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Old 05-20-2005, 03:29 PM   #316
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Default CSeils - rolling

Carl??
Rolling problems:
I assume the M03 front drive chassis.

Assuming you are talking about on carpet at Trackside, stop by and see me Tuesday and I will be happy to give you a few suggestions.

If you are talking about carpet rollover problems with this setup you described, try the following: S grips with hard shaped insert up front, m grips with either hard shaped insert or hard foam insert to the rear. Even better than this is an S grip up front with not one but two inserts: the hard shaped insert closest to the rim, followed by a cut down (length and width) closed cell foam insert placed over the shaped insert. This is a real b**** to glue up true, but is a great, long wearing solution to the rollover problem. On most carpet surfaces, including Trackside, I have found that the m grips have more traction than the s grips, although it is exactly the opposite on asphalt, when the s grips have the most traction. You probably have too much grip up front with the S's, causing your rolling problem. No tire sauce up front, sauce the rears.

Sometimes even this tire setup is too grippy up front. When the carpet surface has a lot of foam guys running, on a well established groove, (such as the Novak race), I resort to running the stock tires (those very hard plastic like cheapo tires) up front, with sidewalls further stiffened by CA'ing up the sidewalls. Same double insert combo (a double b***** to put together). These are run fully tire sauced.

Front toe should be about zero to maybe 1 degree toe out. (Measured with the car sitting at normal ride height. Toe in changes in these cars under shock compression)

The spacers you have added to the inside of the shocks are correct as well, to limit the droop (the only way to do so in a mini).

Keep the heavy sway bar up front. Tune rear grip by experimenting with and without the rear sway bar.

Frankly, I think many people over lower their minis, resulting in the excessive negative camber up front given the fixed (Tamiya legal) camber link in the front. I think what happens, in combination with the too grippy m grips up front, is you get a car handling like some real cars -- ok to a point, but with little warning that you are at the extreme of handling, before loss of control. Kinda like the old Porsche 914's in real life, reach that "edge" and step over and bam, out of control.

Watch out for those M grips and wear issues. I find that there is something strange about the M rubber compound and most tire sauces. Slowly but surely the M grips will balloon out. If you compare a new m grip to one that has been raced four weeks or so or more (with compound, cleaning, etc), the tire height is far greater, and with a no longer flat tread surface. When these are running in the rear as I have suggested, this leads to a subtlely increasing rear ride height which can then lead to roll over problems. Only the M's do this, the stock and S's don't. Once they balloon too much, they have to be tossed. The nasty part is that unless you are aware of this happening, you have a car that is slowly increasing the rear ride height all on its own, and if unnoticed, you start chasing set up, wondering what is going wrong. The trade off is, however, that the overstuffed S's up front (when you don't run the chassis to low and cone them) last virtually forever.

I think a ride height of about 5-6 mm works well without the excessive camber problem. This is easiest to accomplish if you use the Tamiya super short shock bodies, two black orings internally, and the short hard on road spring set (white front, blue rears should be fine).

To keep CG low, mount your esc on the left side of the rear chassis piece, the receiver on the right side, both just in front of the rear wheels. No electronics on top of the chassis other than the required servo. A mini servo for steering also helps but is not required (Futaba's digital mini servo is perfect for M03s

Hope this helps

Last edited by minidriver; 05-20-2005 at 03:48 PM.
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Old 05-20-2005, 03:54 PM   #317
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Default s800 body

a picture of an s800 body set
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Old 05-20-2005, 05:45 PM   #318
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Default rolling

Quote:
Originally posted by CSeils
Okay, heres the problem.

I keep rolling my mini. I'm using m-grips on the front and s-grips on the rear. 80w F white spring / 50w R blue spring. I've tried sway bars in both the front and rear, on and off.
It was suggested by some of the guys at the track that I add spacers inside my shocks to limit the travel of the front piston to 2mm and the rear to 4mm, this is supposed to tighten up the front and rear by keeping the cars CG lower. Problem is, I still roll and the camber in the front seems to high.

