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Old 07-21-2009, 01:14 PM   #406
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Originally Posted by redbones View Post
maybe I don't need such a low ratio. My duo17.5 temps at about 145F at 4.5 on my 416. So I am thinking maybe around a 4.3 will do on my TB03. A 82T spur with a range of 43-47 will get me in the 4.65-4.25 which is just right. Actually, the setup is not all that different from my 416 other than the camber link/roll center heights. There's no time to test it before the race so we'll see what it can do!

Yeah I think you are right about the gearing, should get you right where you want performance wise. Duo I usually get to 170-180 on big tracks cause they handle heat pretty well.

Well hey, goodluck at the race and hope you make them eat shaft!
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Old 07-21-2009, 01:53 PM   #407
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Got a question for all the TB 03 drivers.
Read a lot of feedback on the TB03 and I'm impressed. I'm looking for a new Tamiya car right now. I'm driving the TT01E with hops ups. Doing great but want some more. Next year I'm planning to race the GT2 class.
The "problem" is I cant seem to choose between a TB03 or a TA05 V2. So I'm looking for some advise here.
Havent read a lot of feedback on the V2 yet . But that will start hopefully soon.

Thanx
Like I said to someone earlier really try to drive one, or something similar so you can see and feel the difference for yourself. If you just plan on using stock/17.5 motors you'll like either car just fine. TA05V2 has a little more weight shifted forward because of the battery being moved forward in the V2. So that car might have a little more steering out of the box than a TB or standard TA. TA05 will get pepples from time to time in the pulleys and spur gear that you have to pick out. TB03 has a completly enclosed drivetrain, no little pebbles can mess up your drivetrain. TA05 will be a little smoother in initial throttle and braking, TB03 will be a little quicker in acceleration and brake response. TA05 is very quite on the track, TB03 shaftdrive has a distinct "whine" at high speeds that I LOVE!

That is just my opinion on some of the differences. Hope it was enough to help you out. Another thing to think about is that since you already have been driving a shaft car, going to the TB03 will be a seamless switch for you. But if you have never driven a belt drive, you really need to before you buy your next car. That way you can be fair to both chassis's and be fair to yourself too
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Old 07-21-2009, 02:27 PM   #408
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The car seems to be oversteering a little at low speeds, and pushing at higher speeds. While I'm sure much of it is due to my driving and set-up inexperience, I'm wondering also if the car itself is suitable for a 5.5T?
Haha you sound like me, wanting to go too fast But hey I respect that, you got the guts to just go for it 5.5 turn with 2 cell lipo? If so yes, that is a lot of power to try to drive. If you only have the 5.5 to run, go to 5 cell NIMH, or turn down your EPA for throttle to slow it down some till you get used to it/get suspension sorted out. Oversteer is probably from too much power and not being smooth enough with the triggerfinger. Push at high speeds are probably coming from too high of speeds! LOL! But it can be done with the car, just would need a good setup... But it would be hard...shaft cars are very hard to drive in mod. Belt cars really are the best way to go for powerhandling and smoothness.hmmm I got a 4 turn SP motor maybe I will try in a couple of weeks in the TB


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I've had the back suspension arm ripped out on 2 occasions, after overcooking high-speed corners and brushing the side of the car against the barriers. Argh! I have the essential hop-ups - the entire drive-train is alum, as are the suspension mounts (I'm hoping these will hold the arms better in case of future accidents...), and the steering linkages.
Oh man sorry to hear of your damage. Those are scary wrecks for sure! Since you are still learning and driving a crazy fast motor, I suggest you use these..they are cheap and save a lot of damage. I used to use these on a TC3 I raced a long time ago. http://www.brpracing.com/6230.html
You know that was something I was going to go into detail with later, the aluminum blocks will actually bend EASIER in this car that a carbon fibre car because of all the flex in the chassis. Until you get better at driving I would go back to plastic suspension blocks. They usually won't hold a tweak like the aluminum ones will if you smack something hard. Either that or get the carbon tub chassis from Tamiya. That will be my next upgrade.
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Old 07-21-2009, 04:34 PM   #409
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Originally Posted by Markus View Post
Timmie,

I raced last weekend at GB in my full TCS trim.
*side note* I've been struggling finding a setup for my all over the place driving style. I haven't found one that lets me drive hard comfortably but I can get it around the track decently.
On this day I could not get the car to turn-in. (my fault, too much kickup and high roll center. I was racing on a uber traction track the week before and didn't think to change it)

notes:
Luckily Randy raced the GT2 class so I could guage what the fast guys would run, he was in TCS trim also.
the traction is not bad, probably above average ol' parking lot (they soda up the driveline).
I was geared at 80/38 LRP motor, Tekin RS, temped all day around 170 (i had no turn-in so used brakes) I had good rip coming out of the corners but the Xrays, TC5s, etc. would start to pull away halfway down the straight. I'm thinking I need to go to a 80/41 or so if I can get the turn-in I want without brakes) I used B3's. but I think A's would have been better since it wasn't that hot out. This will vary of course depending where the sun is.


