R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

    Hide Wikipost
Old 10-28-2016, 12:43 PM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: 1/12 forum
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: fenton06
This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

Print Wikipost

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-13-2006, 02:20 AM   #17371
Tech Regular
 
MartinSorlie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Oslo, Norway!
Posts: 307
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slapmaster6000
Guys,
Here's something interesting that a buddy and I stumbled across recently that I want to share. I don't use dual rate very much, but my buddy does and discovered a what appeared to be a problem. When turning his d/r down, he found that the end points of the steering limits did not follow proportionally. For instance, if a 12th scale car could turn 2 foot circles at max steering in both directions and then you were to turn the d/r down, you might find that the car might turn a 3 foot circle one way and 4 foot circle the other direction.

Well this seemed like an obvious flaw in the radio. Who would want non-proportional side to side d/r like that? I have always found that when I set my radio up that my end points are not always the same side to side (90% vs 75%), but once set, the car always acted correctly. So thinking this was odd, I thought that I would ask our radio control Team Manager this question.

It turns out, that if you center a servo with "trim" to achieve the mechanical center that you are looking for in your servo arm/saver... you will have uneven end points and this problem will effect the way your d/r acts as you reduce it!

The correct way to set up your servo is to find the least amount of off center to mount your arm/saver and correct it with "sub-trim" to the nearest amount of mechanical center that you can. But first, you must make sure that your steering trim is at "zero". Make sure that your d/r is maxed out. Then set your epa's. You might find that your epa's are much closer percentage-wise then before. With any car, you will have to check all the steering links for equal lengths and a proper length steering rack link. Then use the "trim" to fine tune your car on the track. Now, your d/r will reduce proportionally correct all the way! Maybe as a rule, if you get steering trim more then 5% off of center, you may want to fix some of that through sub-trim. For some reason, the software that is in today's radios do not treat trim and sub-trim as the same, especially involving dual rate.

Check it out, it's worth a look!

Brian
I'm surprised how many people never read their radio's manual and such. I've been doing it like this for many years...
__________________
Martin Sørlie, 1985, R/C since 1995.
TLR - Spektrum
www.teamsmallsize.com
MartinSorlie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2006, 06:44 AM   #17372
Tech Addict
 
IslandBwoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 602
Default

Quote:
Take the wheels off the car and put it on a flat surface. Pop one end of the shock off its ball stud and let it extend to full length. It should be only slightly longer than the distance between the ball studs, maybe a millimeter or two. If it's much longer you'll need to shorten one or both ball cups. You want a little bit of droop at the pod when the shock is fully extended, but not much.
Thanks. That makes sense. I was just looking at the pics of the YRX12 that was posted a few days ago and it didnt look likhe shortened his ball cups at all and i was wondering how the hell.

Thanks again.
IslandBwoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2006, 06:51 AM   #17373
Tech Addict
 
IslandBwoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 602
Default

Regarding the dual rate adjustments. I think the problem is more lazyness than anything else. When your on the track about to go into one of your heats its easier to adjust the trim rather than go into the menues to find the sub trim which requires you to zero out everything etc... As he mentioned he never noticed this until recently which means that what he was doing didnt affect him much and he was able to run a good race. If you have time, then doing it the right was is obviously the way to go. However...
IslandBwoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2006, 06:56 AM   #17374
Tech Champion
 
rayhuang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Cleveland Heights, Ohio
Posts: 6,511
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to rayhuang
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slapmaster6000
Guys,
Here's something interesting that a buddy and I stumbled across recently that I want to share. I don't use dual rate very much, but my buddy does and discovered a what appeared to be a problem. When turning his d/r down, he found that the end points of the steering limits did not follow proportionally. For instance, if a 12th scale car could turn 2 foot circles at max steering in both directions and then you were to turn the d/r down, you might find that the car might turn a 3 foot circle one way and 4 foot circle the other direction.

Well this seemed like an obvious flaw in the radio. Who would want non-proportional side to side d/r like that? I have always found that when I set my radio up that my end points are not always the same side to side (90% vs 75%), but once set, the car always acted correctly. So thinking this was odd, I thought that I would ask our radio control Team Manager this question.

It turns out, that if you center a servo with "trim" to achieve the mechanical center that you are looking for in your servo arm/saver... you will have uneven end points and this problem will effect the way your d/r acts as you reduce it!
This has plagued me for months. I thought I had it all figured out when I was given a tip of setting max travel from the default of 100 to 150 and then resetting all my cars. But I think it made things worse in some cases. I think a very small chnage in d/r (3 to 5 clicks) would make a huge change in EPA. Like more than a foot!!

I am glad someone esle found this because I was starting to lose my mind over this. IN fact it was so frustrating I didnt even feel like racing which for me is weird.

I'll reset my radio to 100 max travel, set my d/r to 100% and then set my subtrim and epa's!!!!!!!

I sure hope this is the answer because I use subtrim and d/r more thn most.
rayhuang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2006, 04:33 PM   #17375
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greece
Posts: 224
Default

Dear all,

I would like you to give me a rollout suggestion to use as a starting point for use in our track which is quite big for 1/12th. It has a 150ft straight, medium to high grip and I am using a 9x2 Br00d motor on a CRC T fource.

