R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-10-2014, 10:23 AM   #20791
Tech Champion
 
k_bojar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 6,917
Trader Rating: 30 (100%+)
Send a message via ICQ to k_bojar Send a message via AIM to k_bojar
Default

i'd love to see pics of the new M05 I love mine, but wouldn't be too upset getting a new version
__________________
Bodies By Bean | Team Belly
k_bojar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 10:35 AM   #20792
Tech Elite
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,367
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Qatmix View Post
Whatever type batteries you use you can buy more expensive ones. Even oval racing now some guys spend 50+ on a set on Nimhs to get an advantage. Personally its good news that the M05 will be able to take the more affordable square packs as most guys here have them and it was always a blocker to run an M-class.

Isnt one of the charms of Mini racing that they cant exactly handle a lot of power etc, so chucking in a top of the range lipo is not going to make the difference that it would in TC.
Sure, that's true, but we no longer run Nimh batteries here. There are only a few round lipo hard cased batteries on the market. The Peak Powermax 4200 is pretty much standard fare locally and is $30 USA. Now that's affordable and for the most part, this battery is as good as any on the market here. We did not have a battery war, but it looks like we'll have one for a bit till it all gets sorted.

My understanding is that some clubs specify Nimh batteries for Minis in England. Idiotic when you consider that there are much less expensive lipo batteries that out perform your old nimhs and last 5X as long.

Sorry, but when you have Spec racing, batteries have a bigger impact than when you don't.
Granpa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 10:55 AM   #20793
Tech Elite
 
sosidge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bristol, UK
Posts: 3,811
Default

I see a few complaints about "Tamiya" making the class more expensive with new rules. Actually it is Tamiya USA who laid out the silly rules, Tamiya Japan run something totally different.

From what we have seen locally we would never have specced an open motor brushless class for Minis, restricted gearing means you have to restrict the motor too. So USA racers have my sympathy but it isn't Tamiya's fault you have been forced to wage a motor war.

Our Mini classes are cheap, square packs will probably make it cheaper for many and more accessible. I reckon the new chassis will breathe new life into the class, although I suspect we will continue to run brushed motors for a while yet.
sosidge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 11:24 AM   #20794
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Kaohsiung City, Taiwan
Posts: 1,571
Send a message via ICQ to JiuHaWong
Default

Shame this chassis never took off:

__________________
오늘의 청소년들이 미래의 문제를 처리 할 준비가 병 슬프게도 있습니다 우려하고있다.
JiuHaWong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 11:33 AM   #20795
Tech Champion
 
k_bojar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 6,917
Trader Rating: 30 (100%+)
Send a message via ICQ to k_bojar Send a message via AIM to k_bojar
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JiuHaWong View Post
Shame this chassis never took off:

too many 'issues' with that chassis:

only able to fit 380-size motors
all batteries don't fit

but it would have been a cool class
__________________
Bodies By Bean | Team Belly
k_bojar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 11:33 AM   #20796
Tech Elite
 
axle182's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 3,766
Trader Rating: 18 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to axle182
Default

GP Here is the article.
http://www.rc-mini.net/joomla/index....148&Itemid=151
Ive run my TC packs in my M06, back to back with my old 4200 Hobbywing round mini packs. I couldnt notice a single difference around the track with our spec motors and esc. Laptimes were very slightly slower with the TC packs due to a little extra weight which I thought was surprising, but i think its due to the fact, an M06 on carpet is an extremely fine line. You hit that balance between grip, steering, weight transfer etc, and its a rocket, you miss, its a dud. I think the extra weight of my TC pack played a role in the outcome, as I would have had to adjust some of the suspension to get the car back to the same balance. Only true tests are exact same parametres for each test. You change anything other than what your testing for, you have a flawed results. The batts would have to weigh the exact same, be charged the same, and be run in the same car with the same prep. Hard to do, when batteries have different weight.

I never did find a massive difference in packs in Stock TC either. Im still doing very well with my 2yo Orions I bought second hand. Ive tried new packs from a friend, and did notice a little more punch early on, but more heat too. for me its a clear trade off. I think when everything is balanced out, heat/gearing/chassis setup etc, there isnt much of a difference between batteries. More volts at any point, means more heat, so you reduce gearing in a TC and you reduce timing in mini.

