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Old 12-09-2011, 12:28 AM   #1381
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No believe it or not he actually has a xray x10 WGT
I'm not sure but I think it is my "old" x10 that Paul gave me as a door prize a couple years ago at the Portland Xray Challenge! Nice to know it is in good hands now... Mr.Tilley " the T bar " Teddy Bear !

Sifu, I hope you wrote down your setup *before* A3 at TZ You had your car on rails all day long. pm'ing you a link of that last run. Great job "turning the table" on Drew. LOL

Jake D.
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Old 12-09-2011, 06:34 AM   #1382
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No believe it or not he actually has a xray x10 WGT
Oh, ok That makes a little sence.
Thanks DP

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I'm not sure but I think it is my "old" x10 that Paul gave me as a door prize a couple years ago at the Portland Xray Challenge! Nice to know it is in good hands now... Mr.Tilley " the T bar " Teddy Bear !

Sifu, I hope you wrote down your setup *before* A3 at TZ You had your car on rails all day long. pm'ing you a link of that last run. Great job "turning the table" on Drew. LOL

Jake D.
Thanks Jake. Yea, I better go threw it now. Ugly race lol

see ya!
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Old 12-09-2011, 06:39 AM   #1383
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Paul, quick and simple question. Are you using the new style steering in your Xrays, or using all T3'12 models now.

If so, do you find there to be a large difference in your endpoint values?

I ask, cause 3 of us at our local track have noticed a large difference in the endpoints needed to maintain steering symmetry on our converted steering racks and '12 models. In my car, there are almost 30 points of difference!
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Old 12-09-2011, 06:43 AM   #1384
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Originally Posted by Mera'din View Post
Paul, quick and simple question. Are you using the new style steering in your Xrays, or using all T3'12 models now.

If so, do you find there to be a large difference in your endpoint values?

I ask, cause 3 of us at our local track have noticed a large difference in the endpoints needed to maintain steering symmetry on our converted steering racks and '12 models. In my car, there are almost 30 points of difference!
I have two converted '11 - both have pretty much identical end points. Are you using the centre hole on the servo saver?
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Old 12-09-2011, 06:50 AM   #1385
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Originally Posted by Mera'din View Post
Paul, quick and simple question. Are you using the new style steering in your Xrays, or using all T3'12 models now.

If so, do you find there to be a large difference in your endpoint values?

I ask, cause 3 of us at our local track have noticed a large difference in the endpoints needed to maintain steering symmetry on our converted steering racks and '12 models. In my car, there are almost 30 points of difference!
You just need to adjust the sub-trim and link length to make the end point values equal. If you have a higher endpoint value turning right shorten the link and adjust the sub-trim so the vehicle tracks straight. If you have a higher endpoint value turning left lengthen the link and re adjust subtrim so the vehicle tracks straight. It takes a little time to get right, but it all centers around having the proper angle between the servo saver arm and angle and length of the link connecting to the bellcrank.

BTW Paul, how did it go?
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Last edited by Xpress; 12-09-2011 at 07:01 AM.
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Old 12-09-2011, 11:31 AM   #1386
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Originally Posted by Mera'din View Post
Paul, quick and simple question. Are you using the new style steering in your Xrays, or using all T3'12 models now.

If so, do you find there to be a large difference in your endpoint values?

I ask, cause 3 of us at our local track have noticed a large difference in the endpoints needed to maintain steering symmetry on our converted steering racks and '12 models. In my car, there are almost 30 points of difference!
Hi. My end piont values are normally within 10points.
when i set up my steering i will first 0 both steering trim and steering sub trim, then i will turn on the car and set or re set the servo horn or Ball in the saver as close to straight up as possible. then i will set my sub trim to make it absolutely straight up and down. so now the sub trim is set but the steering trim is still at 0. then i will adjust the drag link for the bell crank to be centered. then i will adjust the turnbuckles to have proper toe. Ihen i adjust my steering EPA to have the inside knuckle just touch the caster block while turning both directions.
EPA should be close L&R. lastly i put the car on the track and adjust the trim maybe 1 or 2 clicks for the car to go perfectly straight and you should be all good.

Hopefully following these steps in that order will cure your problem.
Thanks

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Originally Posted by Mb3195 View Post
I have two converted '11 - both have pretty much identical end points. Are you using the centre hole on the servo saver?
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Originally Posted by Xpress View Post
You just need to adjust the sub-trim and link length to make the end point values equal. If you have a higher endpoint value turning right shorten the link and adjust the sub-trim so the vehicle tracks straight. If you have a higher endpoint value turning left lengthen the link and re adjust subtrim so the vehicle tracks straight. It takes a little time to get right, but it all centers around having the proper angle between the servo saver arm and angle and length of the link connecting to the bellcrank.

BTW Paul, how did it go?

Thanks guys.
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Old 12-09-2011, 12:13 PM   #1387
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Originally Posted by Paul L View Post
Hi. My end piont values are normally within 10points.
when i set up my steering i will first 0 both steering trim and steering sub trim, then i will turn on the car and set or re set the servo horn or Ball in the saver as close to straight up as possible. then i will set my sub trim to make it absolutely straight up and down. so now the sub trim is set but the steering trim is still at 0. then i will adjust the drag link for the bell crank to be centered. then i will adjust the turnbuckles to have proper toe. Ihen i adjust my steering EPA to have the inside knuckle just touch the caster block while turning both directions.
EPA should be close L&R. lastly i put the car on the track and adjust the trim maybe 1 or 2 clicks for the car to go perfectly straight and you should be all good.

