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Old 06-04-2013, 04:21 PM   #19021
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Default Boring old Rebound

I always considered the 6mm hexes F/R as my "standard". Grandpa, have you been sneaking in some of those skinny hubs looking for more steering? Could you please help me better understand why lowering and wider hubs might favor using more shock rebound? Or is this just one more thing on our "bucket list"...
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Old 06-04-2013, 05:22 PM   #19022
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Originally Posted by Laguna Bozo View Post
I always considered the 6mm hexes F/R as my "standard". Grandpa, have you been sneaking in some of those skinny hubs looking for more steering? Could you please help me better understand why lowering and wider hubs might favor using more shock rebound? Or is this just one more thing on our "bucket list"...
What is the standard hex for the mini? I just mic'd mine at 6.3mm and wasn't aware they weren't stock width.

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Old 06-04-2013, 07:06 PM   #19023
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laguna Bozo View Post
I always considered the 6mm hexes F/R as my "standard". Grandpa, have you been sneaking in some of those skinny hubs looking for more steering? Could you please help me better understand why lowering and wider hubs might favor using more shock rebound? Or is this just one more thing on our "bucket list"...
You guys are right, the stock ones are 6mm. I'd gone to the 5mm hexes years ago, so thought the stock ones were 5mm. Probably did this when I first abandoned the Mini springs and went to the ultra soft set ups in 2009. My error, the stock plastic ones are 6mm. No, it wasn't for more steering, but to promote a little more "lean" in the moderate to wide radius corners with the 5mm hexes. This suits the old S-Grips with their stiffer sidewalls. Besides, the plastic ones kept cracking.

The lower ride height and wider track were done primarily to adapt the car to the new S-Grips. I was looking for a little less lean or roll in the corners to keep the sidewalls from collapsing. I thought by going to a higher rebound shocks, we would have a similar effect as the lower ride height and what to me was a wider track. The problem with the new S-Grips with all that lean or roll was that the handling became erratic. I did not want to go to stiffer springs for a lot of reasons that I won't go into here. Also, on the tight corners and on quick changes in direction we had the dreaded traction roll. The car was also setting a little slow on corner entry and was a little "lazy", but we're just looking for tenths now.

I apologize for being a little obsessive, but my driving skills are such that the only way I can keep up is to have a little better car. After all it is a combination of car, motor and driver. Going to turn 78 in a few months so the car and motor have become increasingly important.

Last edited by Granpa; 06-04-2013 at 07:07 PM. Reason: Correction
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Old 06-04-2013, 07:50 PM   #19024
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Originally Posted by Granpa View Post
You guys are right, the stock ones are 6mm. I'd gone to the 5mm hexes years ago, so thought the stock ones were 5mm. Probably did this when I first abandoned the Mini springs and went to the ultra soft set ups in 2009. My error, the stock plastic ones are 6mm. No, it wasn't for more steering, but to promote a little more "lean" in the moderate to wide radius corners with the 5mm hexes. This suits the old S-Grips with their stiffer sidewalls. Besides, the plastic ones kept cracking.

The lower ride height and wider track were done primarily to adapt the car to the new S-Grips. I was looking for a little less lean or roll in the corners to keep the sidewalls from collapsing. I thought by going to a higher rebound shocks, we would have a similar effect as the lower ride height and what to me was a wider track. The problem with the new S-Grips with all that lean or roll was that the handling became erratic. I did not want to go to stiffer springs for a lot of reasons that I won't go into here. Also, on the tight corners and on quick changes in direction we had the dreaded traction roll. The car was also setting a little slow on corner entry and was a little "lazy", but we're just looking for tenths now.

I apologize for being a little obsessive, but my driving skills are such that the only way I can keep up is to have a little better car. After all it is a combination of car, motor and driver. Going to turn 78 in a few months so the car and motor have become increasingly important.
.

Last edited by OVA; 06-05-2013 at 01:29 PM.
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Old 06-04-2013, 07:51 PM   #19025
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Originally Posted by Granpa View Post
You guys are right, the stock ones are 6mm. I'd gone to the 5mm hexes years ago, so thought the stock ones were 5mm. Probably did this when I first abandoned the Mini springs and went to the ultra soft set ups in 2009. My error, the stock plastic ones are 6mm. No, it wasn't for more steering, but to promote a little more "lean" in the moderate to wide radius corners with the 5mm hexes. This suits the old S-Grips with their stiffer sidewalls. Besides, the plastic ones kept cracking.

The lower ride height and wider track were done primarily to adapt the car to the new S-Grips. I was looking for a little less lean or roll in the corners to keep the sidewalls from collapsing. I thought by going to a higher rebound shocks, we would have a similar effect as the lower ride height and what to me was a wider track. The problem with the new S-Grips with all that lean or roll was that the handling became erratic. I did not want to go to stiffer springs for a lot of reasons that I won't go into here. Also, on the tight corners and on quick changes in direction we had the dreaded traction roll. The car was also setting a little slow on corner entry and was a little "lazy", but we're just looking for tenths now.

I apologize for being a little obsessive, but my driving skills are such that the only way I can keep up is to have a little better car. After all it is a combination of car, motor and driver. Going to turn 78 in a few months so the car and motor have become increasingly important.
78 wow..that's pretty good racer here
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Old 06-04-2013, 10:48 PM   #19026
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You guys are right, the stock ones are 6mm. I'd gone to the 5mm hexes years ago, so thought the stock ones were 5mm. Probably did this when I first abandoned the Mini springs and went to the ultra soft set ups in 2009. My error, the stock plastic ones are 6mm. No, it wasn't for more steering, but to promote a little more "lean" in the moderate to wide radius corners with the 5mm hexes. This suits the old S-Grips with their stiffer sidewalls. Besides, the plastic ones kept cracking.

