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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 02-03-2009, 12:24 PM   #30571
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Originally Posted by brians11 View Post
I'm currently running Jaco Yellow rears and Lilac fronts, but I'm looking to free the back end up some, should I go to a Grey rear? Or something else? The rear end just feels really locked in.
I find grays tend to fade a little at the 6-7min mark. the yellows feel a lot more consistent for the entire 8min. what you can do is try a 12b
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Old 02-03-2009, 12:42 PM   #30572
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I've heard that the BMI 20 front springs feel more like an Associated 22, and the BMI 18's are more like the Associated 20 which is the typical front spring for 1/12. I haven't run the BMI springs, so I can't confirm it, but you might try the BMI 18's as another way to get more rotation in the corner...
Our .020's are similar to an AE .018 and our .022's are similar to an AE .020 ect. It gets confusing. Our springs feel softer than the AE springs because of the diameter and coil pitch. They are more linear.
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Old 02-03-2009, 12:59 PM   #30573
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Our .020's are similar to an AE .018 and our .022's are similar to an AE .020 ect. It gets confusing. Our springs feel softer than the AE springs because of the diameter and coil pitch. They are more linear.
So I had it backwards... thanks for the correction Jason.
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:07 PM   #30574
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Yes sorry I do have the entire Pro-strut front end on my 3.2r. And With the steering.. I should have tonnes or steering but I don;t and I do not know why. our track is not too grippy but the other drivers have a definate edge with steering and cornering ability.

It feels like I have to slow down more then they do. They seem way too secretave for us "new guys" to really get a handle on what works. Also I have noticed that at about the 6-7 min mark the rear end gets loose. and I have to correct for this drifting effect.

I have only been racing since November but I have got my line that I like to run and I am getting more consistant and not hitting the boards. last sunday if you eliminate my 2 listakes (that were caused by a slower driver pitting me) my consistancy was at about .5 the top racer is running at a .7



anyways enought ranting. and thanks for all the help out there.
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:13 PM   #30575
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Originally Posted by InspGadgt View Post
Your setup should have way more steering then the other cars with those tires and springs. Gotta realize, if those guys have been racing for a long time and you are just starting out, they will probably still beat you even if you have twice the power they do. Right now I would say don't worry about where you place. Sit down with a few of the racers there and learn setup from them, while on the track work on learning a good line. Start with trying to stay in the center of the track without crashing. Once you have that down start tightening up the line a little bit. Learning setup takes time and effort. But it is worth it to do so. I've been doing this for over 15 years now and I'm still learning stuff all the time.

Very true and right now I am not worried about where I place but am I improving and how to get that improvement in myself. I have gotten my consistancy up where I think it should be for a first time driver but what I need help with now is my setup and how to get better steering, rear grip and overall consistancy to the car and the way it handles.

Does anyone have a cause and effect sheet for tires, springs, oil and suspension changes?

Thanks again
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:25 PM   #30576
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Originally Posted by jdeadman View Post
Yes sorry I do have the entire Pro-strut front end on my 3.2r. And With the steering.. I should have tonnes or steering but I don;t and I do not know why. our track is not too grippy but the other drivers have a definate edge with steering and cornering ability.

It feels like I have to slow down more then they do. They seem way too secretave for us "new guys" to really get a handle on what works. Also I have noticed that at about the 6-7 min mark the rear end gets loose. and I have to correct for this drifting effect.

I have only been racing since November but I have got my line that I like to run and I am getting more consistant and not hitting the boards. last sunday if you eliminate my 2 listakes (that were caused by a slower driver pitting me) my consistancy was at about .5 the top racer is running at a .7



anyways enought ranting. and thanks for all the help out there.
Don't thank me yet... I only asked a question so far... this should help...

First, with the ProStrut front end on my GenX I run the 045 springs, the 050's would probably be better on a low grip track, but for carpet I think the 045 would be the way to go. The 050's are the stock spring on the ProStrut front end, so switching to 045 should get you some more steering.