Ive been through the pack of the month with Nimh like we all have, and HATED it. Nimh would charge to whatever volts you could stuff into them, and at a guess (from my limited understanding), the technology with the Lipos all maxing out at 4.2v per cell, which means every pack should at least start exactly the same. You have 8.4v to race with. Sure you have to factor in voltage drop, internal resistance etc over the length of a run, but you also add in variables like heat, grip level etc and you still cannot say with certainty that any advantage gained in slower voltage drop is always better. Some cases yes, but not all. There is a case for a lesser pack being an advantage (creates less heat, and usually is lighter!)

I could be wrong with you guys running the adjustable timing motors down there, but I would be hard pressed to beleive packs are all that. Setup, motor timing and a clean run will still be your biggest battle. GP, id let others buy the expensive packs, run your decent round packs against them, Id be surprised if your final position changes much at all. There are too many variables at play. We found the same goes for the change from brushed to BL. The fast guys are still fast, the slow guys are still slow. It didnt change a thing, and I doubt allowing square packs will either.

I was worried at the beginning of Lipo, watching the Mah and C ratings slowly increase, and I too thought its another Nimh craze. You MUST have the latest high rating battery. But im seriously past all that now, and my 5000mah TC packs are what I choose to run. I can easily afford some new high end 7500+packs, but I cannot see the reason. The day my Orions puff or stop balancing well, Ill get new packs. But even at that stage, Ill get the cheapest one. I think the current technology in rc batteries is great, you can find a pack to suit your budget.

I know racers suffer from the 'must have' syndrome, and will never believe that you dont need the mega $ equipment. I just choose not to race rc that way, and its paid off for me Sorry for the long rant, but hope it helps a bit!
__________________
Aaron "AJ" Freind
axle182 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 11:36 AM   #20797
Tech Elite
 
axle182's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 3,766
Trader Rating: 18 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to axle182
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sosidge View Post
I see a few complaints about "Tamiya" making the class more expensive with new rules. Actually it is Tamiya USA who laid out the silly rules, Tamiya Japan run something totally different.

From what we have seen locally we would never have specced an open motor brushless class for Minis, restricted gearing means you have to restrict the motor too. So USA racers have my sympathy but it isn't Tamiya's fault you have been forced to wage a motor war.

Our Mini classes are cheap, square packs will probably make it cheaper for many and more accessible. I reckon the new chassis will breathe new life into the class, although I suspect we will continue to run brushed motors for a while yet.
+1 I do feel sorry for the guys with this motor war. I think its crazy.
Western Canada is damn lucky we have a spec esc and motor (thanks Monkey!)
__________________
Aaron "AJ" Freind
axle182 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 11:48 AM   #20798
Tech Master
 
kwkride's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 1,079
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Granpa View Post
. . . . The first time someone starts using a 5000+ 90C pack and is faster, shortly thereafter, you will see more of those packs, until someone uses a 5600 pack. . . .
I guess that Mini racing is taken a lot more seriously where you are. For our local club racing, that doesn't even happen in the touring car classes.

Mini is just a fun class here. There is a mix of chassis (even had an M04 out there last week). We started running a mix of silver cans and brushless a couple of years ago with no problems. Last year we went to all brushless 21.5 motors with out of the box settings. (I think everyone had Novak motors of some sort) there was still the occasional silver can that would show up if someone was from out of the area or new. They were generally much faster than the brushless motors we were running.

I do get your point about brushless though. The problem was not that TCS went to brushless, it was that there were no restrictions on it. There was suddenly a big difference in motor speeds.

Now that our TCS race is over, we are back to out of the box timing settings and all is good again even with a mix of motor brands.

Back to the batteries, I can't imagine any of our local guys putting big money down for a battery for the mini class. I always run the cheapest one I can find that will fit in my chassis.
__________________
Jim
-

"If God had meant for us to drive through the front wheels, he never would have allowed us to invent the ring & pinion"
kwkride is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 11:49 AM   #20799
Dan
Tech Elite
 
Dan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 4,189
Trader Rating: 40 (100%+)
Default

Just picked up a Tamiya TA05 M-four recently. It was a flop of a car from Tamiya but I'm just glad I paid no where close to what it cost new. Just going to mess around with it. It's like having the Delorean of RC's.

In regard to square packs, I run 17.5 TC as well. I noticed no real difference in terms of "punch" from my $33 5900mah 60C packs versus my $120+ 6900mah 100C packs. The last time I pay money for such "premium" packs. I imagine this to be less of an issue in 21.5, 2WD fixed gearing Tamiyas. In fact, I think the lighter pack guys will have the advantage (I notice this in racing 17.5 2WD buggy too). There will always be someone in the "inexpensive" class that will outspend others looking for that edge.

