R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

    Hide Wikipost
Old 10-28-2016, 12:43 PM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: 1/12 forum
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: fenton06
This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

Print Wikipost

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-07-2009, 09:30 PM   #31171
Tech Elite
 
chris moore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Phx AZ
Posts: 3,664
Trader Rating: 85 (99%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingracer View Post
There are a LOT of 12L's, CEFX, HB, Serpent, Xray, T-Force, etc. etc. cars still out there. Though personally, I am loving the EnrG 4600's. NiMH aint dead yet

Yes I'm aware of the number of T-bar cars both older models and the few new ones, I myself have 6 t-bar cars including my new 12r5. But if I were a battery company and seeing all the hype of the 1cell lipo and seeing most of the new cars that have been released (again I said most not all) are able to accomidate the 1cell. And as it seems likely that ROAR will approve and script some rules for the 1cell applications that is the road I would concentrate my focus as a seller/provider to the hobby.

Besides I much prefer my A123 cells for my T-bar cars, easy to make and thay make my 17.5 car look like its on steriods compaired to the 1cell and 13.5 option.
__________________
Sponsered by:

CMDezigns Paint Works
https://www.facebook.com/pages/CM-Dezigns/259989190822177?ref=hl
chris moore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2009, 08:21 AM   #31172
Tech Elite
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Mclean, VA
Posts: 3,940
Trader Rating: 45 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crashby View Post
The only drawback to this design and using the current single cell lipos available would be bridging the T bar/bottom motor pod plate. The T bar would come in contact with the lipo limiting the movement of the T bar and therefore, changing the handling characteristics of the car. You would have to raise the battery to allow the T bar to move.

There will soon be single cell lipos in saddle pack configuration.
Do you know for a fact that 1S LiPO in a saddle pack configuration is being made? If so that is great news. Maybe I shouldn't get rid of my t-bar cars just yet.
Apex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2009, 09:20 AM   #31173
Tech Master
 
timmay70's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,702
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

There is at least one company that is working on a solution.
__________________
Speed Merchant Rev7, Tekin, TQ Racing (wire), Team Tamale
RC Excitement - Buy where you race, support your local tracks.
ROAR #105242
timmay70 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2009, 08:48 AM   #31174
Tech Adept
 
butrflynlambie's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 192
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default it's eaiser to ask than to look it up myself

I am going to venture into 1/12 scale and was not sure if I could use my existing esc's.

I see there is a GTB 4-cell from novak. I was just assuming that an old gt7 would work or I have a new GTB/brushless that I was thinking of putting in.

Is the gtb 4-cell just for a smaller foot print or do the larger esc's not really handle the smaller number of cells.

If the later, what other escs would work for 4-cell or (1s lipo, if these are to come out)
butrflynlambie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2009, 11:48 AM   #31175
Tech Elite
 
chris moore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Phx AZ
Posts: 3,664
Trader Rating: 85 (99%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by butrflynlambie View Post
I am going to venture into 1/12 scale and was not sure if I could use my existing esc's.

I see there is a GTB 4-cell from novak. I was just assuming that an old gt7 would work or I have a new GTB/brushless that I was thinking of putting in.

Is the gtb 4-cell just for a smaller foot print or do the larger esc's not really handle the smaller number of cells.

If the later, what other escs would work for 4-cell or (1s lipo, if these are to come out)

The regular GTB does not fit under most 1/12 bodies, the 4-cell version has the same case size(footprint) but the cooling fins have been replaced with a flat plate to reduce the height. Its been a long time since I had a gt7 but it should fit. However it will not work with brushless of course. Now as to the 1s lipo, SMC has a pack out and other companies are working on it too. It may become the new standard for 1/12, time will tell on that.
__________________
Sponsered by:

CMDezigns Paint Works
https://www.facebook.com/pages/CM-Dezigns/259989190822177?ref=hl
chris moore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2009, 09:09 PM   #31176
Tech Master
 
CarlosG.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Falls City,TX
Posts: 1,145
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Send a message via Yahoo to CarlosG.
Default

I have bought a regular gtb that was ued in a 12th scale. The guy just took the heat sink off and cut a piece of aluminum to fit the area were the heat sink was and mounted it. So it can be done, just need to modify it abit to fit. I thought I just re say what Chris had said. ((echo))
CarlosG. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2009, 05:07 AM   #31177
Tech Adept
 
bboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 218
Default

Anyone has any suggestions on a good ESC for LIipo? I currently run the 4 cell GTB but I'd like to find something with a smoother power band. I find the 4 cell GTB to be more of an on/off switch....
__________________
Serpent 960-08 + Max XL9
XRay NT1 + Max XXL3
bboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2009, 06:24 AM   #31178
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Arlington, Texas
Posts: 1,052
Trader Rating: 16 (94%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bboy View Post
Anyone has any suggestions on a good ESC for LIipo? I currently run the 4 cell GTB but I'd like to find something with a smoother power band. I find the 4 cell GTB to be more of an on/off switch....
That could be because you are running a 4.5 motor in your Gen-X...

If you don't have the money right now for a new ESC, try playing with your radio's Throttle Exponential to adjust the power curve a little. I find putting about a 20% negative EXP does wonders to calm down super powerful motors.

