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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 08-25-2006, 01:01 AM   #20161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grizzbob
Actually, it's not so much the disk on those cars as it is the T-plate underneath it. While both can work VERy well on high grip surfaces, it's on rough & low grip tracks that the T-Bar cars run into trouble. Because of the free movement in all directions that the damper tube cars offer, they can be adapted well to pretty much ANY surface(within reason, of course), but T-Bar cars simply can't flex enough to keep up. And even worse, T-Bar cars can also be MUCH more prone to being tweaked than damper-tube cars, because that fiberglass T-Bar takes a lot of abuse, & once it gets tweaked, there's no fixing it, you just have to buy & install a fresh one(& from my expeience with them, that gets old pretty quickly). Also, on another note more aimed at the disk damper, it seemed to me that while you could get them to work very well, it was always quite messy(always leaking whatever damping substance you use, whether it be grease or fluid, had to redo mine after EVERY run), while the tubes on my CRC Carpet Knife seem to hold the damping fluid quite well(better than I expected, at least), less troublesome & easier to keep clean. But on a good track surface, both are equally effective, IMO.....
To clarify, as adrian said, having a t-bar car has nothing to do with the damping system incorporated. T-bar cars often run discs, but there are many with tubes as well. Also, to clarify, damping does not = stiffness. Damping is what controls the rate (aka speed) of compression and realease of the spring. This affects the reactive characteristics of the car more than anything else, not so much the overall balance.

I run a link car (SpeedMerchant), on which tubes are the hot setup without question. That said there are virtues to the damper disc, especially on a T-Bar car. When cornering and accelerating/decelerating you are producing forces through the chassis both laterally and logitudinally. The resultant vectored force receives more consistent damping with a disc when compared to tubes as the disc has 2 free axis of movement. Don't knock 'em. The downside is of course that you lose independant adjustment of the lateral and logitudinal damping beyond the additonal damping provided by the center shock.

T-Bar cars and link cars both have their virtues, just as disc's and tubes. I personally think the SM Rev 4.5 is the hot setup on carpet, but there is no doubt that many other cars are very fast on the rug as well. In the end, the most important thing you can do to "tune" any 12th scale is build it with meticulous precision. A collapsed front spring, a clicky center shock, sticky or empty tubes will all make your car feel broken. 12th scale is about the details.
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Old 08-25-2006, 04:19 AM   #20162
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i agree with both ed and adrian.being that there was talk of t plate breakdown i would also like to note that springs also collapse and will need to be replaced.link cars work very well but they are not invinsible either.im not saying anything bad about them.all i say is that if you peg something hard or just use the car normally for an long time,coil springs wear also.i have been running the same .063 t plate in my car for 4 months.i have not really hit anything.the rear pod does not flex very far so it doesnt get fatigued easily.what hurts t plates is impact. as far as discs vs. tubes,try em both and see what works better for you.i personally run discs and have for some time now.i have tried both and was faster with the discs.
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Old 08-25-2006, 06:13 AM   #20163
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Jason and Adrian or Whoever= what do you guy use for lube on the disks- in the past i have used, losi hydro fluid, 500 to 1000 1/8 center diff lube. whats the best or standard? thanks guys
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Old 08-25-2006, 07:54 AM   #20164
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My car a L4 is setup for carpet and works very well. Moving to a outdoor high grip track, would I want to stiffen up the setup or soften the setup? Tried it out last weekend and it worked ok but I think thereis room for improvement. This is stock Iam running on double pink rears purple fronts, silver center spring, 30wt oil, 20 spring in the front. Any tips would be helpful. Thanks Bill
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:00 AM   #20165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B-B
My car a L4 is setup for carpet and works very well. Moving to a outdoor high grip track, would I want to stiffen up the setup or soften the setup? Tried it out last weekend and it worked ok but I think thereis room for improvement. This is stock Iam running on double pink rears purple fronts, silver center spring, 30wt oil, 20 spring in the front. Any tips would be helpful. Thanks Bill


try this one
Quote:
Originally Posted by protc3
Rear:
.063 T plate
olive spring w/ 25 wt oil
4mm ride height
1.800 tires double pink wraps(TRC)
1.5mm up travel for the pod droop
5000 wt. 1/8 diff oil on washers.make sure you rub the washers real good onto the top plate to create a nice seal.
batteries as far back as they go and run the rear track width at about 168mm

Front:
10 degree castor blocks shimmed to center
.020 front springs / 5000wt. diff oil on the king pins
1.5 degree camber
3.75 mm ride height
no droop
double pink wraps cut to 1.725(TRC)
it works very well on asphalt
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:09 AM   #20166
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Hi there all.... just wondering if you guys could help.

