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Old 02-16-2012, 07:21 AM   #3571
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Originally Posted by mike ivy View Post
Hey JamesL_71,


In the front end Take out that 2mm spacer in the upper arm. And put a 1mm spacer on the lower arm mount.And take out the .20 spring and replace it with a .18

You didn't post what tire combo your running.
Mike,

I am running Black/Yellows in 17.5 blinky, CRCs @ 41.5mm front/42.5mm rear. Our carpet isn't the cleanest as it shares a facility with an indoor offroad track, and I have found that my car is far more consistent over the course of an 8min when I sauce the entire fronts.

On normal club race weekends, we usually only have 4 heats of carpet racers. 17.5 sedan, 17.5 12th, VTA, and F1. Typically(ie: prior to announcement that the Carpet Nats were being held @ our track), we would see around 5-6 entries per class. So there usually isn't that many cars on the carpet to act as zambonis and lay down a solid clean groove.

The exception to the saucing thing is during bigger events when there are many heats back to back and lots of cars in each heat.

Anyway, regarding the front end setup. I have tried using the 1mm shim on the lower arm by itself and in conjunction with the 2mm upper arm shim. What I found was that the 1mm lower arm shim widened the front too much for my liking. I am running CRC tires, so with the 1mm shim and 1 kingpin shim on the axle, my front width came in just a hair under 170mm.

The car just worked better for me with the narrower front. The 2mm upper arm shim really calmed the car down for me, and made it easier to drive consistently.

However...... All this testing was done with .020 front springs. It is quite possible that wider front track width may be suitable when using the softer front springs.

We have a fairly big race this weekend where we should get a good number of entries and lay down a pretty nice groove, so it will be a good situation to continue testing things that might work @ the Carpet Nats but not on a regular club race day.
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Old 02-16-2012, 07:25 AM   #3572
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Another question for the guys running the Speed Merchant damper tube conversion...

Is everyone running the linear side springs? I wanted to try the standard progressive springs, but obviously they dont fit on the linear spring retainers supplied by Speed Merchant. And the tweak set screws that SM uses are a much larger diameter than the M3s Associated uses, so the AE spring retainers don't fit on the SM tweak screws. And the holes in the SM tweak brace are far too large to accomodate a smaller M3 set screw.

Is their a progressive spring retainer made for the larger imperial tweak screws that SM uses?

Or are we stuck using linear sides?
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Old 02-19-2012, 12:06 PM   #3573
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James

2 things i noticed or suggest...

i think i remeber u saying ur track sprays the track with stuff? amd u use paragon compound right? which in my eyes is prob the best and strongest but alot of tracks and big races use other non odor kind..
You said u dope the whole front tire? but bye the looks of ur setup ur trying to calm down the twichyness of ur car by making it wider/and the lenthing of the upperarms ect...
I would go to no more then 1/2 tire dope so u can get a consistant feel.. and change like mike ivy said shorten the upper, going to the 18.. will give u the intal steering then feel like it stops... also pay attention with them cause they will wear fast and compress quicker.. ..
Are u gluing ur side walls?
Also from my own experince and i see alot of others adjust and adjust and adjust there car cause its not doing something and the fix is in there RADIO alot of racer over look it..
Also.. u can try a bigger split in tire size front to rear..

REMEMBER THERES ALWAYS THAT BASE SETUP AND U WORK FROM THERE TO UR OWN PERSONAL LIKES AND SETTINGS




Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesL_71 View Post
Mike,

I am running Black/Yellows in 17.5 blinky, CRCs @ 41.5mm front/42.5mm rear. Our carpet isn't the cleanest as it shares a facility with an indoor offroad track, and I have found that my car is far more consistent over the course of an 8min when I sauce the entire fronts.

On normal club race weekends, we usually only have 4 heats of carpet racers. 17.5 sedan, 17.5 12th, VTA, and F1. Typically(ie: prior to announcement that the Carpet Nats were being held @ our track), we would see around 5-6 entries per class. So there usually isn't that many cars on the carpet to act as zambonis and lay down a solid clean groove.

The exception to the saucing thing is during bigger events when there are many heats back to back and lots of cars in each heat.

Anyway, regarding the front end setup. I have tried using the 1mm shim on the lower arm by itself and in conjunction with the 2mm upper arm shim. What I found was that the 1mm lower arm shim widened the front too much for my liking. I am running CRC tires, so with the 1mm shim and 1 kingpin shim on the axle, my front width came in just a hair under 170mm.

The car just worked better for me with the narrower front. The 2mm upper arm shim really calmed the car down for me, and made it easier to drive consistently.

However...... All this testing was done with .020 front springs. It is quite possible that wider front track width may be suitable when using the softer front springs.

We have a fairly big race this weekend where we should get a good number of entries and lay down a pretty nice groove, so it will be a good situation to continue testing things that might work @ the Carpet Nats but not on a regular club race day.
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Old 02-19-2012, 04:54 PM   #3574
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesL_71 View Post
Another question for the guys running the Speed Merchant damper tube conversion...

