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Old 03-09-2009, 05:03 AM   #31
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We have some ideas locally here to even them up if run together. We'll have to wait and see once on track. Basically silver can with a final drive ratio limit and a max tire size. But after running M-chassis for years, I won't know until I can actually run one to see if what lap times look like.
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I dont think they are going to let you run that against Tamiya M- chassis cars. Personally I would still be stoked to have one but, Im just wondering about misplaced enthusiasm on your part.
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Old 03-09-2009, 05:17 AM   #32
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I'm not normally an advocate of having multiple classes in club racing but you will never get a performance equivalence between a 4wd/low cg HPI mini and a 2wd/high cg Tamiya mini unless you restrict the 4wd car's gearing so much that it stops being fun.

I absolutely believe that any regulated race class should run 4wd mini seperate from Tamiya mini. This HPI (superb bodies and funky chassis) should run with the existing ABC, Xpress and Active Mini's, should add up to a competitive, diverse class.

Silvercan should be OK indoors but I would expect them to feel slow outdoors due to the increased handling ability. Spec a mild motor and a sensible tyre and they should be a lot of fun.

I had a few runs with the ABC and Xpress Mini's outdoors at Carlisle last year, with 19T motors these things were a hoot, you could really feel them move around on the track and the shells looks superb. Felt like they were super-fast but were actually 2 seconds a lap slower than a 19T tourer.
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Old 03-09-2009, 08:58 AM   #33
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I would imagine that most will ellect to run one of the 4wd platforms. Which like I posted above I plan on doing. But I disagree that silver cans feels slow and are slow. My as well as most of the other M03 racers locally put lap times in that are routinely as fast if not faster than the 27t stock touring class. So when I run my M03 in the class I will have no worries. Plus ask anyone that runs GT3 in the TCS series if 4wd silver can is too slow.

Time will tell, but another seperate mini class won't make it alone. You need to be able to have it mixed together.
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I'm not normally an advocate of having multiple classes in club racing but you will never get a performance equivalence between a 4wd/low cg HPI mini and a 2wd/high cg Tamiya mini unless you restrict the 4wd car's gearing so much that it stops being fun.

I absolutely believe that any regulated race class should run 4wd mini seperate from Tamiya mini. This HPI (superb bodies and funky chassis) should run with the existing ABC, Xpress and Active Mini's, should add up to a competitive, diverse class.

Silvercan should be OK indoors but I would expect them to feel slow outdoors due to the increased handling ability. Spec a mild motor and a sensible tyre and they should be a lot of fun.

I had a few runs with the ABC and Xpress Mini's outdoors at Carlisle last year, with 19T motors these things were a hoot, you could really feel them move around on the track and the shells looks superb. Felt like they were super-fast but were actually 2 seconds a lap slower than a 19T tourer.
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Old 03-09-2009, 11:13 AM   #34
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I've seen 2wd and 4wd mini's run together, and they are pretty equal. But the 4wds are all belt driven, so maybe the drive train loss made up for the 2wd handicap. But this new mini is a shaft, so things may get a little tricky. I want to try lap time comparo between the chassis when I get the cup racer.
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Old 03-09-2009, 11:25 AM   #35
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I have run the Genetics chassis against the Mini/M03 series chassis.I have run the TCS Series at the highest levels in the M03 class and can guarantee these cars will never find parity.Running a mixed class would be fine,but the 4wd cars are at a tuning advantage.I agree that running a slower motor package in the 4wd cars will only make them not a fun endeavor.Why not run separate classes and grow the 4wd mini class itself.
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Old 03-09-2009, 01:11 PM   #36
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I guess I just don't understand why these little cars need to go 40mph to be fun. Everything is always faster faster faster. I enjoy close racing much much more. And 19t would be silly in these. The ABC SPEC series is going to be running silver cans. The crazy motor power is what killed the Micro RS4s...it just get's silly. Locally we will be running silver cans and just having a good time racing...just like M03s. This isn't meant to be a sedan replacement.
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Old 03-09-2009, 01:29 PM   #37
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I guess I just don't understand why these little cars need to go 40mph to be fun. Everything is always faster faster faster. I enjoy close racing much much more. And 19t would be silly in these. The ABC SPEC series is going to be running silver cans. The crazy motor power is what killed the Micro RS4s...it just get's silly. Locally we will be running silver cans and just having a good time racing...just like M03s. This isn't meant to be a sedan replacement.
Please, anything but silver cans. Not because of speed -- it's just too expensive to run silver cans if yo want to be competitive!

