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Old 07-07-2014, 10:20 PM   #6721
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Originally Posted by bkspeedo View Post
I've been playing with wheelbase as well lately and found shorter to be quite good. I'm currently running -8 deg (shorter wheel base) and the car is great on high traction carpet and medium\low asphalt.

We just ran on our newly restored asphalt track and I had the fastest car on the track even over Kyle in Mod. Just had some issues driving which kept me out of a TQ and possible win in the main.

Even on carpet the car has been great with this short wheelbase. I did try long +6, +8 deg and it worked good for low grip tires but i like the shorter for high grip tires.

Of course in the end it comes down to driving style and other setup features as to how everything works together.
Interesting.

What is the tire combination that your running with the SWB setup vs. LWB with the low grip tires?

SWB is a funny thing - I have often found that while it might make the car feel more nimble and agile the lap times/drivability were still better with the LWB.

I haven't tried going as short as you have.
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Old 07-07-2014, 10:56 PM   #6722
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The new Gravity carpet tires are super soft and extremely grippe where the first batch of Gravity tires that we used at MHIC were hard and did not produce a lot of grip. They felt good on the car but just did not produce much grip.

A few weeks ago i started playing with wheelbase from -10 deg to +8 deg. +8 to +6 actually worked really well for the low grip tire, the car seemed to rotate better around the high speed corners were the shorter seemed to stick the rear a bit more. Regardless of other changes shorter just didn't produce good lap times. When i went longer I ran .1 to .2 faster on average with low grip tires.

However when we started using the new Gravity tires which produce insane grip i found the shorter wheelbase was faster by a tenth or more on average.

Since I'm using the same car on Asphalt and Carpet currently i don't change much when i go from from inside to outside. Mostly flex settings, rear suspension, and camber. I know the car is fast though because I'm not that far off Kyle and the same or slightly faster than Art on carpet.

It's worth giving it a try if you have time to test, this change does take some time to complete as it's a lot of upper link length change and you need to add or remove toe link shims to keep it at the same angle.

Some of the feel change with the wheelbase may also be the CVD angle as it does change quite a bit.
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Old 07-07-2014, 11:12 PM   #6723
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Next time Monti try the harder bars -- 1.4f/1.2r -- should help
The problem with thicker sway-bars is they can cause you to loose to much steering and corner speed. This past Saturday's practice on carpet i went from the 1.2 (red) to 1.3 (black) for the front sway-bar and lost .1 on average. I only go heavier on sway-bars in the front if the car is over-steering to much.

Same goes for the rear, the car will rotate much better with a thin or no swaybar in the back.
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Old 07-07-2014, 11:12 PM   #6724
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Originally Posted by bkspeedo View Post
The new Gravity carpet tires are super soft and extremely grippe where the first batch of Gravity tires that we used at MHIC were hard and did not produce a lot of grip. They felt good on the car but just did not produce much grip.

A few weeks ago i started playing with wheelbase from -10 deg to +8 deg. +8 to +6 actually worked really well for the low grip tire, the car seemed to rotate better around the high speed corners were the shorter seemed to stick the rear a bit more. Regardless of other changes shorter just didn't produce good lap times. When i went longer I ran .1 to .2 faster on average with low grip tires.

However when we started using the new Gravity tires which produce insane grip i found the shorter wheelbase was faster by a tenth or more on average.

Since I'm using the same car on Asphalt and Carpet currently i don't change much when i go from from inside to outside. Mostly flex settings, rear suspension, and camber. I know the car is fast though because I'm not that far off Kyle and the same or slightly faster than Art on carpet.

It's worth giving it a try if you have time to test, this change does take some time to complete as it's a lot of upper link length change and you need to add or remove toe link shims to keep it at the same angle.

Some of the feel change with the wheelbase may also be the CVD angle as it does change quite a bit.
Outdoor this weekend. Will give it a try.
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Old 07-08-2014, 06:55 AM   #6725
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Brent, do you adjust the shims for the toe link when making these big swings in wheelbase, or does the bump toe not get affected?
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Old 07-08-2014, 08:05 AM   #6726
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Brent, do you adjust the shims for the toe link when making these big swings in wheelbase, or does the bump toe not get affected?
Yes you do have to adjust the shims for the toe link. With the -8 deg i'm currently running I'm only using a 1.75 shim under the toe link. When i tried +8 deg i was using something like 5mm of shims.
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Old 07-08-2014, 09:49 AM   #6727
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Originally Posted by bkspeedo View Post
Yes you do have to adjust the shims for the toe link. With the -8 deg i'm currently running I'm only using a 1.75 shim under the toe link. When i tried +8 deg i was using something like 5mm of shims.
Thanks, always looking for new things to try a free up the car when the track cools.
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Old 07-08-2014, 09:56 AM   #6728
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Thanks, always looking for new things to try a free up the car when the track cools.
Those AM06m will do it for you!
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Old 07-08-2014, 10:15 AM   #6729
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Those AM06m will do it for you!
Are you running them up front too?
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:09 AM   #6730
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Are you running them up front too?
Only used on asphalt.

Front/rear had better balance using the m's
Rear only m's; too free for me. Would work for me on carpet.

Have stuck to using the s on asphalt with short links,
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:18 AM   #6731
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Which balls are the P13-4 links designed to be used with?
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:33 AM   #6732
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Only used on asphalt.

Front/rear had better balance using the m's
Rear only m's; too free for me. Would work for me on carpet.

Have stuck to using the s on asphalt with short links,
Only racing on asphalt right now, and still have a L chassis car, the M's on the rear helped, but the car is not "too loose" yet, albeit a slightly different setup, no bars, etc.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:45 AM   #6733
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Which balls are the P13-4 links designed to be used with?
St24 and at24l
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:45 AM   #6734
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Which balls are the P13-4 links designed to be used with?
St24 and st24l
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Old 07-08-2014, 12:06 PM   #6735
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To switch from Type I to Type II SRS/RHS I just swap the screws, I don't do anything to P09, correct?
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