Quote:
The lower ride height and wider track were done primarily to adapt the car to the new S-Grips. I was looking for a little less lean or roll in the corners to keep the sidewalls from collapsing. I thought by going to a higher rebound shocks, we would have a similar effect as the lower ride height and what to me was a wider track. The problem with the new S-Grips with all that lean or roll was that the handling became erratic. I did not want to go to stiffer springs for a lot of reasons that I won't go into here. Also, on the tight corners and on quick changes in direction we had the dreaded traction roll. The car was also setting a little slow on corner entry and was a little "lazy", but we're just looking for tenths now.

I apologize for being a little obsessive, but my driving skills are such that the only way I can keep up is to have a little better car. After all it is a combination of car, motor and driver. Going to turn 78 in a few months so the car and motor have become increasingly important.
Thanks a lot Bob for describing your intentions on that setting in such detailed way!
And my highest respect for you still racing with the "Youngguns" with 78 in a few weeks! Keep on!

Matthias
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Old 06-04-2013, 11:14 PM   #19027
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I've used different width hexes for tuning, but most of the time I'd use a slightly narrower one just so I could get the body of my car sitting a little lower. 60D tires are a tight fit on a lot of shells!
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Old 06-05-2013, 12:30 AM   #19028
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Default Skinny Hubs

Only Sir FriskyALot gets away with plastic hubs very long! I also use 5mm, especially in front but also in rear, to get more steering because of that "extra lean". Then use those pretty Tamiya washers to adjust width when desired. Narrow cars can become "twitchy" and traction roll more, but can also carry more speed through the corners!

Yes, Grandpa's amazing. I'll refrain from "roasting" his driving skills , but he sure knows his stuff. Hope I'm back in time to party with you on your Geburtstag, Robert.

OK Jim, diffs are up...

From one of the "Young Guns", Bozo
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:34 AM   #19029
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Hey guys check what I've been wasting time with It's a f103 mini like the Field One. What you think? (its still a work in progress.. some rear holes missing for example)

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Old 06-05-2013, 01:25 PM   #19030
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Thanks a lot Bob for describing your intentions on that setting in such detailed way!
And my highest respect for you still racing with the "Youngguns" with 78 in a few weeks! Keep on!

Matthias[/QUOTE]

Just hope it works the way it's supposed to. You never know tho, until you try it. Problem is these things seem to work in combinations which makes it a little complicated. Changing the shock rebound could make the car better or worse. If better that's fine, but if it's no better or worse it could mean that we need to raise the ride height a mm or so or rake the ride heights to make it work. Or do something else.

Which brings up another combination which is the car to the driver. I drove Rogers car and lapped it much faster and more consistently than he could. Same car, different drivers. You could jump to the conclusion that I was the better driver and you'd be wrong. His car "fit" me better than it did him. There wasn't the big difference in driving abilities that the gap in lap times might indicate. To his credit, he recognized that he needed to make some changes to the car.

This is something I believe. Running lap after lap with an ill handling car, does nothing to improve your driving skills. The old saying of "you gotta run laps" is a lot like a lot of "old wives tales" , wrong. Doing that with a bad car is responsible for driving many people out of the hobby.
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Old 06-05-2013, 02:25 PM   #19031
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Thanks G-Pa. Still, an ill handling driver was part of it. lol

Made some additional changes to both this week...
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Old 06-05-2013, 02:42 PM   #19032
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Default Drive it!

The sky has finally broken in Austria, and the weather is warming beautifully! I probably won't be posting quite as much because there's some mountain the wife wants me to climb. Good thing about over here, is that there's beer on the top of every mountain!
So it's fitting the technical stuff is getting pretty refined here, thanks to all, and if you guys pay attention to Grandpa, you will have a competitive car. Now all that's left is to drive it...
I can spend all week tuning my Mini, get up early on Sarurday and still not beat Grandpa to the track, donuts and coffee with the boys, and then spend 5 or 6 hours trying to kick each other's butt!
You must have a fast car to be competitive, but there's only maybe 6 of us that can pack-up and race close CLEANLY for 15 or 20 minutes. It can be so much fun it's hard to describe without sounding really corny.
Great Hobby. Enjoy.
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Old 06-05-2013, 03:10 PM   #19033
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Is locking up front diff allowed in TCS? Or do you guys recommend it or not?
I don't normally race mini and tcs will be the only time I will run the car.
It's a parking lot track.

Thx.
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:56 PM   #19034
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Which tire will work best for 75F asphalt track? 1016,1028, or 1029?
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Old 06-05-2013, 07:42 PM   #19035
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Which tire will work best for 75F asphalt track? 1016,1028, or 1029?
Tough question to answer cause 1016s are really hard to find. If you have them, use those over the others. They are supposed to be available soon, but no one knows what tire cpd they will be. You'll find that they are out of stock almost everywhere.

Locked diffs are not legal in TCS competition even if you used Tamiya parts to do it. Out of curiosity, why would you want to lock up your diff????? That is really "old school" and was popular thinking when we could get the good type A slicks and could use any insert. Maybe on carpet, but definitely not on your track.
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