2888
very good tip...but i dont really understand how to do it...

David ,
if you know how to do it properly would you mind expa=laining more in details and maybe some pic would be a plus

thanks
Finsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2003, 07:57 AM   #3130
Super Moderator
 
Kraig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Sun Prairie, WI
Posts: 6,276
Trader Rating: 69 (100%+)
Default

RC Paperboy, yes you can however you will need to use the Associated pieces on their t-bar if I remember correctly.
__________________
There is great need for a sarcasm font.

You never know when it will strike, but there comes a moment at work when you know that you just aren't going to do anything productive for the rest of the day.

Sometimes I post just to look at my avatar.
Kraig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2003, 03:46 PM   #3131
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 303
Default

Great, Ill make the trade now. Im so exited, adding another 1/12 to the stable
RC Paperboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-2003, 07:16 PM   #3132
Tech Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 593
Smile Finsey

OK, I would make a wire from your + side of the speed controller where it picks up from the + 4 cell battery pack. Run that to a small AAA battery holder - side. Run the + side of the AAA battery holder (red) to a plug that goes into an emty spot in the reciever or the BATT spot. Red wire only. You can use an old servo plug. Hook up your pack as normal, install one AAA battery and DO NOT turn on the switch.

You will have 6 volts to your reciever which supplies 6 volts to your servo. It WILL WORK FASTER. Just look at the specs for your servo, they will give times at 4.8 volts and 6.0 volts.

I had a problem with glitching when My car was far away because there were not enough volts to recieve and process a signal. This happened when I hit the throllte like it was a wire touching the chasis.

All wires only need to be the size of the servo wires.

This would fix a problem like that.

Hope this helps.
David Root
David Root is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2003, 08:30 PM   #3133
Tech Champion
 
rayhuang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Cleveland Heights, Ohio
Posts: 6,511
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to rayhuang
Default Set-up ideas for newbies

Its been awhile since a post like this-so here goes: This is not meant to be a "do this" sort of post, but its is something to consider-especially for begginers or wanna-be's like me!!

Setting up a Sedan is pretty straight forward once youve tested enough and played around enough. But I have to admit that getting the balance, speed and efficiency out of a 12th scale to be a daunting task at times. Black Magic!!! And add to that-many set-ups require a change in driving style to get the most out of it!!! hence why you can drive the TQ guys 12th scale and think it handles terrible-but he is whicked FAST!!!

But I am slowly learning that a balanced, easy handling 12th scale can also be a slow 12th scale car. And sometimes an edgy- fast feeling car can also be slow......Sad, but true. but I digress from my point of all this and that is-form as many constants as you can as you learn your car. For example-and again this is just me-when in doubt-I always go back to Blue side springs on my Speedmerchant Rev.3 and I always run JACO rears and they are always sauced full for a minimum of 20 minutes!!! Oh-and I always run Losi med hydra fluid in the dampers. Hmmmm... come to think of it-I always run 3 degrees of caster and a slight amount of rear pod droop. These things basically never change.

WHY????-because the center spring, shock oil, front springs and front camber, toe out, ride height, rake, front tire compound, width of sauce on frnt tires, diameter of tires are enough variables!! But very effective variables!!! Learn those first!!!

So in closing for any 12th scale newbies-dont give-up on 12th scale. Just make it as simple for your self as possible!!!! And make your car as easy to drive as you can to start. Also-baby your 12th scale because it is a precision instrument. Take care of it-rebuild it often and also rebuild it EXACTLY the same time after time after time!!! Think of it like this-A 4wd drive car is a hammer and a 12th scale is a scalpel.

Let me give you an example from this week. A newbie in 12th scale was trying to drive his brand new 12th scale. it was SO bad he couldnt even make a corner. problem??? He sauced his front tires 100% and had never driven 12th scale before!!! WOW!!!

Also-those weird things you see the fast guys doing-like making endless circles on the track right and left and playing with there radio buttons 1" from there faces, and putting quarters on top of the front tires till they fall off and constantly resetting the trim on the straights before every race- LEARN-em-DO-em!!!! Its a ritual, its required!!!! ITS FUN!!!
rayhuang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2003, 09:18 PM   #3134
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 303
Default

I was racing with 2 guys that have won Cleveland stock 1/12, and I was told that the only real setup changes that they make from track to track are the front sauce. They have found setups taht are fast, and dont need to change much to be fast on carpet. I think that one of them made a change to his front springs at Cleveland one year, but that was a one time thing.

One more thing Ive discovered, you can tell when your car is doing different things by watching the spray patterns of foam rubber on the chassis. If you notice a lot of foam up front, you know the front tires are scrubbing. Same for the rear. Clean your body with a paintbrush every run, and watch the wear on your tires.

Also - to set proper camber to get even tire wear:
2 ways:
1) Run for a heat, tak ethe tires off, and measure them on a camber guage. Then you know exactly how much to change the camber.

2) If you dont have a camber guage, take a piece of chalk, and makew 3 marks on teh front tires, in teh middle, and the 2 sides. Run for 2 laps, then see which marks are worn off. If theyre all worn off, then re-mark, and do another run. If part is worn off, then you know what to change.
RC Paperboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2003, 10:01 PM   #3135
Tech Addict
 
Jimmyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 705
Default

Hi,
I got one question for guys running the old skool front end. Since camber is not adjustable, do you encounter problems with the front tyres coning? Also do they work on smooth asphalt as well as carpet? Thanks to anyone who replies.
Jimmyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New to the forum mig rod Electric Off-Road 1 01-05-2008 05:23 PM
hi i need help and im new to the forum racer4 Rookie Zone 4 01-21-2007 02:37 PM
Why is this forum listed under the On Road Forum? sport10 Onroad Nitro Engine Zone 0 01-11-2007 08:06 AM
Forum Changes... futureal Wisconsin & Illinois Racing 3 10-28-2002 09:26 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 6 (2 members and 4 guests)
NovakSA
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 08:35 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0