I'll try it again this saturday for their club race before TCS.
Oh ok thanks for the info. What do they use for track barriers there? A friend of mine that is coming up to race mini wanted to know. Also, what are the laptimes for cars in 17.5 there? I know they layout changes probably but just so I have a idea of size.

What blocks are you running in the front? What you are complaining about is exactly what I saw when I first drove the car. I drive pretty aggressive so I feel you on the frustration of having a car too planted. I have noticed that weight transfer with this car is a little weird. Not bad, just different.

I have no experience with LRP motor other than knowing they can take some crazy overheating and still work lol. Me and Jimmy Mac have seen a local guy get one to 280F, let it cool off and went right back out for the next qualifier What was your motor timed at? If it wasn't advanced, you might want to try the same gearing as before and just try it out. That way you got low end pull and still gain some up top.

Me and my friend Laurie will be up in MD friday night. So I'm sure to run into you Saturday. I called up there they said it was just a practice day, but whatever is clever. Let me know if I can help you at all with your car. See ya then
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Old 07-21-2009, 04:48 PM   #410
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Either that or get the carbon tub chassis from Tamiya. That will be my next upgrade.
carbon tub is a bit of a disappointment IMHO.

it is stiffer.. but there's no weight savings. the TA05 carbon tub was stiffer and lighter. jury is still out if there's a performance advantage.
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Old 07-21-2009, 04:49 PM   #411
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I'm not running brushless, but I see the same issues: low speed oversteer with high speed understeer. In general, what are some variables a person could play with to correct both? It seems that what you'd do to fix one would just make the other worse.
When are you experiencing the low speed oversteer? When you let off the throttle or even when you are still on throttle and steering?

If you are running a brushed stock motor they have a good amount of drag when you let off. If your speed controller has a adjustment for drag brake turn it down to zero and try it out. If it is still oversteers adjust your throttle EPA on your radio so the car will slightly roll when in neutral. If this doesn't solve it either your setup needs work or you need to try turning your dual rate down on the steering.

on power I need to know what diff type you are using on the front.
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Old 07-21-2009, 05:00 PM   #412
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carbon tub is a bit of a disappointment IMHO.

it is stiffer.. but there's no weight savings. the TA05 carbon tub was stiffer and lighter. jury is still out if there's a performance advantage.
Sorry the carbon tub didn't do the trick for you.

But I can't wait to try one out because it is stiffer. That is my reason for wanting it. Plastic works well for low to mid traction, but in high traction it absorbs too much and hurts how fast the car rotates. Go to stiff on the setup and the car gets wishy washy, etc etc. Idk, I will order one when I get back so I can try it out on the crazy indoor asphalt track at the Coliseum.
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Old 07-21-2009, 05:04 PM   #413
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Sorry the carbon tub didn't do the trick for you.

But I can't wait to try one out because it is stiffer. That is my reason for wanting it. Plastic works well for low to mid traction, but in high traction it absorbs too much and hurts how fast the car rotates. Go to stiff on the setup and the car gets wishy washy, etc etc. Idk, I will order one when I get back so I can try it out on the crazy indoor asphalt track at the Coliseum.
more disappointed because of the lack of weight savings.

ill be testing mine at our indoor asphalt track fairly soon.
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Old 07-22-2009, 08:23 AM   #414
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What do they use for track barriers there? Also, what are the laptimes for cars in 17.5 there? I know they layout changes probably but just so I have a idea of size.

What blocks are you running in the front? What you are complaining about is exactly what I saw when I first drove the car.
Track barriers are 1X4's bolted together. They use plastic 'flapper' piece at the apex.
I can't remember the fastest lap but laps were 15 to 16 second laps for 17.5

I'm running A/XA. I broke the front XA so I used a 415 A.

Do you think switching to the C/C blocks will help with car's turn-in?

