R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

    Hide Wikipost
Old 10-28-2016, 12:43 PM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: 1/12 forum
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: fenton06
This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

Print Wikipost

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-22-2008, 02:57 PM   #30031
Tech Fanatic
 
Julius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Amsterdam Netherlands
Posts: 960
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crashby View Post
The S120 kit does come with a thrust washer system much like yours but it does not work. It goes into terminal bind when you tighten down the nut. I can't tell if the aluminum cap that contacts the outer bearing race is rubbing on the OD of the axle or if it is bottoming out on the end of the axle. I tried sanding down the diameter of the axle a little and put in 1/8th diff balls and it was slighty better but still not serviceable. It would still bind. Right now I am just using a CRC collar and doing the diff the old fashion way but I would like to use a thrust washer system if I can.

I will get the measurements and send them to you.
Did you use the kit supplied balls for the diff?
If so I'm 99% sure your problem is not with the thrust bearing.

Use 1/8th balls and the diff should work perfectly. We've had some issues withthe thread running out prior to setting the correct tension. But I've not seen or hear anything being wrong with the thrust bearing setup.
__________________
Team Serpent, Xceed, Sanwa, LRP
Julius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 03:01 PM   #30032
Tech Champion
 
CraigM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 7,009
Trader Rating: 34 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jorgesimes View Post
sorry for this quick question, what is the best 1/12 based online store?
+1

thanks
__________________
www.facebook.com/mcpheerc
CraigM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 05:08 PM   #30033
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 814
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Julius View Post
Did you use the kit supplied balls for the diff?
If so I'm 99% sure your problem is not with the thrust bearing.

Use 1/8th balls and the diff should work perfectly. We've had some issues withthe thread running out prior to setting the correct tension. But I've not seen or hear anything being wrong with the thrust bearing setup.
The first thing I did to try and fix the problem was put 1/8th balls in the diff. While that helped a little, it still binds up and when you take the diff apart, you can see galling on the back side of the orange aluminum cup where the thrust bearing race is rubbing. I think the aluminum cup is not deep enough and it is bottoming out on the end of the graphite part of the axle. I did try and remove a little of that part of the axle and, again, while it did make it a little better, it still binds. I thought maybe when the hole was drilled in the end of the axle for the set screw, that it expanded the graphite and is causing the cup to bind. I sanded down a little of the graphite and that also made it a little better but it's not perfect. I think it's a combination of a lot of tight tolerance issues. I will keep working on it.

Don't get me wrong. I love this car!! As with any fine piece of racing hardware, it takes a little massaging to make it perfect.
Crashby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 05:17 PM   #30034
Tech Elite
 
hairy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In the Good ole' U.S.A.
Posts: 2,323
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

.
__________________
MERLIN RACING
"He once ran a marathon because it was on his way"
Logic is a lost art!
You are defined in life by how you respond to defeat!

Last edited by hairy; 12-22-2008 at 08:45 PM.
hairy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 07:12 PM   #30035
Tech Elite
 
RCSteve93's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Long Island, New York
Posts: 4,603
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jorgesimes View Post
sorry for this quick question, what is the best 1/12 based online store?
Teamcrc.com
__________________
rm -rf /windows
RCSteve93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 07:57 PM   #30036
Tech Master
 
PartTime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Sterling hts MI
Posts: 1,029
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crashby View Post
The first thing I did to try and fix the problem was put 1/8th balls in the diff. While that helped a little, it still binds up and when you take the diff apart, you can see galling on the back side of the orange aluminum cup where the thrust bearing race is rubbing. I think the aluminum cup is not deep enough and it is bottoming out on the end of the graphite part of the axle. I did try and remove a little of that part of the axle and, again, while it did make it a little better, it still binds. I thought maybe when the hole was drilled in the end of the axle for the set screw, that it expanded the graphite and is causing the cup to bind. I sanded down a little of the graphite and that also made it a little better but it's not perfect. I think it's a combination of a lot of tight tolerance issues. I will keep working on it.

Don't get me wrong. I love this car!! As with any fine piece of racing hardware, it takes a little massaging to make it perfect.
I know this sounds simple and I dont want to insult you but, did you try the diff with out the tire ??

DK
PartTime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 08:18 PM   #30037
Tech Elite
 
odpurple's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 2,187
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PartTime View Post
I know this sounds simple and I dont want to insult you but, did you try the diff with out the tire ??