Are there any other suggestions to accomplish this? or what else can I do?

If anybody has an idea to correct this, let me know.
what I would do is remove everything in the rear shocks and go with 30wt and have zero droop in the ft if any 1/2mm turn your dualrate way down then bring it up to the track not to how u want it..laterKB
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Old 05-20-2005, 11:35 PM   #319
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Set your EPA or dual rate around 70%, don't use maximum turning point because it will cause traction roll and slow down the cornering speed.

However, you need to adjust the suspension setup so your car could turn at tight corner.

I use hard rubber insert + foam insert for front tires - super slick B

I use double foams insert for rear tires - super slick B

Front : 60w - 2 holes piston - yellow springs
Rear : 60w - 3 holes piston - yellow or blue springs

Ride height : 8mm front and 7mm rear

No stabiliser
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Old 05-21-2005, 01:54 AM   #320
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if that dosnt work try:
hpi x pattern tyres
standard shock with silver spring and 5mm ride height front
Rear: Aluminium Shocks, red springs, 40wt oil, 5 red orings and 2 hole piston.

not stablizers

works real well at 2 clubs i race at, one is tight and twisty and the other is really open and flowing.
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Old 05-21-2005, 04:45 PM   #321
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Default mo3l

I found it very hard not to roll I run mine on a fine line between the 2 rolling and not,that way I roll the car throu the turn and break for the sharp ones..tires I use 1 black mini foam and 1 red or blue sedan foam with a small air gap..
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Old 05-23-2005, 03:00 AM   #322
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i put my 6 turn in mine for fun,and even a really high speed lose wouldnt roll it. i actually tried to roll it and cant
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Old 05-23-2005, 03:45 AM   #323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moot
i put my 6 turn in mine for fun,and even a really high speed lose wouldnt roll it. i actually tried to roll it and cant
Yeah...Ive driven moot`s Mini (with 15 Turn) in a drag race with his GPX4 nitro..It actually out ran the nitro until it hit second gear then only just got beat..

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Old 05-24-2005, 12:00 AM   #324
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How much does a used M03 mini go for ? any one selling ? I checked ebay and they about $100 cdn for a new one . But shipping is like $40-50 . So i am tryin to find some prices locally . The Gf wants on to carpet race with .
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Old 05-25-2005, 07:01 AM   #325
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Default Mini setup tips

Hi there any one got setup tips on mini.I own M03L with hop up like mini shocks,aluminium heatsink,Blue bearing ,blue adjustable turnbuckle.
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Old 05-25-2005, 10:20 AM   #326
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Minis typically run about 150-180 cdn here in the Toronto area.

Faiunie, check www.tamiyausa.com they have a good buildup of the MO3L there.
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Old 05-26-2005, 08:48 AM   #327
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Pink
How much does a used M03 mini go for ? any one selling ? I checked ebay and they about $100 cdn for a new one . But shipping is like $40-50 . So i am tryin to find some prices locally . The Gf wants on to carpet race with .
go to for sale Joe Novak has 3 4sale
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Old 05-29-2005, 04:08 AM   #328
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Well just finished painting up a new body...

I know some ppl wont like the colour scheme (Metalic Purple & Fluro Pink)..BUT at least it will be seen..

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Old 05-30-2005, 09:46 PM   #329
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Do the parts from the newer models of the mini ( M03... ) work on the original chassis ? I can get a cheap original model mini but don't know if parts can be found .
What is the difference between the older model and the newer ????
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Old 05-31-2005, 05:21 AM   #330
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OOps if you are meaning something like a M01 or M02 or whatever they were, I have no clue.


Only difference between the old style Rover Mini Cooper M03 chassis and the newer BMW Mini M03L is a chassis extension piece, between the fron and rear sections. You can convert either chassis to the other by either adding or removing the extension.

The Bmw Mini kit comes with the extension, the Rover Mini does not, but you can buy it.
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