Last edited by Markus; 07-22-2009 at 08:55 AM.
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Old 07-22-2009, 09:52 AM   #415
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Haha you sound like me, wanting to go too fast But hey I respect that, you got the guts to just go for it 5.5 turn with 2 cell lipo? If so yes, that is a lot of power to try to drive. If you only have the 5.5 to run, go to 5 cell NIMH, or turn down your EPA for throttle to slow it down some till you get used to it/get suspension sorted out. Oversteer is probably from too much power and not being smooth enough with the triggerfinger. Push at high speeds are probably coming from too high of speeds! LOL! But it can be done with the car, just would need a good setup... But it would be hard...shaft cars are very hard to drive in mod. Belt cars really are the best way to go for powerhandling and smoothness.hmmm I got a 4 turn SP motor maybe I will try in a couple of weeks in the TB



You know that was something I was going to go into detail with later, the aluminum blocks will actually bend EASIER in this car that a carbon fibre car because of all the flex in the chassis. Until you get better at driving I would go back to plastic suspension blocks. They usually won't hold a tweak like the aluminum ones will if you smack something hard. Either that or get the carbon tub chassis from Tamiya. That will be my next upgrade.
Thanks all for the replies!

I'm using 6-cell Nimh batteries, but yeah, for now I've turned my EPA down to about 90%. 80% is more comfortable, but the speed is addictive though The first track I ever went to was frequented by guys running nitro, and my friend and I just sort of took those cars' speed as some sort of benchmark. We were using kit silver cans then, and the nitro cars just seemed jaw-droppingly rapid


Ohh....wish I had known about the alum bits being even easier to bend BEFORE getting them. Ah well...I'll probably get the carbon-reinforced tub, but I hear carbon-reinforced parts are brittle and hence easier to break?

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5.5T is way too much motor for this car. i think this car works best in 17.5 with 13.5 near its limit. anything more and the car will be out of its comfort zone. try a 17.5 motor...and you'll notice a huge difference.

your high speed understeer/low speed over steer might be a product of the motor.
hmm...I guess it's a little disappointing that a 13.5T is about all the TB03 can handle, but I guess that's if lipo is being used? Would it follow then, that if I use NimH batteries it should be able to handle a slightly lower-turn motor? My friend actually runs a 9T in his TT01E (somehow!). I'm thinking if I switch over to a similar motor we can finally compete/bash on a level basis and we'll be able to see just how much faster the Tb03 is compared to a TT01E

I know any one who's serious about speed uses protoform bodies. I'm sticking with the tamiya NSX body though (kit wing replaced with a proper racing wing) just because it is sooo much prettier. Would doing that be much of a compromise?
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:26 AM   #416
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Sorry the carbon tub didn't do the trick for you.

But I can't wait to try one out because it is stiffer. That is my reason for wanting it. Plastic works well for low to mid traction, but in high traction it absorbs too much and hurts how fast the car rotates. Go to stiff on the setup and the car gets wishy washy, etc etc. Idk, I will order one when I get back so I can try it out on the crazy indoor asphalt track at the Coliseum.
gonna be testing the carbon tub this weekend. might as well since all the other parts are carbon composite It's a high traction asphalt so it should be ok. The stock one is a little too soft imo even for 17.5.
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Old 07-22-2009, 12:15 PM   #417
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If you are having an over steer problem going into a corner as the car slows down try either more caster angle (front arm kick) or just tighten the rear diff a little more.

Both will help with the on power push the car has out of the box.
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Old 07-22-2009, 01:09 PM   #418
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Originally Posted by Timmie View Post
Like I said to someone earlier really try to drive one, or something similar so you can see and feel the difference for yourself. If you just plan on using stock/17.5 motors you'll like either car just fine. TA05V2 has a little more weight shifted forward because of the battery being moved forward in the V2. So that car might have a little more steering out of the box than a TB or standard TA. TA05 will get pepples from time to time in the pulleys and spur gear that you have to pick out. TB03 has a completly enclosed drivetrain, no little pebbles can mess up your drivetrain. TA05 will be a little smoother in initial throttle and braking, TB03 will be a little quicker in acceleration and brake response. TA05 is very quite on the track, TB03 shaftdrive has a distinct "whine" at high speeds that I LOVE!

That is just my opinion on some of the differences. Hope it was enough to help you out. Another thing to think about is that since you already have been driving a shaft car, going to the TB03 will be a seamless switch for you. But if you have never driven a belt drive, you really need to before you buy your next car. That way you can be fair to both chassis's and be fair to yourself too
Thanks Timmie !!