DK
Go ahead and insult him. Its fun, I do it all the time
__________________
TOP Racing USA--OD Racing--Novak--Power Push--J Spec
odpurple is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 08:20 PM   #30038
Tech Elite
 
theisgroup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 3,191
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

crashby seams to be the norcal whipping boy. lol
__________________
yang lai

Team Tamale | Team Tekin | RCAmerica | Speedmerchant | Speedzone RC | EA Motorsports | Ko Propo USA | eXpress Motorsports | Parma/PSE
theisgroup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 09:04 PM   #30039
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 814
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slapmaster6000 View Post
I haven't had a Serpent S120 in my hands yet. The proto pic's I saw appeared to have copy of my design.... so I expect you wont need one. But incase that it doesn't come with a thrust bearing, then I could recommend one if I get the spec's from the axle. Just in case it's metric, let me know that axle diameter, the threaded stud diameter and the length the axle sticks past the hub bearing. This pic shows the axle is .130" past the hub bearing as an example.

Brian
Ok, Mr. Bodine!!

Here are the measurements you asked for on the Serpent S120.

Axle diameter = .25"
Threaded stud diameter = .157"
Length the axle sticks out past the hub bearing = .030"

What do you have that will fit?
Crashby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2008, 09:25 PM   #30040
Tech Initiate
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 23
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

What parts are needed to convert the two bolt axle on the associated 12LC to the current three bolt? Thanks
B.L.S. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2008, 12:21 AM   #30041
Tech Elite
 
Slapmaster6000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Edmonds, Wash.
Posts: 2,947
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crashby View Post
Ok, Mr. Bodine!!

Here are the measurements you asked for on the Serpent S120.

Axle diameter = .25"
Threaded stud diameter = .157"
Length the axle sticks out past the hub bearing = .030"

What do you have that will fit?

.030" is pretty short. The shortest delrin spacer I have in stock is the #101 kit for 12th scale at .140" over all length. The issue that you "could" run into is the nut may not get completely on the threaded stud. The included aluminum nut is a 8-32 about 3/16" thick or .1875". Add the .140 spacer and your threaded stud can not be any shorter then .3275" from the end of the hub bearing to work correctly. .157" sure sounds like the diameter for an 8-32 stud.

Truth be told, all the S120 drivers need is a delrin spacer upgrade, not an entire thrust kit.

Funny thing is... I did some prototype parts for Serpent back in '03-'04. Can't say that it ever worked out for me. Guess that's why I am doing my own thing now.
Slapmaster6000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2008, 12:24 AM   #30042
Tech Elite
 
Slapmaster6000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Edmonds, Wash.
Posts: 2,947
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by B.L.S. View Post
What parts are needed to convert the two bolt axle on the associated 12LC to the current three bolt? Thanks
You can check out IRS's website for 3 bolt hubs and clamp hubs. Check to see if you need stealth rings or large ring. I thought the L2 was stealth.... but it's been a while!
Slapmaster6000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2008, 04:29 AM   #30043
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Hawaii, USA
Posts: 7,157
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by B.L.S. View Post
What parts are needed to convert the two bolt axle on the associated 12LC to the current three bolt? Thanks
The 12LC used the small Stealth Diff diff rings so you'll need a 3 bolt hub that works with those and a clamping 3 bolt non-diff side hub. IRS and CRC both make complete axle assemblies that would be much easier and better then using the LC axle with new hubs. The LC axle had a flange part of the axle that the diff gear spun on, the newer axles use a bearing there and makes for a much smoother diff.
InspGadgt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2008, 06:43 AM   #30044
Tech Champion
 
AdrianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 5,914
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

All the new BMI Big Wheel pinions 45T-60T are online and for sale now.

www.bmiracing.com
__________________
Adrian Martinez
What I run: Schumacher Mi5/Associated RC10R5.1/Associated RC12R5.2/Futaba/HobbyWing/Team EA Motorsports/BSR Racing
Where I run: Florida Indoor R/C Complex/Thunder Racing/Florida On Road State Series
AdrianM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2008, 06:59 AM   #30045
Tech Master
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Grand Portage, MN
Posts: 1,362
Trader Rating: 39 (100%+)
Default

I'm using a Novak GTX and Checkpoint Money 19T Motor. But I need to get the Silver springs and brushes to get a bit more tourque out of her

and I use CheapBatteryPacks.com 4000 mAh Batteries And I can get within .5 of a sec lap times from the big boys
jdeadman is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New to the forum mig rod Electric Off-Road 1 01-05-2008 05:23 PM
hi i need help and im new to the forum racer4 Rookie Zone 4 01-21-2007 02:37 PM
Why is this forum listed under the On Road Forum? sport10 Onroad Nitro Engine Zone 0 01-11-2007 08:06 AM
Forum Changes... futureal Wisconsin & Illinois Racing 3 10-28-2002 09:26 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 03:16 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0