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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 07-24-2008, 02:44 PM   #29071
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If you want to race, go with NiMH. A few of us have talking about how to make LiPo work and some are even doing it but as far as I know no one is racing with them.

So far there are two schools of thought on LiPo.

1. Single cell with standard size motors. This will require a receiver pack.

2. Two cell with smaller 380 sized motors. This has the advantage of being slightly heavier in the chassis but lower weight on the pod to hopefully keep the handling somewhat close to the way they are now.

Neither option is perfect but if you just want to experiment, have at it. If you want to race though, stick with the NiMH.

As for how to do it, I have no idea since I haven't built one myself yet but I just may do it this winter. I have a perfectly good 12L4 laying around with nothing else to do with it.
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Old 07-25-2008, 06:00 AM   #29072
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I'd like to see someone make a pod that fits and balances a 380 motor correctly. I think that's the only way to be really sure that the handling isn't going to be drastically compromised. For the sake of simplicity from an electronics standpoint I think the 2 cell/380 motor combo is the way to go. I really dig this kind of experimentation, that's what makes this hobby awesome!!!!!!
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Old 07-25-2008, 07:39 AM   #29073
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I don't worry TOO much about pod "balance" anyway--you're sitting on a straight axle. For quite a while now I've been building cars not even including the pod when balancing, only the main chassis plate and components on it. Even so, I'd bet it wouldn't be far off.

I've found a bl 380 motor spec range that I'm pretty sure would make the 2s LiPo car fairly comparable to a 4-cell 17.5 performance-wise. Calculating the kv Novak show for their 17.5 at 4.8v nominal voltage this 380 is almost identical rpm calculated with the kv this motor specs at 7.4v nominal voltage. Better yet, this motor yields about 15% less max amps / wattage / torque than the 17.5 so I'm thinking this will offset the similar amount less weight than a 4-cell / 17.5 car.

The motor weighs about 51g less than a 17.5 and the 2s MaxAmps 4200 pack I'm looking at weighs 220g vs. my IB4200 packs at 290g so another 70g. That adds to a 121g savings vs the equipment I normally use. Guess what--I just calculated this for the first time, and 121g is exactly 15% of...ta da...800g. Seems I'm on target if my understandings of various aspects (certainly not a certainty ) is accurate.

Unfortunately I can't seem to find anyone (yet) that can provide the motor(s)...

Scottrik
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Old 07-25-2008, 11:59 AM   #29074
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Which motor are you looking at Scottrik?
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Old 07-26-2008, 12:31 PM   #29075
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since the mongoose technically have "winds" im guessing those would be a good choice, because they are sensored and stuff. They can handle the cells easily as well. i think the charm of 1/12 is its ability to use full size electronics in a smaller, faster package imo.
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Old 07-26-2008, 01:24 PM   #29076
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Anybody running the Serpent S120?
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Old 07-26-2008, 01:24 PM   #29077
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferrarimk13 View Post
since the mongoose technically have "winds" im guessing those would be a good choice, because they are sensored and stuff. They can handle the cells easily as well. i think the charm of 1/12 is its ability to use full size electronics in a smaller, faster package imo.
All way too high kv to use with LiPo or I'd be ALL over 'em.
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Old 07-27-2008, 12:34 AM   #29078
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I like to read the 12th scale thread from time to time because.... well dugh.... I manufacture 12th scale kits. Being that I just stumbled onto the lipo/bl topic yet again, here's some of the results I have come up with: I have purchased just about every Mamba 380 sized motor for my little Frankinstine project. I quickly found out the 8kv was ridiculous, the 5.4kv was still stinking fast, but the 3.6kv may actually be slightly slower then a 27t. A 4.2kv maybe perfect for all around play. Oh, btw... my car weighed in around 410g. One thing to note is the heat in the motor that will be generated. The 5.4kv is probably close to a 3.5 w/ nimh..... you know.... slightly insane. But if you take that same motor and add the weight of a 2C 4000mah lipo (mine is a 1550mah), the weight factor may burn the motor up.... but if it didn't, you should be able to run for about 23 minutes. Also, there are those in "asphalt town" that have tested light cars like this and they can not get them to hook up. So before we go down a path of: "what if we build this....." consider that it needs to work on all formats to be an effective chassis for all in order to justify selling/building it.