I purchased a RC12L4 built it practiced 5 runs but now due to Touring car commitments havent got the time to race it!

So brand new rolling chassis
spare set of NEW wheels and tyres + set on the car
Micro Servo new
Quantum Speedo (still under waranty) new
Matrix 27x1 new
4 sets of cells

Any idea what i should sell it all for?

Oh and im from the UK if that makes any difference?

Thanks Guys and Gals
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:18 AM   #20167
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Thank you all for the input.

Adrian, that is exactly what i was looking for. Someone that tried them back to back, because otherwise i'm not sure you can make a fair assesment. Like everyone else, i've tried both and have gotten both to work quite well but was never able to test one after the other. So thanks.

As a side question, when you moved from one to the other did you use the same substance in the tube/disk? Or did you modify. I ask because this could have been the difference in times. But i'm not doubting that you already took that into consideration.

JEDI
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:18 AM   #20168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IslandBwoy
Thank you all for the input.

Adrian, that is exactly what i was looking for. Someone that tried them back to back, because otherwise i'm not sure you can make a fair assesment. Like everyone else, i've tried both and have gotten both to work quite well but was never able to test one after the other. So thanks.

As a side question, when you moved from one to the other did you use the same substance in the tube/disk? Or did you modify. I ask because this could have been the difference in times. But i'm not doubting that you already took that into consideration.

JEDI

PS. When did paul start running 12?
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:22 AM   #20169
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And sorry for going off your subject


Quote:
Originally Posted by wide_mouth_frog
Hi there all.... just wondering if you guys could help.

I purchased a RC12L4 built it practiced 5 runs but now due to Touring car commitments havent got the time to race it!

So brand new rolling chassis
spare set of NEW wheels and tyres + set on the car
Micro Servo new
Quantum Speedo (still under waranty) new
Matrix 27x1 new
4 sets of cells

Any idea what i should sell it all for?

Oh and im from the UK if that makes any difference?

Thanks Guys and Gals
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:44 AM   #20170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IslandBwoy
PS. When did paul start running 12?
he has run it in the past
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:44 AM   #20171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IslandBwoy
PS. When did paul start running 12?
In the late 80's...lol! Hey, you asked! Pw will be running 1/12th at Art's this weekend.

When I ran tubes I started out with 100wt oil and kept going up until I got to Trinity Purple Stuff. The weird thing was my car was still acting as if it needed more damping.

I switched to damper disks with Stealth Diff lube and it was better. Then Jason got me using 5000wt 1/8th buggy diff silicone and thats what I use to this day. You cam buy it from 1000wt to 50,000wt. For 1/12th I have 4000, 5000, 7000 and 10,000wt. On carpet I run 7k or 10k.

There is something about the disks that make the car feel better. Its not just the damping. I dont know if its the disc tension springs action on the top pod plate or the increased fore-aft damping but they just work.
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:53 AM   #20172
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I have typically been running 90wt oil, CRC Light or CRC Heavy fluid. How do these compare to the diff silicone?
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:56 AM   #20173
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[QUOTE=eforer]To clarify, as adrian said, having a t-bar car has nothing to do with the damping system incorporated. T-bar cars often run discs, but there are many with tubes as well. Also, to clarify, damping does not = stiffness. Damping is what controls the rate (aka speed) of compression and realease of the spring. This affects the reactive characteristics of the car more than anything else, not so much the overall balance.QUOTE]

While were on the subject I have always wondered two things.

1. The characterists of the car change as you say but what does that mean on the track? Does the car exit better as the disk slows?

2. What can one do to "work on" a disk? Ive heard guys use teflon tape but teflon doesn't have a sticky side. Or is their a different teflon tape then the white plumber tape I'm use to?
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:57 AM   #20174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_hfuhuhurr
I have typically been running 90wt oil, CRC Light or CRC Heavy fluid. How do these compare to the diff silicone?

I never liked shock oils in a tube, but okay on a damper disc. CRC light I think is closer to the 1000 wt silicone lube. The Heavy and Extra heavy CRC lubes are like 5000 and 10,000. Those are what I am using now. I ran heavy and extra heavy in my crc 3.2, but light in my T-fource.
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Old 08-25-2006, 09:07 AM   #20175
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Thanks Ray,
I'm looking forward to heading up there and running some with you guys. I'm also trying to increase attendance here in Columbus at Platinum. It's under new ownership and the new owners are great. Oval attendance has been very strong but the roadcourse attendance has stunk last year.
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