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Old 05-25-2011, 08:57 AM   #5251
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Originally Posted by superspeed View Post
What servo are you using?

Maybe it would be fun for TCS race to spray small amount of water on the track for F1 race hehe. I should have kept the F201 special tuned chassis I had 8 years ago.
The Savox 1251.

With the cases on a servo you would have to almost submerge them in water before enough water could get into it to cause problems. I ran a standard Futaba on a boat exposed and it was always getting splashed and sometimes waves completely over it. It never had a problem.
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Old 05-25-2011, 10:50 AM   #5252
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Default F104 X1 Video

I have been running an F104 pro since it came out and I have always struggled with the inconsistency of the car. I have also read many threads with people complaining about rear grip issues. I just found this youtube video and I am wondering how much better this car will be:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tj4l20o4Y0o&NR=1

So far, it looks good but who knows. I am up to the point that I am thinking of retiring my F1 and going 1/12 pan car.
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Old 05-25-2011, 12:16 PM   #5253
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SU75HQOAho&NR=1
This one shows the rear end movement
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Old 05-25-2011, 01:25 PM   #5254
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Originally Posted by eevul View Post
I have been running an F104 pro since it came out and I have always struggled with the inconsistency of the car. I have also read many threads with people complaining about rear grip issues. I just found this youtube video and I am wondering how much better this car will be:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tj4l20o4Y0o&NR=1

So far, it looks good but who knows. I am up to the point that I am thinking of retiring my F1 and going 1/12 pan car.
Are you running the super soft t-plate? The one with the U shaped cut around the rear screw?
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Old 05-25-2011, 09:08 PM   #5255
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Most peoples poor rear traction issues I would suggest is down to incorrect diff tension. I've seen a lot of ppl running around with all the right bits on their car and soft rear tires and still loose in the rear.
When I take the time to set their tension correctly they are amazed at the transformation of their car....

You have to test the tension with the car on the track, you have to take off the wheel many times as you have to make very very very small adjustments.
Setting the correct tension is a pain I know but well worth it. Loose as possible without slipping under full acceleration from a standing start.

I've only once gone to the solf rear tire option on many different asphalt tracks. All other times its been the mediums.

Also, the "High Traction" T-Plate is the softest plate of the 3 options....

Hope this helps


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Old 05-26-2011, 04:38 AM   #5256
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my experience so far the car is consistent my first outing with it i spent the time adjusting the diff as well even on slippery surfaces compared to more grooved tracks, my rear diff is is quiet loose and now i know what the feeling should feel like after a rebuild each time. it will also depend on what motor you are running also as the setting will be different.
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Old 05-26-2011, 10:34 AM   #5257
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Originally Posted by InspGadgt View Post
Are you running the super soft t-plate? The one with the U shaped cut around the rear screw?
Here are the settings for my F104 pro and the things I have tried:

Track: High Grip Carpet
Motor: Johnson Silver Can
Battery: Tamiya Spec battery (Reedy 2400 Lipo)
Pinion: 23- 28 depending on track and tire diameter
Spur: 93 Tamiya Spur
Tires: Foam A front Foam A Rear (have also tried Foam B front and Rear and a combination of A front, with B Rear and B Front and A Rear)
Sauce: None on front Full sauce Rear (Niftech and Jack)
Tire Diameter: 56 - 59 (I try for a 48 to 50 rollout for our track)
Spring: Tamiya Red (I have tried stock and others)
Rear Damper Friction Pads: Low Friction (tried dry, anti wear, different shock oils and other lubes)
Shock Oil: 20
Front Spring: Hard
Front Camber: 1.5
T-Plate: started with stock then soft, then super soft with U shape cut out. I also tried loosening the screw and ran with and without screw
Diff Tension: Loose for the most part. Almost to the point that it is slipping. A tighter diff makes the car much worse.

I find the car has great turn in and runs beautifully at the beginning of the race for the first 10 laps. After the tire sauce starts wearing out, the car starts to wash out mid turn and gets consistently worse throughout the race. It seems to really affect turning right. By the end of the race, I spin out at every right turn and have to keep the throttle and speed to almost nothing. We have almost 10 F104 cars and they all seem to have the same or similar problem. I don't have any issues turning left and I don't ever remember spinning out on a left hand turn/corner. I have checked my steering balance and it's fine. I have also set my steering curve down -15 to -25 and my exp is fine as well.

