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Old 12-22-2011, 08:31 AM   #8536
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Howie-san, I may need your assistance in the next week or so. I'll be in touch
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Old 12-22-2011, 08:31 AM   #8537
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Originally Posted by Pattojnr View Post
i looked at this already , more so wanted an explination of all software , what it does, the differences, and how it applies the boost and turbo. more so wanting to know if SP has software that adds Boost and turbo on top of each other, like its boosting then the turbo delay has been reached, and turbo is added while its still boosting ? this is the Tekins strong point in boosted stock here, and we are requiring software that also does this. so far all i see is the HW software does so, and it is explained as such. so would be nice to have a guide of the SP software for how things are applied, and when things stop. the link covers the 323 well, just doesnt explain that only one is added at a time. Cheers.
Lets say I am scratching my head/hair right now working/writing manual for the new software for the REVENTON PRO...and I don't think I can spend any more time on the 323. It is so 2010. LOL
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Old 12-22-2011, 08:33 AM   #8538
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Howie-san, I may need your assistance in the next week or so. I'll be in touch
ADAM-SAN....sorry, I cannot hold your hand and do X'mas shopping in CHICAGO with you...but anything else, just ask....

Next week is a short week for me...I tried not to remember much about 2011 and get ready for 2012....
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Last edited by Solara; 12-22-2011 at 09:24 AM.
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Old 12-22-2011, 08:34 AM   #8539
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Originally Posted by Solara View Post
Lets say I am scratching my head/hair right now working/writing manual for the new software for the REVENTON PRO...and I don't think I can spend any more time on the 323. It is so 2010. LOL
is there any SP software that will add teh 2 at the same time is all i ask ? if yes, which one ?
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Old 12-22-2011, 08:51 AM   #8540
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Originally Posted by Pattojnr View Post
is there any SP software that will add teh 2 at the same time is all i ask ? if yes, which one ?
323 and I think all of the other SP softwares can add both boost and turbo at the same time if your settings dictate it. I just spent an hour writing up an explanaition of how 323_Stock software works, please check it out. Its the last reply on the last page.

The Speed Passion Thread
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Old 12-22-2011, 09:10 AM   #8541
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323 and I think all of the other SP softwares can add both boost and turbo at the same time if your settings dictate it. I just spent an hour writing up an explanaition of how 323_Stock software works, please check it out. Its the last reply on the last page.

The Speed Passion Thread
i did read your post, i have copied your post and made it in a word doc for me. Thank you for your time to write it up, but after everything that has been tested, i dont believe the 2 work on top of each other, or independant. seems to add one or the other but not both at once. i dont race stock, i am simply trying to help the guys here who do, and i do have an understanding of the settings, but its just too slow for them to work together at once. i have taken the car and driven it myself, and i have achieved a good lap time , but its still lacking everywhere on the track compared to the Tekin setups the guys have worked on for over a year now. i will try something else , and see exactly what difference it makes, and if it resolves the issue.
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Old 12-22-2011, 09:18 AM   #8542
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Originally Posted by mattwoodcraft View Post
well it looks like now i will be owning 4 speed passion speed controllers and only 2 cars. open stock looking at the specs will i be getting the Reventon R for boosted stock? i can see the grey one sitting in my car now

looks like i may have to sell one of my speedies maybe the GT2.0 pro
We are still working on the STOCK1 software...it might not be ready when the REVENTON S and R released....since US don't run boost no more, we have the software testing over ASIA and Europe now and I don't know the schedule of the STOCK 1 release.

I would not let go the PRO yet....we sold out all of the PRO that we got last week. It is still a very good ESC to use for any open or MOD racing. At least I am keeping all my PRO...

But I have to say...now I have to buy alot of different chassis JUST to match all the different color of REVENTON that I will have...LOL.
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Old 12-22-2011, 09:20 AM   #8543
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I just picked up a Cirtix Club Race for my F104. A couple of people on the 104 thread highly recommended it. Is the programing box really necessary, or are the brake settings pretty good out of the box?
It is something that worth to get...on F104, I don't just much brake cause we are running 21.5 on a very open track and it is 2WD...but if you are using the ESC on TC or buggy, then adjusting the brake is necessary...