The move to square packs I have no issue with, but I do not agree with TCS USA rules for motors with open 21.5. I can't comment too much on what the motor rules should have been, but frankly, I think the Aussie guys got it right with the Hobbywing 13T EZRun system.
Dan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 12:01 PM   #20800
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Kaohsiung City, Taiwan
Posts: 1,571
Send a message via ICQ to JiuHaWong
Default

http://www.redrc.net/2013/08/t-o-p-s...uring-car-kit/

I think it would be cool to have a Tamiya car designed like the TOP car in the above link. You lose some of the "charm" but you gain a more "raceable" chassis that could utilize 21.5 better gearing-wise.
__________________
오늘의 청소년들이 미래의 문제를 처리 할 준비가 병 슬프게도 있습니다 우려하고있다.
JiuHaWong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 12:09 PM   #20801
Tech Champion
 
monkeyracing's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: SnowMexico
Posts: 5,836
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

M-Four - there was a weird decision. The weird trickles down.

I'm trying to work out how they have moved the motor 4mm closer to the right and how it's affected everything else. There's only so much room to bulge out the side of the gearbox and if you move the gears over, it changes the relationship between the idler and diff. Easiest solution would be to modify the idler. I guess we'll see.
__________________
Stab it and steer.

Last edited by monkeyracing; 04-10-2014 at 02:15 PM.
monkeyracing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 04:11 PM   #20802
Tech Master
 
I)arkness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Victoria,Aus
Posts: 1,104
Trader Rating: 7 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JiuHaWong View Post
http://www.redrc.net/2013/08/t-o-p-s...uring-car-kit/

I think it would be cool to have a Tamiya car designed like the TOP car in the above link. You lose some of the "charm" but you gain a more "raceable" chassis that could utilize 21.5 better gearing-wise.
as long as its not deigned by there engineers, the steering broke from memory in the first 10 minutes of use
__________________
B.Portelli
Hyper RC - Metro Hobbies - RAB Hobbies - Wild Turbo Fans
Off road - Schumacher - R1Wurks Australia (Coupon Code - R1BP5%)
On road - Race Opt - Team Powers
I)arkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 04:54 PM   #20803
Tech Champion
 
monkeyracing's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: SnowMexico
Posts: 5,836
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

Cars like the Top are pretty cool, but then all you have is just another touring car. Every unique quality and challenge of Tamiya mini is lost.
__________________
Stab it and steer.
monkeyracing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 05:03 PM   #20804
Tech Addict
 
AngryRog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 613
Trader Rating: 19 (100%+)
Default

It does take a certain 'something' to be able to wheel a Mini.
__________________
Anger, K-Speed, Mini Mafia, NitroHouse.com
M03, M05v2 Pro, FF03-R, TA05v2, TRF419X, Roche P12
AngryRog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 09:01 PM   #20805
Tech Master
 
I)arkness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Victoria,Aus
Posts: 1,104
Trader Rating: 7 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryRog View Post
It does take a certain 'something' to be able to wheel a Mini.
if you know what it is, let me know so i can add it to my CV

would love to be able to compete overseas to see how i stack up against other mini drivers.
__________________
B.Portelli
Hyper RC - Metro Hobbies - RAB Hobbies - Wild Turbo Fans
Off road - Schumacher - R1Wurks Australia (Coupon Code - R1BP5%)
On road - Race Opt - Team Powers
I)arkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tamiya Mini Cooper M-03L Hop-ups mini71 R/C Items: Wanted to Buy 4 05-04-2016 11:07 AM
Tamiya Mini Cooper mach51 R/C Items: Wanted to Buy 10 09-02-2011 12:08 AM
FS:TAMIYA Mini Cooper, TA 04S rthmotorsports R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 4 10-20-2007 09:37 PM
Tamiya 415 MSX and M03 Mini Cooper F/S Racer X79 R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 14 12-22-2006 07:38 AM
Tamiya M01,02,03, or 04 Mini Cooper ccugolf.com R/C Items: Wanted to Buy 2 12-05-2004 08:55 PM


Tags
m03, m03r ules, m05, mini, tamiya


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (0 members and 2 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 07:20 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0