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Old 03-19-2012, 01:33 PM   #4486
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You've gotta watch this video one more time. It's amazing.

F1 A-Main at 2012 ROAR Carpet Nationals: http://youtu.be/jpdxCkV8n6g

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Old 03-19-2012, 02:43 PM   #4487
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Originally Posted by ijdod View Post
+1

To be honest, I don't think this post got half the attention it deserves, as it does make most arguments about scale liveries moot. And that's just a current one. If we look back, we can find some rather funky 'real' liveries. Honda's 'Earth livery, the Williams FW21 SuperTec (it had, wait for it... FLAMES!), the BAR two-sided livery, the '94 Pacifics, Footworks FA15, and so on.
Don't know if you can count the BAR 555/Luck Strikes, FIA banned the paint scheme. One of my personal favorites was the Williams FW15c, with the cartoon cutaway and the "Sega" legs driving!
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Old 03-19-2012, 02:52 PM   #4488
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Here are some pics of the top ten F1 drivers from last weekend 2012 ROAR Carpet Nationals.
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For being a fun class/hobby there sure is a lack of smiling happy people.
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Old 03-19-2012, 03:49 PM   #4489
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Your welcome to come race one of them anytime . Its arrive and drive in the blastf1 championship, i own all the cars and recruit all the drivers (my friends mostly).they pay for damages, tires and batteries i set up the championship.
Where in Michigan are you and where do you race?
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Old 03-19-2012, 03:54 PM   #4490
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I was thinkn the same thing Cross, every driver off the podium is smiling . I watched the video of the race and am wondering (no lap times to look at) how t phalen lost that huge lead at the end, the driver who was classified second really was layn down the laps near the end, it was unfortunate there was contact at the end but cuddos to him for giving the spot back, but just jumped back on the throttle a bit to early after that. Seemed like there really wasnt a good passing zone on that circuit with cars so evenly matched. Wish i lived a bit closer to texas!
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Old 03-19-2012, 04:06 PM   #4491
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Where in Michigan are you and where do you race?
I live in southwestern michigan about 90 minutes from chicago (coloma, mi). We race outside on a parking lot and sometimes at my parents driveway, which is a fun little circuit. I set up tracks such as barcelona, interlogos, estoril, jerez, any f1 track that can fit the rectangular lot. We still run 27turn stocks with nimh batteries, recently went to rubber tires. Races are always 7.2 miles in length with a mandatory battery change (pit stops are timed 1m20sec). The races usually take around twenty-five minutes. I have fifteen different chassis available to run, and each one is designated a f1 team. BP ive been following you on facebook and love your work, ive always wanted to sell finished f1 bodies to customers.
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Old 03-19-2012, 04:07 PM   #4492
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So I have been out of town for a week and not paying too much attention to whats been going on.
I just got done looking through the last few pages of posts and I have a few opinions.
First of all great to see a strong turnout at a big race, can only help F1 grow.
And now for the criticisms.
Aside from the fact that the winner didnt look like an actual F1 car, my biggest criticism is that the car wasnt detailed to a concourse level, for example, there were no decals on the tires, no attention given to the wings, etc....
Way back when I ran the indoor champs at Cleveland, the concourse winner was detailed to the moon.
When you start talking about concourse, especially in classes like F1, VTA and USGT, concourse should be treated as more than just a best paintjob contest.
I have stated before that although my business is 99% F1 replicas, that I believe that there is room for non replicas, as long as they are believable as a racecar. While on vacation I attended the 12hours of Sebring, and I saw some schemes that would look great on an F1 car just as a for instance.
Not trying to attack anyone, just my observations.
I hope the class keeps growing like it has
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Old 03-19-2012, 04:09 PM   #4493
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to add to that, the circuits usually are about 700 ft in length resulting in about 23 to 35 second lap times
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Old 03-19-2012, 04:15 PM   #4494
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Originally Posted by eff one View Post
I live in southwestern michigan about 90 minutes from chicago (coloma, mi). We race outside on a parking lot and sometimes at my parents driveway, which is a fun little circuit. I set up tracks such as barcelona, interlogos, estoril, jerez, any f1 track that can fit the rectangular lot. We still run 27turn stocks with nimh batteries, recently went to rubber tires. Races are always 7.2 miles in length with a mandatory battery change (pit stops are timed 1m20sec). The races usually take around twenty-five minutes. I have fifteen different chassis available to run, and each one is designated a f1 team. BP ive been following you on facebook and love your work, ive always wanted to sell finished f1 bodies to customers.
I know where you are, you are not too far from Gingerman Raceway.
Weve got a handful of F1 guys that would come over and run with you once in a while if your game. I am working on a few things in regards to F1 here in the midwest, so stay tuned
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Old 03-19-2012, 04:19 PM   #4495
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Originally Posted by BP SHADOW View Post
I know where you are, you are not too far from Gingerman Raceway.
Weve got a handful of F1 guys that would come over and run with you once in a while if your game. I am working on a few things in regards to F1 here in the midwest, so stay tuned
I try to go to gingerman at least once a year to watch races, i love that track!! I live twenty minutes away from said circuit. Where do you live?
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Old 03-19-2012, 04:19 PM   #4496
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I agree on what BP says about Concourse vs a paintjob. It is a fine paintjob on the winning car, however I don't think it's concourse material. I've been to some races where people will go as far as painting rivets around faceted areas, radio antennas, in car cameras, driver cooling hoses for enclosed cockpits, and simulated markings on virgin rubber to make the tires look like sticker tires fresh off the rack.
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Old 03-19-2012, 04:39 PM   #4497
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This is one of my favorite classes, and it was a no-brainer to put it into the event. I think that too much of RC racing has lost it's way, forgetting that what makes it popular in the first place, is usually that it looks like a real race car that you watch on TV or at the track. You should have heard the screams when we made it a rule that you have to put headlights and taillights on a full-bodied car... LOL.

