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Old 04-13-2011, 04:21 AM   #1801
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bit of a story but here goes
wanted a 1/10 pan car for some time,got a LE about 5 weeks ago.
being my first pan car it has been a steep learning curve.
first setup was johns bsc wgt (purple) wheels all round,13.5 novak with a gtb
on 2s.built to crc instructions
was ok but very twitchy,back end was fairly loose,some of this maybe because i run on a big out door asphalt track low-med grip and can get fairly dirty.
after days of research i changed the front end to trailing axles,moved the front end to the forward position (gave me back standard wheel base with trailing axles) then moved servo back to get the steering arms close to being straight (added ackerman).
new tyres, xceed purple fr,xceed magenta rr.
added a HW xtreme stock esc (my first esc with boost/turbo) and a lrp x12 10.5
managed to get a 5 min run up the track today and what a difference
the changed front end has taken the twichyness out of it,and the rear end is much more planted allowing throttle to be applied during cornering.
im sure there is a few more tweaks but the handling now is superb
the new esc/motor combo is unbelievable.
these cars are just awesome and so much fun
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Old 04-13-2011, 07:06 AM   #1802
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My hero...

Hope you got my mailing.

Bill
I did..those are all good ones and were for you to hand out to those that had bad ones....

As far as the body, we showed a Black Art Mercedes at the Meet and Greet during the IIC in Vegas. It needed a few tweaks, so we sent it to Black Art and we are waiting for the finished product. I have seen the spy shots of the revamped body, so hopefully it will not be too long until we have the finished product in our hands.....I will keep everyone up to date on that.

Is anyone planning on running the paved nats? I believe we will be there....

dumper
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Old 04-13-2011, 02:59 PM   #1803
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Default paved nats

I'm planning to run WGT and 1/12th mod at the nats. I hope to see you guys there. Please do post some pics of the new mercedes body as soon as you've got an image that you can share.
thanks,
Perry
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I did..those are all good ones and were for you to hand out to those that had bad ones....

As far as the body, we showed a Black Art Mercedes at the Meet and Greet during the IIC in Vegas. It needed a few tweaks, so we sent it to Black Art and we are waiting for the finished product. I have seen the spy shots of the revamped body, so hopefully it will not be too long until we have the finished product in our hands.....I will keep everyone up to date on that.

Is anyone planning on running the paved nats? I believe we will be there....

dumper
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Old 04-13-2011, 03:32 PM   #1804
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new WGT body? what new WGT body? As I'm in the process of building up a shiny new WGT chassis, I sure would like to have a body choice that works and yet is better looking than those ugly used bar of soap looking Sophias. Pleeeeese, where can one find pics of said new WGT body? I really don't want to put an ugly lid on my pretty new playtoy chassis.
Are you talking about that?
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Old 04-13-2011, 04:50 PM   #1805
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that looks good, but it's the upcoming release from Black Art that we are so keen to see. Knowing Black Art and CRC, their new WGT bod is likely to be a really good one. Now .....if we could only just see what it's going to look like................
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Are you talking about that?
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Old 04-13-2011, 05:54 PM   #1806
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OK, bit of an update on my asphalt setup. Based on a few discussions of late, I have my set-up from the last race below, plus the changes I am going to try. I have plenty of entry steering, almost no end of turn, doesn't square-up fast, and is generally loose (some trigger finger, not all).

FRONT
Exceed WGT purple
Purple springs
Zero droop
Caster, 1 shim forward
5 active caster
1 camber
0 toe
trailing steering
Arms near square for ackerman

REAR
Exceed WGT Pink
Green side springs, 1/2 turn past touching
30wt centre shock, CRC Black short spring, around 20lb maybe?
1.5mm droop (going to move shock back to get more droop)
CRC Old-school 12th shock for side damper, 30wt
Long side links (going to add 1mm shim under rear ball)


Does this look like i'm in the right ballpark? I don't get to practice much, so it may be 3 weeks before i'm on the track again!

To get this right, does having the steering rods square give MORE ackerman than having the servo set back to create and angle on the arms?
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Old 04-13-2011, 09:10 PM   #1807
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Are you talking about that?
i am sure that might look cool, but the wgt rules spec a gt body not a lmp body.
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Old 04-13-2011, 09:16 PM   #1808
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i am new to pan cars,but found on mine having the steering rods near straight,the servo is just a little forward,also has 0 bump steer, made a big difference.here is a couple of pics (sorry of phone)
Attached Thumbnails
CRC 1/10 Pan Car-img_0414.jpg   CRC 1/10 Pan Car-img_0415.jpg   CRC 1/10 Pan Car-img_0416.jpg  
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Old 04-13-2011, 10:15 PM   #1809
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Originally Posted by JR007 View Post
OK, bit of an update on my asphalt setup. Based on a few discussions of late, I have my set-up from the last race below, plus the changes I am going to try. I have plenty of entry steering, almost no end of turn, doesn't square-up fast, and is generally loose (some trigger finger, not all).

FRONT
Exceed WGT purple
Purple springs
Zero droop
Caster, 1 shim forward
5 active caster
1 camber
0 toe
trailing steering
Arms near square for ackerman

REAR
Exceed WGT Pink
Green side springs, 1/2 turn past touching
30wt centre shock, CRC Black short spring, around 20lb maybe?
1.5mm droop (going to move shock back to get more droop)
CRC Old-school 12th shock for side damper, 30wt
Long side links (going to add 1mm shim under rear ball)


Does this look like i'm in the right ballpark? I don't get to practice much, so it may be 3 weeks before i'm on the track again!