21.5 might be perfect...
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Old 03-09-2009, 01:31 PM   #38
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I guess I just don't understand why these little cars need to go 40mph to be fun. Everything is always faster faster faster. I enjoy close racing much much more. And 19t would be silly in these. The ABC SPEC series is going to be running silver cans. The crazy motor power is what killed the Micro RS4s...it just get's silly. Locally we will be running silver cans and just having a good time racing...just like M03s. This isn't meant to be a sedan replacement.
I agree. Lots of racers around me are also saying that they want to go faster and faster. Black can speed is all you need to be fun with a mini. I don't know what the need for speed is recently.

The allure of mini class are the bodies imo. Sure I can put a cookie cutter body, but I'm gonna race that new fiat500 body from tamiya Plus, that body style has a rollover antenna, I mean body

Scale look is the way to go these days, and I think HPI hit the spot with the chassis and body line up.
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Old 03-09-2009, 01:43 PM   #39
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See, I see the 21.5 in Vintage class and I think on anything but a large outdoor track that it would be too much. Plus handout silver cans are cheap...and much easier for rookies to race rather than buying a $200 esc/motor combo. Have the race directors handout the silver cans and have a strict "no tuning" rule and your set.

Plus...having to stuff a brushless setup this car...yikes...no thanks.

I think the speed of the black can would be nice too, but mine always burn up too easy??? Maybe it's just me
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Old 03-09-2009, 02:00 PM   #40
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See, I see the 21.5 in Vintage class and I think on anything but a large outdoor track that it would be too much. Plus handout silver cans are cheap...and much easier for rookies to race rather than buying a $200 esc/motor combo. Have the race directors handout the silver cans and have a strict "no tuning" rule and your set.
Really? We run 21.5 and silver cans together in Vintage and they're pretty even, at least on our track. Novak Havoc motor/ESC combo runs about $130. Handout motors are great unless you're the one who has to manage them, maintain them, and help everyone with them.

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Plus...having to stuff a brushless setup this car...yikes...no thanks.
Motors are the same size, ESCs are roughly the same size, what's the issue?

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I think the speed of the black can would be nice too, but mine always burn up too easy??? Maybe it's just me
Nope, that's what black cans do!
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Old 03-09-2009, 02:03 PM   #41
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A GTB is the same size as a GTX???
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Old 03-09-2009, 02:07 PM   #42
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A GTB is the same size as a GTX???
Well, there are comparisons that can be drawn either way. A Tekin RS brushless ESC is smaller than most ESCs.

The point is that I don't see where it would be so difficult to go brushless. Lots of people run 17.5 in M-chassis cars without any problems.
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Old 03-09-2009, 02:16 PM   #43
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And I would be fine myself running 21.5...not 17.5. But I already race Sedan, mini and F1 and I think others are in the same boat. This would be an extra "fun" class. I don't know too many that are gonna drop $200+ on an RS and another $75 on a motor for a $185 car. Then you have people thinking about running the class thinking they now need an RS and the latest 17.5 just to compete.
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Well, there are comparisons that can be drawn either way. A Tekin RS brushless ESC is smaller than most ESCs.

The point is that I don't see where it would be so difficult to go brushless. Lots of people run 17.5 in M-chassis cars without any problems.
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Old 03-09-2009, 02:26 PM   #44
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And I would be fine myself running 21.5...not 17.5. But I already race Sedan, mini and F1 and I think others are in the same boat. This would be an extra "fun" class. I don't know too many that are gonna drop $200+ on an RS and another $75 on a motor for a $185 car. Then you have people thinking about running the class thinking they now need an RS and the latest 17.5 just to compete.
It would totally be an extra "fun" class for me as well (not like the others aren't fun...) so I hear you. It's just that the silver can is anything but the great equalizer. Just go through the most recent few pages of the TCS thread if you have a strong stomach. Personally, I like silver can racing when everyone lives by the spirit of it. I don't enjoy getting blown off the track by someone with a $45 red dot motor or other such shenanigans.
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Old 03-09-2009, 02:32 PM   #45
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I agree silver can and does get out of hand. That's why you need handouts that are maintained at a specific max rpm...13k ish @5v works. And motors are blind draw.
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It would totally be an extra "fun" class for me as well (not like the others aren't fun...) so I hear you. It's just that the silver can is anything but the great equalizer. Just go through the most recent few pages of the TCS thread if you have a strong stomach. Personally, I like silver can racing when everyone lives by the spirit of it. I don't enjoy getting blown off the track by someone with a $45 red dot motor or other such shenanigans.
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