I have been keeping up with this board since the F104 was announced and I bought the car as soon as it came it. I have always had this problem with it and I have never been able to solve it.
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Old 05-26-2011, 10:53 AM   #5258
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Adjusting the diff on the 104 is a pain with the 104 pro kit axle assembly.

I prefer the 103/F40 style axle on my 104 which can be adjusted easily with no disassembly needed.
It can be checked and reset before each run.
Some prefer the ability to remove the wheel(s) without upsetting the adjustment.
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Old 05-26-2011, 11:41 AM   #5259
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eevul View Post
Here are the settings for my F104 pro and the things I have tried:

Track: High Grip Carpet
Motor: Johnson Silver Can
Battery: Tamiya Spec battery (Reedy 2400 Lipo)
Pinion: 23- 28 depending on track and tire diameter
Spur: 93 Tamiya Spur
Tires: Foam A front Foam A Rear (have also tried Foam B front and Rear and a combination of A front, with B Rear and B Front and A Rear)
Sauce: None on front Full sauce Rear (Niftech and Jack)
Tire Diameter: 56 - 59 (I try for a 48 to 50 rollout for our track)
Spring: Tamiya Red (I have tried stock and others)
Rear Damper Friction Pads: Low Friction (tried dry, anti wear, different shock oils and other lubes)
Shock Oil: 20
Front Spring: Hard
Front Camber: 1.5
T-Plate: started with stock then soft, then super soft with U shape cut out. I also tried loosening the screw and ran with and without screw
Diff Tension: Loose for the most part. Almost to the point that it is slipping. A tighter diff makes the car much worse.

I find the car has great turn in and runs beautifully at the beginning of the race for the first 10 laps. After the tire sauce starts wearing out, the car starts to wash out mid turn and gets consistently worse throughout the race. It seems to really affect turning right. By the end of the race, I spin out at every right turn and have to keep the throttle and speed to almost nothing. We have almost 10 F104 cars and they all seem to have the same or similar problem. I don't have any issues turning left and I don't ever remember spinning out on a left hand turn/corner. I have checked my steering balance and it's fine. I have also set my steering curve down -15 to -25 and my exp is fine as well.

I have been keeping up with this board since the F104 was announced and I bought the car as soon as it came it. I have always had this problem with it and I have never been able to solve it.
i probably didn't really get into the car as much as you did, but the turning right issue might just be the 2 support rods that sit between the upper and lower deck, being on the diagonal.. I was looking at the turning issue just running the car up and down a street (instead of the local track) seeing that it would turn left under a lot more stability, then when I'd go right it would want to spin.

the problem is the support pins hold the radio gear.. or the one I'd think to move to the hole dead across the from the ECS side. I'd have to either just take the radio tray off, or just flip it over...

the other thing that cause the turning issue, is tweak which has no way to be changed.

i have set the diff to silky smooth, too smooth, and i was confused on how it was so easy to set (compared to 1/12 and the others).

the one issue i had otherwise, was going straight and stable with a lipo.. i just added the heavy rear brace, and 1/2 oz to in front of the pack.
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Old 05-26-2011, 11:43 AM   #5260
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another thing i have noticed with this car is if you have too much steering (lock to lock) it will also cause the car to spin out. if you have a fast servo that may be the problem also. when i first got the car i had both of those problems. i have both the pro and the exotek, and both cars are dialed.

question: for those with the f104w, is the front end ride height adjustable? if so what is the part # for the front arms. i have the 103 carbon arms which are do not have ride height adjustment.
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Old 05-26-2011, 11:48 AM   #5261
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carl d: check and see if your car has too much travel one way and not the other way. drive it in a circle while turning left at a cretin speed, then drive it while turning right at that same speed. you should have the same size circle going in both directions. if not adjust the steering travel on your radio until both left and right are the same.
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Old 05-26-2011, 01:18 PM   #5262
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eevul View Post
Here are the settings for my F104 pro and the things I have tried:

Track: High Grip Carpet
Motor: Johnson Silver Can
Battery: Tamiya Spec battery (Reedy 2400 Lipo)
Pinion: 23- 28 depending on track and tire diameter
Spur: 93 Tamiya Spur
Tires: Foam A front Foam A Rear (have also tried Foam B front and Rear and a combination of A front, with B Rear and B Front and A Rear)
Sauce: None on front Full sauce Rear (Niftech and Jack)
Tire Diameter: 56 - 59 (I try for a 48 to 50 rollout for our track)
Spring: Tamiya Red (I have tried stock and others)
Rear Damper Friction Pads: Low Friction (tried dry, anti wear, different shock oils and other lubes)
Shock Oil: 20
Front Spring: Hard
Front Camber: 1.5
T-Plate: started with stock then soft, then super soft with U shape cut out. I also tried loosening the screw and ran with and without screw
Diff Tension: Loose for the most part. Almost to the point that it is slipping. A tighter diff makes the car much worse.

I find the car has great turn in and runs beautifully at the beginning of the race for the first 10 laps. After the tire sauce starts wearing out, the car starts to wash out mid turn and gets consistently worse throughout the race. It seems to really affect turning right. By the end of the race, I spin out at every right turn and have to keep the throttle and speed to almost nothing. We have almost 10 F104 cars and they all seem to have the same or similar problem. I don't have any issues turning left and I don't ever remember spinning out on a left hand turn/corner. I have checked my steering balance and it's fine. I have also set my steering curve down -15 to -25 and my exp is fine as well.

I have been keeping up with this board since the F104 was announced and I bought the car as soon as it came it. I have always had this problem with it and I have never been able to solve it.
When was the last time you changed your front springs? They will collapse over time, especially the left one on a counter clockwise track and vice versa. Also, are you gluing the side walls on the front tires? That will calm the car down. Are the tire sizes even left to right? How long is the sauce on for? At least 15 minutes?

What are you setting the ride height at? Sometimes a slightly higher front height can help if your car is not getting traction. Another part that might help you is the 3.5mm offset steering arms. They will help the car track straighter and take away a bit of steering.

Also, make sure your body is not fouling the wires or rear pod in any way. If you have to raise it up, do it.

Here is a setup for a VERY high bite track with A foams:
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&p...MmFkMjU2&hl=en
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Old 05-26-2011, 01:29 PM   #5263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carl d View Post
i probably didn't really get into the car as much as you did, but the turning right issue might just be the 2 support rods that sit between the upper and lower deck, being on the diagonal.. I was looking at the turning issue just running the car up and down a street (instead of the local track) seeing that it would turn left under a lot more stability, then when I'd go right it would want to spin.

the problem is the support pins hold the radio gear.. or the one I'd think to move to the hole dead across the from the ECS side. I'd have to either just take the radio tray off, or just flip it over...

the other thing that cause the turning issue, is tweak which has no way to be changed.

i have set the diff to silky smooth, too smooth, and i was confused on how it was so easy to set (compared to 1/12 and the others).

the one issue i had otherwise, was going straight and stable with a lipo.. i just added the heavy rear brace, and 1/2 oz to in front of the pack.
You can eliminate the influence of the chassis posts by only using the bottom screw to hold the post and radio tray on the chassis. The top deck will keep the tray from coming off, just remember to add a touch of locktite to the screw.

As far as tweak, as i said #1, check front springs, they go bad fast. #2 check the t plate, if you see stress marks in the fiberglass, or it has a bad twist in it, time for a new T bar. It also can help to try to balance the car side to side, but it isn't anywhere near important as the first 2 items.
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Old 05-26-2011, 01:31 PM   #5264
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Other things to check for is your left to right balance and a rear axle that is too tight. If one side of the car is heavier than the other it will cause the car to act tweaked. And if your rear axle is too tight then you will have more drag on one side of the diff than the other which will also cause the car to feel tweaked. You need to have a slight bit of play in the rear axle to prevent it from binding.
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Old 05-26-2011, 03:02 PM   #5265
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all were good suggestions, i just re-checked all that.
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