To get this right, does having the steering rods square give MORE ackerman than having the servo set back to create and angle on the arms?

When you bought your CRC, there is a little peice of paper that came with the shock, it tells you what the rate of the spring was. I the first run came with 30lbs, and the everything after that was 25lb springs. Your setup looks pretty good. If you are not having any traction roll issues, try a green front spring, with red side springs, you wil get more traction in the corners. When iwas running my Pro10 (CRC) I would also end up softening the rear spring to the 14-18lb range to gain extra rear grip.

Shawn.
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Old 04-13-2011, 11:33 PM   #1810
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzy-crawl View Post
i am new to pan cars,but found on mine having the steering rods near straight,the servo is just a little forward,also has 0 bump steer, made a big difference.here is a couple of pics (sorry of phone)
Thanks for the pics. Steering looks pretty good.

Sorry, I am yet to see an r/c (or real car) with 0 bump steer. And pan cars with servo savers having connections to steering linkage on the underside of the servo are some of the worst cases of bad bump steer geometry. Fortunately, pan cars typically don't have a lot of front suspension travel to deal with; so, the issue is likely bigger with touring cars (and even more so with off-road cars). But, we can still try to minimize bad bump steer geometry on any r/c car.
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Old 04-13-2011, 11:49 PM   #1811
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Originally Posted by ozzy-crawl View Post
bit of a story but here goes
wanted a 1/10 pan car for some time,got a LE about 5 weeks ago.
being my first pan car it has been a steep learning curve.
first setup was johns bsc wgt (purple) wheels all round,13.5 novak with a gtb
on 2s.built to crc instructions
was ok but very twitchy,back end was fairly loose,some of this maybe because i run on a big out door asphalt track low-med grip and can get fairly dirty.
after days of research i changed the front end to trailing axles,moved the front end to the forward position (gave me back standard wheel base with trailing axles) then moved servo back to get the steering arms close to being straight (added ackerman).
new tyres, xceed purple fr,xceed magenta rr.
added a HW xtreme stock esc (my first esc with boost/turbo) and a lrp x12 10.5
managed to get a 5 min run up the track today and what a difference
the changed front end has taken the twichyness out of it,and the rear end is much more planted allowing throttle to be applied during cornering.
im sure there is a few more tweaks but the handling now is superb
the new esc/motor combo is unbelievable.
these cars are just awesome and so much fun
All sounds pretty good...YOU DID IT!

If not done already...Try a 1mm washer under the rear ball end of the side links to further calm the rear end down.

You achieve the biggest changes in Ackerman effect via those three holes in the steering arms at each front wheel. Try using them. Inner hole for track with lots of tight corners and middle hole for flowing track. Have never needed to use the outer hole because that is verging on what is referred to as "parallel steer" (maybe for oval cars?).

Cheers!

Bill
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Old 04-14-2011, 12:23 AM   #1812
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Originally Posted by Still Bill View Post
Thanks for the pics. Steering looks pretty good.

Sorry, I am yet to see an r/c (or real car) with 0 bump steer. And pan cars with servo savers having connections to steering linkage on the underside of the servo are some of the worst cases of bad bump steer geometry. Fortunately, pan cars typically don't have a lot of front suspension travel to deal with; so, the issue is likely bigger with touring cars (and even more so with off-road cars). But, we can still try to minimize bad bump steer geometry on any r/c car.
bill bad wording on my part as there probably is some slight bump steer
i just cant see any when moving the suspension up and down.
with the steering links out the front of the servo saver i lost most of the ackerman and had a small amount of toe out bump steer.
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Old 04-14-2011, 12:32 AM   #1813
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Still Bill View Post
All sounds pretty good...YOU DID IT!

If not done already...Try a 1mm washer under the rear ball end of the side links to further calm the rear end down.

You achieve the biggest changes in Ackerman effect via those three holes in the steering arms at each front wheel. Try using them. Inner hole for track with lots of tight corners and middle hole for flowing track. Have never needed to use the outer hole because that is verging on what is referred to as "parallel steer" (maybe for oval cars?).

Cheers!

Bill
thanks bill. been playing with rc cars (mostly off road) for nearly 30 years on and off but learning a whole lot trying to set up my pan car
in reference to the 3 steering arm holes,the track i run on is a big 1/8 track with 2 long straights,1 sweeper but most corners are 180 deg.
seems ok in the inner hole ????
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Old 04-14-2011, 08:36 PM   #1814
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Originally Posted by ozzy-crawl View Post
thanks bill. been playing with rc cars (mostly off road) for nearly 30 years on and off but learning a whole lot trying to set up my pan car
in reference to the 3 steering arm holes,the track i run on is a big 1/8 track with 2 long straights,1 sweeper but most corners are 180 deg.
seems ok in the inner hole ????
Sounds good to me; unless, some of those 180s have really fast sweepers.

Where would I find information about your track?

Bill
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Old 04-14-2011, 09:35 PM   #1815
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about the best i could do for a track pic.
bottom of pic shows two cut outs,this is used usually by the electric guys
as it cuts both ends of the long straight of,plus both ends
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