Hopefully following these steps in that order will cure your problem.
Thanks.

Those are the same steps that I take when setting up my car. My end point values on my t3'11 with a modded steering setup (changed to '12) are about 27 points off from each other.
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Old 12-09-2011, 02:38 PM   #1388
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hi paul,
I'am having difficulties with the car the car is pushing and has no mid corner steering but everything i try doesnt seem to help what do you change when the car is pushing and having no mid corner steering.
thankyou
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Old 12-11-2011, 03:53 PM   #1389
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Hello Paul
What would cause a car to lift the inside front tire under power ( though a sweeper or chicane ) what would you do to solve it ? It seems to only do it with the newer jacos . Could it be chassis flex or to much roll?

Thanks
Cory
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Old 12-12-2011, 06:39 AM   #1390
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hi paul,
I'am having difficulties with the car the car is pushing and has no mid corner steering but everything i try doesnt seem to help what do you change when the car is pushing and having no mid corner steering.
thankyou
jake
Hi Jake. i would first check the caster, its possible that you got a little lost on that, if you find that you only have like 2 or 3deg that is most likely your problem, and 4-6 would help a lot. other than that you will want to play with the rear suspension and make the rate less progressive, and or moove weight to the rear of the car with static weight or wheelbase.

thats where i would start.

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Originally Posted by clparsons123 View Post
Hello Paul
What would cause a car to lift the inside front tire under power ( though a sweeper or chicane ) what would you do to solve it ? It seems to only do it with the newer jacos . Could it be chassis flex or to much roll?

Thanks
Cory
Hi Cory. I have had that happen on very high grip tracks also. I am willing to bet that you are running the longest front camberlink on your car or the super long bulk head position. if you go back to a standard or shorter front link it should cure it. let me know if that is the case. Thanks
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:38 AM   #1391
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Hi Paul,

Tried the anti squat - really, really helped!! made my cars loads better under power, probably the biggest single setup change that has made the most difference!! Able to drive my car hard fully now!!

One slight issue I had yesterday though was grip roll.

My current setup is as follows. I was thinking about running more droop and going softer on the shock oil?

http://forum.teamxray.com/xform/inde...&setup=t3_2012

Would increasing the lengths of the camber links help or make it worse?

Cheers

Mark
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Old 12-12-2011, 08:38 AM   #1392
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Originally Posted by Paul L View Post
Hi Jake. i would first check the caster, its possible that you got a little lost on that, if you find that you only have like 2 or 3deg that is most likely your problem, and 4-6 would help a lot. other than that you will want to play with the rear suspension and make the rate less progressive, and or moove weight to the rear of the car with static weight or wheelbase.

thats where i would start.



Hi Cory. I have had that happen on very high grip tracks also. I am willing to bet that you are running the longest front camberlink on your car or the super long bulk head position. if you go back to a standard or shorter front link it should cure it. let me know if that is the case. Thanks
Thanks for the reply . I did try to shorten the front and rear with the claps to the middle hole but not the shortest link . Do you think there are any other cure for this ?
Thanks again
Cory
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Old 12-12-2011, 10:55 AM   #1393
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Originally Posted by Mb3195 View Post
Hi Paul,

Tried the anti squat - really, really helped!! made my cars loads better under power, probably the biggest single setup change that has made the most difference!! Able to drive my car hard fully now!!

One slight issue I had yesterday though was grip roll.

My current setup is as follows. I was thinking about running more droop and going softer on the shock oil?

http://forum.teamxray.com/xform/inde...&setup=t3_2012

Would increasing the lengths of the camber links help or make it worse?

Cheers

Mark
Hi Mark. Thanks for the feedback!.
I think that a longer rear camberlink (on the inside) could help with the grip roll, rear will roll more with the longer inside link and would normally help with grip roll. i would also lower the car to 5mm and try the -75mm rear hexs. it is possible that those three changes could cure the grip roll. the car may push slightly more but it should drive nicely that way.

Thanks.


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Originally Posted by clparsons123 View Post
Thanks for the reply . I did try to shorten the front and rear with the claps to the middle hole but not the shortest link . Do you think there are any other cure for this ?
Thanks again
Cory
Hi Cory. anytime that this happened to me i always found it to the long front link. A short front link and long rear link should be the best to make that go away. That being said though it dosent really bother me as long as the car is fast.
you could try lowering your front roll center and raising your rear roll center also. Honestly that is a shot in the dark but i think it may cure the problem as well.

Thanks, let me know.
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Old 12-12-2011, 10:57 AM   #1394
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Hey Paul, thanks again for traveling to MARCCA for a day of club racing. It was amazing to see you run sedan with us. Smooth in traffic and blistering in any open section. Also thanks for looking at Jason's sedan. It really helped. Hope I can get it even better for him over the next couple of months. He really enjoys that thing. I think his FDR was 4.3 I will get a couple pinions and get a little closer to 4.0.

Hope to see you back with us soon and bring a 17.5.

Keith.
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Old 12-12-2011, 01:26 PM   #1395
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Originally Posted by Paul L View Post
Hi Mark. Thanks for the feedback!.
I think that a longer rear camberlink (on the inside) could help with the grip roll, rear will roll more with the longer inside link and would normally help with grip roll. i would also lower the car to 5mm and try the -75mm rear hexs. it is possible that those three changes could cure the grip roll. the car may push slightly more but it should drive nicely that way.
Cool, I'll try it!

You really are a credit to xray!
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