Otherwise, there are several ESC's on the market that are very adjustable and offer smoother power.
__________________
KSN
kn7671 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2009, 08:42 AM   #31179
Tech Adept
 
bboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 218
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kn7671 View Post
That could be because you are running a 4.5 motor in your Gen-X...

If you don't have the money right now for a new ESC, try playing with your radio's Throttle Exponential to adjust the power curve a little. I find putting about a 20% negative EXP does wonders to calm down super powerful motors.

Otherwise, there are several ESC's on the market that are very adjustable and offer smoother power.
Ah.. ok, didn't think of that, will try.

How about Lipo setup for 1/12? My batteries keep dying since I don't play that often and this part is getting to be very expensive for me ... sigh
__________________
Serpent 960-08 + Max XL9
XRay NT1 + Max XXL3
bboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2009, 12:47 PM   #31180
Tech Regular
 
MikeH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 456
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

I put the SMC single cell lipo in my 12R5 this weekend and loved it.

I have the 4-cell GTB with a Trinity 13.5 Duo, spektrum receiver, personal transponder, and Futaba 9650 servo. 78 spur, 39 pinion, 1.75" tire.

No need for a separate receiver battery, or voltage booster.

We ran three quals and a main. At 4 amps the battery charged up in about 30 minutes. TQ'ed and won. It was great not having to tape batteries in all day.

One guy had issues trying to run the SMC single cell with an LRP ESC

There is going to have to be a separate class because of the weight and motor difference using the single cells. It would not be fair for the guys running 17.5 motors, and NiMH batteries.
__________________
Ewe kant fiks stooped
MikeH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2009, 01:00 PM   #31181
Regional Moderator
 
CarbonJoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,660
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeH View Post
At 4 amps the battery charged up in about 30 minutes. TQ'ed and won. It was great not having to tape batteries in all day.
What, no LiPo sack? Oh, the humanity! (At our club races, almost nobody uses a LiPo sack).
__________________
*** The Gate - Celebrating 7 years at the same location ***
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits. - Albert Einstein
Understeer is when you hit the wall with the front of the car and oversteer is when you hit the wall with the rear of the car
CarbonJoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2009, 01:25 PM   #31182
Tech Regular
 
MikeH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 456
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

Ha Ha...I could probably put the whole car in the lipo sack.
__________________
Ewe kant fiks stooped
MikeH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2009, 02:48 PM   #31183
Tech Regular
 
Yaksaddle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 447
Trader Rating: 33 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to Yaksaddle
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeH View Post
I put the SMC single cell lipo in my 12R5 this weekend and loved it.

I have the 4-cell GTB with a Trinity 13.5 Duo, spektrum receiver, personal transponder, and Futaba 9650 servo. 78 spur, 39 pinion, 1.75" tire.

No need for a separate receiver battery, or voltage booster.

We ran three quals and a main. At 4 amps the battery charged up in about 30 minutes. TQ'ed and won. It was great not having to tape batteries in all day.

One guy had issues trying to run the SMC single cell with an LRP ESC

There is going to have to be a separate class because of the weight and motor difference using the single cells. It would not be fair for the guys running 17.5 motors, and NiMH batteries.

Im still convinced the issue is on his ESC, even with it set to 4-6 NiMh with no lipo cut off, something isnt right.

The weight issue needs to addressed for sure - I wouldnt mind running rookie in the 17.5 class at 795g and open it up as a beginners class and go 8 minute mains? Have the 13.5 Lipo Class for you wiley vets? and as a class for the rookies to move up to?


I think I finally got my stripped diff fixed so barring calamity I will be there Tuesday night for you to lap repeatedly.
__________________
Serpent S400 - LRP - SMC
Serpent S120 Novak - SMC 3.7v
Yaksaddle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2009, 07:49 AM   #31184
Tech Adept
 
bboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 218
Default

I thought the Novak 4 cell cannot take Lipo? I can't find it on Novak's website

http://www.teamnovak.com/products/es...ell/index.html

Also do you need to use a slower motor? I currently run the 4.5R, do I need to get a new motor with the 1 cell lipo? I have the spead spectrum version.

Thanks again everyone.
__________________
Serpent 960-08 + Max XL9
XRay NT1 + Max XXL3
bboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2009, 08:46 AM   #31185
Tech Elite
 
Carl Giordano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Upper Saddle RIver, NJ
Posts: 2,181
Trader Rating: 18 (100%+)
Default

Found this on the ASC site. Anyone know the Dimensions?
Attached Thumbnails
1/12 forum-712.jpg  
__________________
Mugen Racing / OS Engines / KO Propo / Byron Fuels / TOP Racing / Schuur Speed Motors / AKA / Bruckner Hobbies / Tamiya M-Chassis / Kyosho RB6
Carl Giordano is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New to the forum mig rod Electric Off-Road 1 01-05-2008 05:23 PM
hi i need help and im new to the forum racer4 Rookie Zone 4 01-21-2007 02:37 PM
Why is this forum listed under the On Road Forum? sport10 Onroad Nitro Engine Zone 0 01-11-2007 08:06 AM
Forum Changes... futureal Wisconsin & Illinois Racing 3 10-28-2002 09:26 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 04:53 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0