Suffice it to say, I'm a big F1 fan and a big scale fan, both of which mean that I personally support these types of classes for ROAR competition. Do I feel that the effort is in vain after reading some of the comments? Perhaps yes. I feel like some of you are throwing the baby out with the bath water. With all the positive things we were able to do in getting F1 on the roster so quickly, it seems that there's more focus on a difference of opinion for concourse judging. Seems to lack perspective a little bit. I DO value all opinions in the discussion, and I'll extend anyone all the respect they deserve, and long as it's mutual. Thanks for the feedback.

P.S. Elitists?! Not a chance. LOL. Classes like the F1 class are the antithesis of the elitist classes. There's no sponsored drivers (or very few), and the emphasis still seems to be on fun and scale - the two elements that are lost on the "elite" classes. I don't view the RC version of F1 racing as elitist at all - quite the opposite. I'm sure there are more laughs and fun in one round in the F1 class than in an entire event filled with sponsored drivers and high levels of factory participation. The qualities that are currently enjoyed by the F1 class are the genesis of any great class. It's when too much of the fun, affordability and scale are sacrificed for performance at any cost, too many drivers looking to make a career out of their hobby, and the scale appearance gives way to any aerodynamic "innovation" because someone wants to sell more bodies. No, this is my favorite type of class, and I'd want to keep it JUST LIKE IT IS. ;o)
Steve I'm glad to hear that F1 is one of your favorite classes, and that you want to keep it "JUST LIKE IT IS", quote. My question is: What exactly do you mean by that statement? Does that mean direct drive solid axle only, or is the FGX with it's IRS going to be considered legal? I agree obviously with Troy McKune that allowing a car such as the FGX with IRS and sliding kingpin front suspension is NOT going to drastically drive up the cost of F1. Look at the ridiculous price of over $280 that Tamiya charges for the F104X!! The idea that some seem to have that F1 can be kept as a sub $250 per car class is quite nieve!(probably didn't spell that right) I say: Allow the FGX in the class; make it legal! It is the most realistic F1 car currently our there. And this rubbish that some stir up about it being 190mm vs the 180mm width of the F104 is just silly. Visually you don't even notice the difference, and on carpet the F104 is just as fast if not faster due to it's lighter weight and direct drive. On asphalt it may be a different story though; the FGX should have an advantage due to it's IRS. It all balances out.

The reason why I was so upset about some accepting the judgement of the ROAR people giving the guy with the non-F1 "lowrider" paint scheme first place is that in my long experience in rc racing I have found that everytime you have a class that works as it is, and you have a specific set of rules designed to not only foster fair competition, but also respect the spirit of the class; someone inevitably comes along who wants to race in the class along with their buddies, but they want/expect those already in the class to bend the rules for them as they don't like certain aspects of the rules. In the past we did bend on the basis that we thought having more people in the class made it worth it to compromise. Boy was that a mistake!!! It wasn't long before more came and wanted concessions and before we knew it our great little class was large but it no longer resembled what it started out as. And eventually it self-destructed because the "interlopers" drove out all the original racers in the class. In effect, they "hijacked" the class!

A guy winning the concourse with a touring car style paint scheme may not seem like a big deal to some, or how about a guy who shows up with the current Corally F1 car and wants to race with the other "real" F1 cars may not seem like such a big deal; after all you want to encourage more people to race F1; but, if you compromise in even these things, you open the barn door too wide and before you know it the F1 class has been hijacked and corrupted by people who don't appreciate the "spirit" of the F1 class.

My way of addressing this issue may seem extreme to some, but I am passionate about keeping F1 pure and scale!!

Last edited by Team Lotus; 03-19-2012 at 05:07 PM.
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Old 03-19-2012, 04:55 PM   #4498
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I try to go to gingerman at least once a year to watch races, i love that track!! I live twenty minutes away from said circuit. Where do you live?
Im in Waterford, about 3 hours from you.
I ran my shifter kart in the rain at Gingerman, would love to try it in the dry
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Old 03-19-2012, 05:27 PM   #4499
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Im in Waterford, about 3 hours from you.
I ran my shifter kart in the rain at Gingerman, would love to try it in the dry
Nice, ive raced karts at michiana raceway park (buchanan mi) and southbend raceway park. Rotax is awesome, fast as hell!! Ive only tried a shifter once it was tuff. If u guys are willing to make the drive i would gladly give you a car to run at one of our races. You could always bring your own but im sure you have updated to brushless and lipo. I can put up to twenty cars on track at once with my kopropo timing sytem. We normally have about ten guys, eight of which are really good drivers, its pretty competitive! How much advance notice would you need? We usually race sundays around 4 or 5, takes roughly 3hrs to complete a grand prix including clean up. I try to get in four rounds from spring to fall.
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Old 03-19-2012, 05:47 PM   #4500
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I grew up way north of you guys in Petoskey, MI
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