That's some real good advise I can use. I was sure enough to help me out.
I never drove a belt drive before so gonna hae to look for one to drive on a track
Thanks again

JD
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Old 07-22-2009, 02:20 PM   #419
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Track barriers are 1X4's bolted together. They use plastic 'flapper' piece at the apex.
I can't remember the fastest lap but laps were 15 to 16 second laps for 17.5

I'm running A/XA. I broke the front XA so I used a 415 A.

Do you think switching to the C/C blocks will help with car's turn-in?
Thanks, I appreciate the info about the track. I'll pass it a long to my friend. Oh and one more thing, whats the power situation there? They have generators or do we pit in the store?

No I don't think so, going C/C in the front should actually decrease turn in if you were using A/XA before. I switched to C/C front because it made the car feel a little more stable in high speed chicanes with no sway bars. I don't mind giving you a hand Saturday, its easier when I can actually see what the car is doing. But in the mean time, you might want to try running a little anti-dive up front to reduce castor, maybe more droop in the rear, toe out the front...idk there are a lot of things you could try just depends on what your using now for setup. PM me if you would like
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Old 07-22-2009, 03:19 PM   #420
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Thanks all for the replies!

I'm using 6-cell Nimh batteries, but yeah, for now I've turned my EPA down to about 90%. 80% is more comfortable, but the speed is addictive though The first track I ever went to was frequented by guys running nitro, and my friend and I just sort of took those cars' speed as some sort of benchmark. We were using kit silver cans then, and the nitro cars just seemed jaw-droppingly rapid
Hmmm well try this go ahead and turn your epa for throttle to 100% That way you have the top speed your looking for. Then adjust your throttle exp. to where at low to mid travel of the trigger, your radio isn't seeing as much input. So basically run a lot of negative throttle exp. That way it will limit how much power you have until you get smoother with your pull, and hopefully make it easier to drive in the turns. Then when you hit the straightaways full throttle will still give you full throttle

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....wish I had known about the alum bits being even easier to bend BEFORE getting them. Ah well...I'll probably get the carbon-reinforced tub, but I hear carbon-reinforced parts are brittle and hence easier to break?
On the aluminum blocks you want to also try using the longest screw you can so that the threads go all the way up into the block. Helps to keep them from tweaking. The plastic tub doesn't have enough rigidity to hold the blocks in place very well in a bad wreck. No matter how tight you may screw them in, the countersunk screw holes can't support the screw heads from pushing into the chassis left to right, front to back etc in a bad hit. So the blocks get bent. I'm thinking the carbon tub will help to prevent this because the material doesn't flex as much as plastic. A quick way to check after a bad wreck is to just look at the bottom of the chassis and study the faces of the screws that go into the blocks. If you see one that has a face not parallel to the bottom of the chassis you got something bent. You still need to check the car out close in a bad wreck, but this way of checking is very obvious. Something has to give in a wreck, so you still will bend blocks if you wreck bad enough, but the carbon chassis should limit this to the extreme cases. The carbon tub should be pretty hard to break. I wouldn't worry about it. If you go to carbon hubs and c blocks, yeah you will break those



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...I guess it's a little disappointing that a 13.5T is about all the TB03 can handle, but I guess that's if lipo is being used? Would it follow then, that if I use NimH batteries it should be able to handle a slightly lower-turn motor? My friend actually runs a 9T in his TT01E (somehow!). I'm thinking if I switch over to a similar motor we can finally compete/bash on a level basis and we'll be able to see just how much faster the Tb03 is compared to a TT01E
Well, I wouldn't say a 13.5 is all a TB03 can handle, just that for most people that is about all they can handle and still be consistent at a track. Anyone that has a lot of experience wouldn't have a problem driving one with a hotter motor. When you get to mod motor speeds, belt cars can get back on throttle quicker and harder because of the absorption of power/torque in the drivetrain. Shaft cars you got to be real smooth and ease into the power, so your losing time. If I was you I would get a 4 turn motor and run 5 cell. Your car will be lighter, easier to drive, and still have a lot of top end. But 4 turn and 2s lipo I wouldn't recommend lol. Your car will really fly...and I'm talking float off into the air fly! LOL! I think its cool you and your friend are running mod motors LOL! I know you both are having a lot of fun and that is what its all about

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know any one who's serious about speed uses protoform bodies. I'm sticking with the tamiya NSX body though (kit wing replaced with a proper racing wing) just because it is sooo much prettier. Would doing that be much of a compromise?
I would stick with the NSX I think it would be fine and like you said it looks cooler hehe. But the Protoform TC bodies would be more stable I'm sure. Why not get a Protoform Corvette body? They look cool and have good downforce. Tamiya makes a nice vette body as well, and its more realistic
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