Second, be sure you don't have any preload on the front spring. It's easy to screw the kingpin too far into the steering block and compress the front spring when you put the eclip on. You'll want to loosen the brass setscrew, get the kingpin back into the ball (my allen wrench is real short, so I have to lift the kingpin out of the ball to get to the setscrew) and with the kingpin in the ball hod the car upside down, slip the spring onto the kingpin, then holding thh steering block against the lower ball, adjust the length of the kingpin so that the e-clip groove is JUST clear of the end of the spring. Lock the setscrew back down, and install the eclip. There should be no slop, but the least little pressure on the bottom of the kingpin should start the spring compressing. When the car is sitting on its wheels, you should see a slight gap between the steering block and the top of the ball in the lower arm. If the car's own weight doesn't have a little compression gap there, the kingpin is set too short. It can be a fiddly process, sometimes it'll take me almost an hour to get the kingpin lengths set just right.

Make sure the balls in the lower arms are installed with the little shoulder facing UP... if they're not, the front end won't be working right.

One other thing... there shouldn't be any friction at the upper arm... no binding at the hingepin, and the upper pivot ball mustn't be too tight. With no spring, if you push up on the kingpin, the upper arm and steering block should fall back down of their own weight. If they stay up, find the friction and get rid of it. Some of the CRC upper arms are tight on the hingepin out of the mold. When the upper arm is off the car, I put a hingepin in it. If the hingepin won't fall out of the arm just of its own weight, I open the holes in the arm up with an .080 drill bit on low speed. Or an .080 reamer if you can get one. If the arm is free on the hingepin but still binds on the car, you might need to give the teflon shims a swipe or two on some fine sandpaper, like 600 grit. They usually break in after a few runs, but they can be a little tight when you first build the front end.

Friction and preload in the front end can make the car steer like you're running two or three spring rates too heavy, so whatever time and effort it takes to get the front end friction free is well spent.
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:27 PM   #30577
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Also I have noticed that at about the 6-7 min mark the rear end gets loose. and I have to correct for this drifting effect.
alot of the time this happens because you are driving the car too hard or applying too much steering input. basically you have soo much steering at the beginning of the race, that you overheat the rear tires. then they don't have the tracktion that they did at the beginning of the race. going to a harder front will help with the rear fading at the end of the race. problem is that you will loose steering and the car will seam to push. correct the push with setup and not tire choice.
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:35 PM   #30578
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Originally Posted by jdeadman View Post
Very true and right now I am not worried about where I place but am I improving and how to get that improvement in myself. I have gotten my consistancy up where I think it should be for a first time driver but what I need help with now is my setup and how to get better steering, rear grip and overall consistancy to the car and the way it handles.

Does anyone have a cause and effect sheet for tires, springs, oil and suspension changes?

Thanks again
If you haven't downloaded this yet, it'll be helpful:

Richard Chang's 1/12 setup cheat sheet
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:40 PM   #30579
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Originally Posted by Trips View Post
Don't thank me yet... I only asked a question so far... this should help...

First, with the ProStrut front end on my GenX I run the 045 springs, the 050's would probably be better on a low grip track, but for carpet I think the 045 would be the way to go. The 050's are the stock spring on the ProStrut front end, so switching to 045 should get you some more steering.

Second, be sure you don't have any preload on the front spring. It's easy to screw the kingpin too far into the steering block and compress the front spring when you put the eclip on. You'll want to loosen the brass setscrew, get the kingpin back into the ball (my allen wrench is real short, so I have to lift the kingpin out of the ball to get to the setscrew) and with the kingpin in the ball hod the car upside down, slip the spring onto the kingpin, then holding thh steering block against the lower ball, adjust the length of the kingpin so that the e-clip groove is JUST clear of the end of the spring. Lock the setscrew back down, and install the eclip. There should be no slop, but the least little pressure on the bottom of the kingpin should start the spring compressing. When the car is sitting on its wheels, you should see a slight gap between the steering block and the top of the ball in the lower arm. If the car's own weight doesn't have a little compression gap there, the kingpin is set too short. It can be a fiddly process, sometimes it'll take me almost an hour to get the kingpin lengths set just right.

Make sure the balls in the lower arms are installed with the little shoulder facing UP... if they're not, the front end won't be working right.

One other thing... there shouldn't be any friction at the upper arm... no binding at the hingepin, and the upper pivot ball mustn't be too tight. With no spring, if you push up on the kingpin, the upper arm and steering block should fall back down of their own weight. If they stay up, find the friction and get rid of it. Some of the CRC upper arms are tight on the hingepin out of the mold. When the upper arm is off the car, I put a hingepin in it. If the hingepin won't fall out of the arm just of its own weight, I open the holes in the arm up with an .080 drill bit on low speed. Or an .080 reamer if you can get one. If the arm is free on the hingepin but still binds on the car, you might need to give the teflon shims a swipe or two on some fine sandpaper, like 600 grit. They usually break in after a few runs, but they can be a little tight when you first build the front end.