If you don't want to buy one...borrow one. I really don't think you have to adjust the brake on every heat or every race day....I don't even remember when was the last time I adjust my club spec on my USVTA and F1...I think that was when they were brand new...1 time. done.
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Old 12-22-2011, 09:21 AM   #8544
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Originally Posted by Pattojnr View Post
i did read your post, i have copied your post and made it in a word doc for me. Thank you for your time to write it up, but after everything that has been tested, i dont believe the 2 work on top of each other, or independant. seems to add one or the other but not both at once. i dont race stock, i am simply trying to help the guys here who do, and i do have an understanding of the settings, but its just too slow for them to work together at once. i have taken the car and driven it myself, and i have achieved a good lap time , but its still lacking everywhere on the track compared to the Tekin setups the guys have worked on for over a year now. i will try something else , and see exactly what difference it makes, and if it resolves the issue.
The boost and turbo functions perform in the same manner as a Tekin. I am not sure why your experience is different.

323_Stock software should not be any slower than a Tekin, in fact my friend who runs boosted 17.5 recently switched from Tekin to SP and his car is one of the fastest in the state. We spent years with the Tekin and the SP is definitely on par for the stock classes, it is not lacking. I'd say the biggest difference is the throttle feel and power band are much smoother on the SP, making it easier to drive.
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Old 12-22-2011, 09:23 AM   #8545
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For those of you asking for a deeper explaination of the settings, I have written out a bit of a lengthy discussion on my understanding of how the 323_Stock software operates. This is based on my own research and understanding of the workings of the SP software, and it may not be 100% accurate. Solara can chime in with any corrections as he sees fit. It should give you at least a better understanding of the overall picture.

The main settings you will adjust are 9, 10, 12, 13, 14, and 15. The blank setup sheet is available at this link and it can be helpful for you to visualize what I am talking about. Here is a rundown of how they relate and operate:

--------------------------------
BOOST TIMING
--------------------------------

#9, #13, and #15 all cover boost timing. #13 is the RPM point where the speed control begins to add the boost timing to the motor. #15 dictates the rate which at which that boost timing is applied. It is stated in RPM per 1* of boost added. #9 is the maximum amount of boost timing it will apply after the start RPM is reached AND it adds/added 1* of boost per the boost timing acceleration setting (#15).

For example, let's say your boost timing (#9) is 40*, your start RPM is 10,000 RPM (#13), and your boost timing acceleration is 500 RPM/deg (#15). This means that:
  • boost timing begins to apply once your motor hits 10,000 RPM, even if you are not at WOT (wide open throttle).
  • it begins to apply the boost timing 1* at a time for every 500 RPM added
  • once you have reached 30,000 RPM you will have your full 40* of boost timing [(40 * 500) + 10,000 RPM]. from this point on, as long as you stay above 30,000 RPM, the boost timing will stay at 40*.

Boost is RPM dependent only, and if you lift your throttle during a sweeper, the boost is still being applied if it is within the RPM range. Turbo does not function the same way.


--------------------------------
TURBO TIMING
--------------------------------

#10, #12, and #14 all cover turbo timing. #14 is the delay (in tenth of a second increments) from when you hit WOT (wide open throttle) to when it starts applying the turbo timing. #12 is the maximum amount of turbo timing it will apply, stated in 1* incremements. #10 is the rate at which the turbo timing is applied, stated in degrees per tenth of a second.

In my opinion, the turbo settings are very critical because it's easy to add too much turbo too early, which just builds heat and doesn't make the car any faster (because the motor gets overwhelmed by the timing dumped on it, and can't react fast enough).

One other thing worth noting about turbo timing, is that it is not RPM dependent. It's dependent on two things: the time delay (#14), and being WOT. If either of these are not met (or are met and then lost [such as releasing the throttle at all]), then the turbo disappears completely until the requirements are met again. More on this later.

Let's do another theoretical. Let's say you are running 20* of turbo (#12), with a 0.2/s delay (#14), and a slope rate of 6*/0.1s (#10). This means that:
  • once you hit (and hold) WOT, two tenths of a second later (0.2/s) the turbo timing will start to apply
  • the timing will apply at a rate of 6* per additional tenth of a second (after the original 0.2/s delay)
  • after 0.533 seconds, you will have applied all of your 20* of turbo timing, given that you stayed at WOT the whole time (0.2/s delay + an additional 0.33 for the 20* of timing to apply at a slope of 6*/0.1s)
  • if you lift the throttle at all, the turbo disappears and the whole process starts from the beginning after you hit WOT again

Now as you can see, there are options for 18, 24, and 30* per 0.1/s for the turbo slope (#10). These options basically add all of the turbo instantly, and combined with a very small turbo delay (#14), means that you can add A LOT of timing REALLY fast. This is usually not desirable.