Is everyone running the linear side springs? I wanted to try the standard progressive springs, but obviously they dont fit on the linear spring retainers supplied by Speed Merchant. And the tweak set screws that SM uses are a much larger diameter than the M3s Associated uses, so the AE spring retainers don't fit on the SM tweak screws. And the holes in the SM tweak brace are far too large to accomodate a smaller M3 set screw.

Is their a progressive spring retainer made for the larger imperial tweak screws that SM uses?

Or are we stuck using linear sides?
yes you have to use the linear side springs
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Old 02-19-2012, 05:07 PM   #3575
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Originally Posted by xtrememadness View Post
yes you have to use the linear side springs
I wonder why other 12th manufacturers have not switched to linear side springs since it is said to work better or more consistent

For instance I think Mike B. ran linear at the IIC in 13.5

Anyone?

Thanks
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Old 02-19-2012, 05:21 PM   #3576
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Originally Posted by Infinite 12th View Post
I wonder why other 12th manufacturers have not switched to linear side springs since it is said to work better or more consistent

For instance I think Mike B. ran linear at the IIC in 13.5

Anyone?

Thanks
the linear springs definately make the car more consistent and easier to drive! maybe since mike was running them we will see a linear setup from associated i know bruce from speedmerchant is friends with bob steffule so you never know.
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Old 02-20-2012, 11:10 AM   #3577
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Default New setup posted

Olly Jefferies - BRCA Rd. #5

Olly is now BRCA Modified Champion. Standard springs BTW.
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Old 02-20-2012, 12:14 PM   #3578
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Hey rick there is nothing wrong with the standard springs but if guys want to run the tubes then only the linears fit with the conversion. I think the tubes make a difference more then the springs because they are easier to get consistent for the average racer over the side shock. I prefer side shock when i can build it perfect but sometimes i cant get orings or rebuild kits and thats where greasing tubes is alot easier.
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Old 02-20-2012, 12:17 PM   #3579
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Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
Olly Jefferies - BRCA Rd. #5

Olly is now BRCA Modified Champion. Standard springs BTW.
Thanks

Last edited by Infinite 12th; 02-23-2012 at 10:07 AM.
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Old 02-20-2012, 12:27 PM   #3580
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Originally Posted by xtrememadness View Post
Hey rick there is nothing wrong with the standard springs but if guys want to run the tubes then only the linears fit with the conversion. I think the tubes make a difference more then the springs because they are easier to get consistent for the average racer over the side shock. I prefer side shock when i can build it perfect but sometimes i cant get orings or rebuild kits and thats where greasing tubes is alot easier.
I should probably mention that im running the standard side shock with black progressive springs and inline chassis and am very happy with my setup! Besides getting parts from speedmerchant is impossible! Lol
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Old 02-20-2012, 01:00 PM   #3581
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Originally Posted by JamesL_71 View Post
Another question for the guys running the Speed Merchant damper tube conversion...

Is everyone running the linear side springs? I wanted to try the standard progressive springs, but obviously they dont fit on the linear spring retainers supplied by Speed Merchant. And the tweak set screws that SM uses are a much larger diameter than the M3s Associated uses, so the AE spring retainers don't fit on the SM tweak screws. And the holes in the SM tweak brace are far too large to accomodate a smaller M3 set screw.

Is their a progressive spring retainer made for the larger imperial tweak screws that SM uses?

Or are we stuck using linear sides?
the CRC genx side springs are interchangeable with the R5. i 'think' the crc uses a 4-40 set screw, so that might work for you. the plastic ones are 3387, and preferred over the metal version.
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Old 02-21-2012, 02:53 AM   #3582
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
Olly Jefferies - BRCA Rd. #5

Olly is now BRCA Modified Champion. Standard springs BTW.
He lowerd is pivot bals with 0,6mm.... But how Did the cut away some carbon of the chassis, so all can be lowerd?

Regards Robert Krens
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Old 02-21-2012, 06:19 AM   #3583
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He lowerd is pivot bals with 0,6mm.... But how Did the cut away some carbon of the chassis, so all can be lowerd?

Regards Robert Krens
It sounds like you would need to grind away the same amount from each pivot ball, and also from the pivot?
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Old 02-21-2012, 10:34 AM   #3584
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Robert, I haven't spoken to OJ, but knowing how we used to do it when I was running 12th full time it was 0.6mm off the pivot ball, and 0.6mm off the centre plastic housing - plus some more off the housing to check that it all still moves properly.
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Old 02-21-2012, 12:50 PM   #3585
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Yes, that is how it is done. Machine 0.6mm off the underside of each ball (correctly, you should do the same to all four balls on the side links too, but you can get away with not doing that) and then machine 0.6mm off the middle and ends of the centre link. The centre link attachment points on the chassis must be level with the bottom of the centre ball.

You will also have to take some material off the bottom plate to allow the same amount of movement side to side. HTH
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