Tekin RS ESC sensored
03-08-2010, 12:12 PM
Depending on your end rpm you might really just be changing how much boost was still engaged at 6000rpm. If you end rpm is 10K you have about 1/3 of the boost with a 4k start rpm. You have about 1/2 of the boost engaged with a 2.5k start rpm.
It is a very exponential response. IE some think the turbo does not work unless you have boost on. Actually the turbo is working but you hardly notice unless the total timing is high enough to start making those crazy no load rpms.
Going from 20deg to 30deg of timing is hard to notice, but going from 30deg to 40deg kicks up pretty good. Unless you already have 30 or so in the boost you hardly notice the 10 to 20 being added in turbo.
It is fine to have a 2k or even lower start rpm. It might be needed to keep enough boost engaged. The point is that it makes little sense to have a 6k to 8k end rpm with 2s because the boost never turns off and it might as well be static timing. Half that for 1S. Again in theory... and the track has a habit of not always agreeing. That is why we have such a broad and talented team of drivers to help us see what really works. Many TQ's and wins at the birds so something is working
It is a very exponential response. IE some think the turbo does not work unless you have boost on. Actually the turbo is working but you hardly notice unless the total timing is high enough to start making those crazy no load rpms.
Going from 20deg to 30deg of timing is hard to notice, but going from 30deg to 40deg kicks up pretty good. Unless you already have 30 or so in the boost you hardly notice the 10 to 20 being added in turbo.
It is fine to have a 2k or even lower start rpm. It might be needed to keep enough boost engaged. The point is that it makes little sense to have a 6k to 8k end rpm with 2s because the boost never turns off and it might as well be static timing. Half that for 1S. Again in theory... and the track has a habit of not always agreeing. That is why we have such a broad and talented team of drivers to help us see what really works. Many TQ's and wins at the birds so something is working
What you are really spelling out here is the you can either run a two or three speed setup with the Tekin... (both being a huge benefit over traditional 1 speed esc)....
2 speed - setup boost to come in lower then min corner speed (2500-6000RPM start) so its always engaged with a very linear curve.... turbo comes in WOT (0 delay) as the second gear in the car...
3 speed - gearing/motor timing off corner, hit second with boost 8000-12000, hit third with long delay on turbo (0.5-1.5seconds).... 2 big bursts of speed... tuning them to smooth out infleld drivability by stretching END rpm, reducing ramp...
As you suggest, you have to get most/all of the boost timing into the motor for turbo to have a real turbo effect... ie before 1/2 way on the straight...
A 2 speed setup that is easy to drive with the linear boost.... the 3 speed setup is faster in a straight line, and has more punch off corner, but takes a lot longer to get it tuned to be easily drivable, and you have to be ready for a handful...
An untuned 3 speed throws you off the straight into a wall and gives unexpected bursts of punch at just the wrong time though the infield... read total nightmare to drive... tuned right you will have crazy torque though the infield, great speed the longest infield stretchs, and make up ~5 car lengths on a 2 speed setup, and ~12-15 car lengths on a traditional ESC...
With the max straight speed setup, the top speed varies greatly because of slip off corner, getting squirelly with boost and turbo, and differences in when you go WOT..... I found any time I was making on the straight with hyper speed I was loosing between turn 1 and turn 2 trying to gather up the car... This might be ok in practice, but in races this is where a lot of the passing happens... and the squirrly car will be on the outside
....----
Someone had commented on my setups using Orca and Nemesis 17.5, and wondered how my gearing was similar... the Orca is running fixed timing (12.5' i believe), the Nemesis I am running -5 timing (ie -17 from stock position)... which is roughly equal to 3-4 pinion teeth...
The nemesis seems to be a screamer with older ESC (LRP Sphere etc), but I have not been that impressed with it when powered by tekin... It really hates low RPM timing.. and it has been a real fight to keep the thing from cooking itself when it does go fast with the Tekin....
With this new information, I am guessing I that I had more timing then I thought coming off the corners... I had been assuming the low RPM in the corner being in the 3500-4500 RPM range (based on 5km/hr car speed and doing the math)... and have been playing with < 6000 RPM for a start.... I think once I bump the start RPM to 8000-9000RPM the temperature variance in will decrease (and tend towards the low side). If that is the case, this information will have unlocked my Nemesis's daemon.... but bumping the start RPM over the min infield RPM and having 0 timing (max torque) should reduce temperatures and provide more punch with all motors...
A telemetry system might be the next must have item.... If you could just bang off some quick laps and pick out the min/max infield speed and straight speed... then setup the start RPM to (min + (max-min)/2) and end to (straight - (straight - max)/2)... and you should be right in the ball park just playing with boost/turbo/delay values...
-b
03-08-2010, 12:12 PM
Tech Master
03-08-2010, 12:13 PM
hey guys, just bought a RS and should be here in few days , i am very excited about the ESC and need some helps as how to prepare my radio's EPA setting , mind you i have a M11. should i max them out ( throttle / brake ) like i did with mamba pro ? thanks for a help
03-08-2010, 01:13 PM
I tried a few profiles from the vegas user setting. Some seems fine but after trying the same setting a few times, at full throttle, there is a very strong jerk... the feeling is like the esc being cut at its power of sumthing? Anyone experience this before?
03-08-2010, 01:43 PM
03-08-2010, 01:51 PM
11.5t team power motor.
03-08-2010, 02:10 PM
Tech Master
With witch setup did you have the most problems?
03-08-2010, 02:17 PM
The timing boost reaches the maximum you specify at the end RPM, and then stays there until you drop back down below the end RPM.
The turbo boost begins at the delay period you set. If you set 0.2 second delay, the turbo boost begins 0.2 seconds after you reach full throttle.
The turbo boost begins at the delay period you set. If you set 0.2 second delay, the turbo boost begins 0.2 seconds after you reach full throttle.
03-08-2010, 02:17 PM
03-08-2010, 02:34 PM
Tech Master
so if you knew your lowest and highest rpm in the infield and the highestand lowest rpm on the straight how would this help setting an efficient start and end rpm..also, what is the purpose of the rpm settings...i believe i understand that rpm settings have nothing to do with turbo but everything to do with timing...am i correct or not...
As you have a begin RPM of 1000 and an end RPM of 10000 and a boost of 50, than you ad every 1000 rpm 5 boost.
03-08-2010, 02:41 PM
All the setups that was recommended for 10.5 and 13.5. im using a 11.5t motor and at first was working well but when i fiddle around the hotwire, the problem happened until no.. Timing was tried from min to max
03-08-2010, 02:44 PM
Tech Master
Than recalibrate it again. I think some thing went wrong wile putting up a new setup.
03-08-2010, 03:15 PM
I did update using the vegas 203. And recalibrate over and over again. fdr is 7.9 but when on where the turbo is suppose to kick in, the whole car jerks like as though something is preventing the turbo to kick in
03-08-2010, 03:23 PM
Tech Master
Try this and than set a setup on it.
Don't forget after resetting to recalibrate the speedo.
Strange I have never heard of it.
It drove in the beginning good?
As this not works. Mail Tekin. They have a great service and will help you.
03-08-2010, 03:29 PM
Yes, speedo reset to default on hotwire, And i setup again and recalibrate..