Something that I have been doing a little research in is the lithium ion cells for 12th scale. Just skip the whole lipo thing. Lipo will be old tech by the time we get it figured out for 12th scale anyway. The lithium cells come in about 3.6v and have a broader range of shapes they can be produced in. It would not be too far fetched of an idea to have 2C li-ion with a 17.5 for a mod class and a 21.5 as a stock style class. This would be off the shelf equipment, no rx packs needed with the 1C concept, just a little time and research will be needed into the new cells for shape and weight.

Brian-Slapmaster Tools
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Old 07-27-2008, 07:17 AM   #29079
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Brian - I hear what you're saying and I like it. Honestly, I'm one of those guys who runs his stuff until new technology has been out for a while before I do anything. I have just started hearing the rumble about this type of technology (lipos and different ESC/BL) and wanted to check it out myself. I'm interested in the idea of lithuim ion packs and what they have to offer. Let us know what you find out. Thanks for the input.
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Old 07-27-2008, 07:42 AM   #29080
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Default Xceed 12th foams & rims

anyone run them?

Their foam on a Prism rim or just re badged Jaco's

Xceed 12th Foams
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Old 07-27-2008, 09:04 AM   #29081
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can you buy them from that site? I just kinda glanced at the site and thought I'd check out the price - didnt see one.
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Old 07-27-2008, 01:49 PM   #29082
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slapmaster6000 View Post
I like to read the 12th scale thread from time to time because.... well dugh.... I manufacture 12th scale kits. Being that I just stumbled onto the lipo/bl topic yet again, here's some of the results I have come up with: I have purchased just about every Mamba 380 sized motor for my little Frankinstine project. I quickly found out the 8kv was ridiculous, the 5.4kv was still stinking fast, but the 3.6kv may actually be slightly slower then a 27t. A 4.2kv maybe perfect for all around play. Oh, btw... my car weighed in around 410g. One thing to note is the heat in the motor that will be generated. The 5.4kv is probably close to a 3.5 w/ nimh..... you know.... slightly insane. But if you take that same motor and add the weight of a 2C 4000mah lipo (mine is a 1550mah), the weight factor may burn the motor up.... but if it didn't, you should be able to run for about 23 minutes. Also, there are those in "asphalt town" that have tested light cars like this and they can not get them to hook up. So before we go down a path of: "what if we build this....." consider that it needs to work on all formats to be an effective chassis for all in order to justify selling/building it.

Something that I have been doing a little research in is the lithium ion cells for 12th scale. Just skip the whole lipo thing. Lipo will be old tech by the time we get it figured out for 12th scale anyway. The lithium cells come in about 3.6v and have a broader range of shapes they can be produced in. It would not be too far fetched of an idea to have 2C li-ion with a 17.5 for a mod class and a 21.5 as a stock style class. This would be off the shelf equipment, no rx packs needed with the 1C concept, just a little time and research will be needed into the new cells for shape and weight.

Brian-Slapmaster Tools
how about a 1/36 brushless?
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Old 07-28-2008, 11:03 AM   #29083
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Hi guys

I'm after some advice - probably from someone who's already encountered a similar situation?

I've got a CRC T-Fource and am just about to make the change to running brushless in my 12th ready for the up-coming indoor season. Does anyone know how well a brushless motor fits in the standard pod? - And leading on from that, if I wanted to get a more brushless-friendly rear end what would be the easiest/cheapest way to go?

Thanks in advance for any advice

Oli
UK
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Old 07-28-2008, 11:47 AM   #29084
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigger Brother View Post
Hi guys

I'm after some advice - probably from someone who's already encountered a similar situation?

I've got a CRC T-Fource and am just about to make the change to running brushless in my 12th ready for the up-coming indoor season. Does anyone know how well a brushless motor fits in the standard pod? - And leading on from that, if I wanted to get a more brushless-friendly rear end what would be the easiest/cheapest way to go?

Thanks in advance for any advice

Oli
UK
Oli, check this thread out.....
Vantomme Car Designs
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Old 07-28-2008, 03:52 PM   #29085
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigger Brother View Post
Hi guys

I'm after some advice - probably from someone who's already encountered a similar situation?

I've got a CRC T-Fource and am just about to make the change to running brushless in my 12th ready for the up-coming indoor season. Does anyone know how well a brushless motor fits in the standard pod? - And leading on from that, if I wanted to get a more brushless-friendly rear end what would be the easiest/cheapest way to go?

Thanks in advance for any advice

Oli
UK
hi the Nosram brushless fits in without any problems at all and works very well in the car, i wouldn't bother getting a new rear end, just stick it in and away you go..

Steve
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