--------------------------------


Now that boost and turbo timing have been explained, how do you gracefully merge the two together? That is tricky to answer, and it depends on a lot of factors. The brand/model of the motor, the wind of the motor, track type, traction level, ambient temperature, and your personal driving style are all large factors.

In a general sense, you want the boost timing to do most of the work on the infield of the track, and you want the turbo timing to help with the top speed on the straight away and perhaps any long sweepers or large flowing sections of your track.

If you have the turbo kicking in too quickly it can greatly add to the temperature of the motor, and may cause fading towards the end of your run. It can also cause erratic driving behavior on the infield of a track, because when you "lift" the throttle even momentarily, all the turbo disappears, and it can cause the car to "check-up." Typically I like to run about a 3:1 to 2:1 ratio of boost timing to turbo timing. However in modified, sometimes the ratio is closer, like 3:2, with the overall level of timing being much lower compared to spec motors.

When thinking of how to apply the two, keep in mind that you want boost timing to control some of the bottom end and all of the mid-range power. You want turbo to control the top end power. Notice how I said boost timing should control SOME of the bottom end? You can also apply too much boost timing too soon, just like turbo. You don't want your start RPM (#13) or your boost timing acceleration (#15) to be too early, as this can overtime the motor as well. The very beginning of the low-range power band is really dictated by your gearing (FDR) and your motor timing. These are both important factors as well. Motor timing is often overlooked in boosted setups, but it can play an important role in your overall setup.

I will not get into actual setup advice here, as it's more of a general guideline for you to understand how each setting works. Feel free to post your setup here (or send me a PM) and many of us in this thread will be more than willing to help you with your setup.

Hope this helps!

-T.J.
Thank you TJ....I just added 1 more point over your resume, now, you are 1 point ahead of TIM POTTER, tell him you are taking over his spot...(LOL)
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Old 12-22-2011, 09:26 AM   #8546
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is there any SP software that will add teh 2 at the same time is all i ask ? if yes, which one ?
I will have this forward to the software guy and ask him....
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Old 12-22-2011, 09:34 AM   #8547
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Thank you TJ....I just added 1 more point over your resume, now, you are 1 point ahead of TIM POTTER, tell him you are taking over his spot...(LOL)
1 point... I would say 50 points... I'm a slacker, you can take that to the bank.
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Old 12-23-2011, 04:52 AM   #8548
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We are still working on the STOCK1 software...it might not be ready when the REVENTON S and R released....since US don't run boost no more, we have the software testing over ASIA and Europe now and I don't know the schedule of the STOCK 1 release.

I would not let go the PRO yet....we sold out all of the PRO that we got last week. It is still a very good ESC to use for any open or MOD racing. At least I am keeping all my PRO...

But I have to say...now I have to buy alot of different chassis JUST to match all the different color of REVENTON that I will have...LOL.
the colors are great for sure im sure i will sneak another speedy in for sure with out the missis knowing.
i will wait for the stock 1 to be finalized before.
i will volunteer my self to test one for you australia
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Old 12-23-2011, 05:55 AM   #8549
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the colors are great for sure im sure i will sneak another speedy in for sure with out the missis knowing.
i will wait for the stock 1 to be finalized before.
i will volunteer my self to test one for you australia
you need to sneak in more than one speedy, more like 2 a BIG motor and a BIG car.
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Old 12-23-2011, 07:38 AM   #8550
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is there any SP software that will add teh 2 at the same time is all i ask ? if yes, which one ?
For fun, I did some testing this summer with supercharger timing first using 0 second delay and boost timing second by setting the start RPM to like 8000.

The car appear to be running in no timing mode in the infield as expected since full throttle was not being applied a significant amount of time. The odd part was that half way down the straight the timing kicked in HARD. Appeared that the super charger timing even with 0 delay was not being applied until the boost rpm level was achieved.

Just my observations from playing around. As far as being slower than the other ESC's out there, on our big outdoor track I never was under powered compared to them and actually went slower with my car when trying one of those other ESC's in comparison testing.

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