Thanks a lot in advance,


Antonis
__________________
Kyosho Evolva M3 / Kyosho Lazer ZX-5 SP / Xray T3
aantonis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2006, 04:38 PM   #17376
Tech Fanatic
 
serpentracer1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Maryland
Posts: 776
Send a message via AIM to serpentracer1
Default

Guys turn your sound on and go to this link if it doesnt come up.Its about our March race

http://home.comcast.net/~idw/march.html
__________________
DAVE (THE SNAKE) Rasnake
Original Mimi Wong Clan. M.W.C. For Life
Losi 22/Losi 8ight
Orion R10 Pro VST powered
serpentracer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2006, 06:39 PM   #17377
Tech Initiate
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 20
Smile ok

OK
JR@SHS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2006, 09:45 PM   #17378
Tech Addict
 
IslandBwoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 602
Default

Hey guys,

Can anyone tell me what the effects of changing the damper tubes angle have on the handling of the car? Im speaking of horizontal. On the yokomo i have aprx. 4 different positions on the body post mount where i can snap the dampers on to. THe first makes the tubes pretty much perfectly straight. From there the tubes angle towards the rear of the car. How does changing these positions affect handling?
IslandBwoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2006, 03:08 AM   #17379
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 148
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by IslandBwoy
Hey guys,

Can anyone tell me what the effects of changing the damper tubes angle have on the handling of the car? Im speaking of horizontal. On the yokomo i have aprx. 4 different positions on the body post mount where i can snap the dampers on to. THe first makes the tubes pretty much perfectly straight. From there the tubes angle towards the rear of the car. How does changing these positions affect handling?
i think when the tubes are angled, it's easier to twist the rear end, much like using thinner oil. when they're straight, it's like using thicker oil.

Last edited by billtc3; 02-14-2006 at 03:20 AM.
billtc3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2006, 07:03 AM   #17380
Tech Champion
 
AdrianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 5,914
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aantonis
Dear all,

I would like you to give me a rollout suggestion to use as a starting point for use in our track which is quite big for 1/12th. It has a 150ft straight, medium to high grip and I am using a 9x2 Br00d motor on a CRC T fource.

Thanks a lot in advance,


Antonis
Try a roll out around 1.50" (38mm).
__________________
Adrian Martinez
What I run: Schumacher Mi5/Associated RC10R5.1/Associated RC12R5.2/Futaba/HobbyWing/Team EA Motorsports/BSR Racing
Where I run: Florida Indoor R/C Complex/Thunder Racing/Florida On Road State Series
AdrianM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2006, 07:15 AM   #17381
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greece
Posts: 224
Default

Thanks Adrian....
__________________
Kyosho Evolva M3 / Kyosho Lazer ZX-5 SP / Xray T3
aantonis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2006, 09:20 AM   #17382
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 5
Default

Hey guys, I'm new to the forum and 1/12th scale racing. This thread has been great in helping me get up to speed (though I'm still working my way through it ). I just picked up a used RC12L4. Would appreciate any recomendations for a servo, speed control & reciever for the budget minded enthusiast (while keeping the weight down). Recomended specs for a good servo?

Should I dissassemble and rebuild the car (to get familliar with it and clean bearings, etc)? Rebuild and lube the diff?
SpeedDog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2006, 09:31 AM   #17383
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 338
Default

Some suggestions:

Servo's: JR3550 - Airtronics 94145 (both are fast and weight about .95 oz) - have seen them go for $30 used

Receiver: Novak xxl (only .5 0z) - have seen then go for around $25 used

ESC: LPR Comp2 or Novak GTX - these will be the most costly but can be found for around $90 used
DLM2005 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2006, 10:20 AM   #17384
Tech Addict
 
IslandBwoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 602
Default

Quote:
i think when the tubes are angled, it's easier to twist the rear end, much like using thinner oil. when they're straight, it's like using thicker oil.
So are you saying that the effects are much like the shock angles on a 1/10 touring car? where the 'straigter' the angle the more agressive the car reacts on that end? Sorry for the newb questions.
IslandBwoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2006, 01:46 AM   #17385
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Fremont, Ca.
Posts: 78
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedDog
Hey guys, I'm new to the forum and 1/12th scale racing. This thread has been great in helping me get up to speed (though I'm still working my way through it ). I just picked up a used RC12L4. Would appreciate any recomendations for a servo, speed control & reciever for the budget minded enthusiast (while keeping the weight down). Recomended specs for a good servo?

Should I dissassemble and rebuild the car (to get familliar with it and clean bearings, etc)? Rebuild and lube the diff?
Yo SpeedDog here is som pixs of me L4, you can use bigger ESC and recivers just need to be clean and think compact. But little, light, are good too....
Attached Thumbnails
1/12 forum-p1170003.jpg   1/12 forum-p1170004.jpg   1/12 forum-p1170012.jpg  
Grub_Maker is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New to the forum mig rod Electric Off-Road 1 01-05-2008 05:23 PM
hi i need help and im new to the forum racer4 Rookie Zone 4 01-21-2007 02:37 PM
Why is this forum listed under the On Road Forum? sport10 Onroad Nitro Engine Zone 0 01-11-2007 08:06 AM
Forum Changes... futureal Wisconsin & Illinois Racing 3 10-28-2002 09:26 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 4 (1 members and 3 guests)
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 10:00 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0