Friction and preload in the front end can make the car steer like you're running two or three spring rates too heavy, so whatever time and effort it takes to get the front end friction free is well spent.
That is exactly why I love this board. Yes I think I do have preload in the front which I will remedy quicly. I will also be stopping by the hobby shop this week tp pick up some servo tape and now front springs. Thanks again.

We shoud really sticky these really good tips.

Quote:
Originally Posted by theisgroup View Post
alot of the time this happens because you are driving the car too hard or applying too much steering input. basically you have soo much steering at the beginning of the race, that you overheat the rear tires. then they don't have the tracktion that they did at the beginning of the race. going to a harder front will help with the rear fading at the end of the race. problem is that you will loose steering and the car will seam to push. correct the push with setup and not tire choice.

You may have just hit that one perectly I do not turn down my Dual rate at all. Neing new I wanted the most steering possible. it is no wonder it get's worse during the race. I think I will be going really early on Sunday to test these new settings.


Also is there some really good tips of things I can do at the track to continue to get "better" other than practice practice practice. but I am thinking of small changes and what I should see on the track. Just to see if I'm going the right direction.

Thanks again
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:43 PM   #30580
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Originally Posted by Trips View Post
If you haven't downloaded this yet, it'll be helpful:

Richard Chang's 1/12 setup cheat sheet
I have that PDF and I need to print it out for track use.

I really need to start a new document on how to setup these cars and have it in my pit box cause I keep on forgetting all of these good tips on race day.

I really like mark payne's blog for the front end setup I just found
http://markpayneblog.blogspot.com/20...nd-review.html

I will have to put this into a doc too and keep it for the track.
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Old 02-03-2009, 03:41 PM   #30581
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Thanks for the reply on the diff preference/tips Trips!
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Old 02-03-2009, 04:37 PM   #30582
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Questions?? RE.....futaba fasst receiver

I'm not sure where to post this question, but I will try here......

I ran my 1/12 4 cell last friday for the first time with the fasst 2.4 R603FF receiver. I have used it for some time with 6 cell cars with no problems. About half way through the second qualifier it quit working completely, We plugged a receiver pack into it and had no response. I replaced it with a new one and it works fine. My question is did I damage the receiver by running it on 4 cell voltage. Novak will have a booster module out shortly that will supply 6 volts to the receiver. But am I going to ruin another receiver by running on less than 6 volts.
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Old 02-03-2009, 04:48 PM   #30583
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I'm not sure where to post this question, but I will try here......

I ran my 1/12 4 cell last friday for the first time with the fasst 2.4 R603FF receiver. I have used it for some time with 6 cell cars with no problems. About half way through the second qualifier it quit working completely, We plugged a receiver pack into it and had no response. I replaced it with a new one and it works fine. My question is did I damage the receiver by running it on 4 cell voltage. Novak will have a booster module out shortly that will supply 6 volts to the receiver. But am I going to ruin another receiver by running on less than 6 volts.

I had the exact same thing happen to me, albeit with a Spektrum SR3100 (DSM2) Rx in my 12R5. It glitched a few times, then completely died. They replaced the Rx for me and I've since been running the SPM1600 "voltage protector" capacitor and haven't had any issues since.
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Old 02-03-2009, 06:18 PM   #30584
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Randy, I use these in my CRC world GT, and love them..

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXTJU9&P=SM

Tower is out right now, but you can get them direct too.
Built up my diff with those carbide balls and a Slapmaster thrust and it's butter! Thanks again for the help Scott.
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Old 02-03-2009, 06:34 PM   #30585
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Originally Posted by THEBIGBULL View Post
I'm not sure where to post this question, but I will try here......

I ran my 1/12 4 cell last friday for the first time with the fasst 2.4 R603FF receiver. I have used it for some time with 6 cell cars with no problems. About half way through the second qualifier it quit working completely, We plugged a receiver pack into it and had no response. I replaced it with a new one and it works fine. My question is did I damage the receiver by running it on 4 cell voltage. Novak will have a booster module out shortly that will supply 6 volts to the receiver. But am I going to ruin another receiver by running on less than 6 volts.
i run my 12th scale on that system with no problem
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