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Old 05-15-2013, 12:02 PM   #18886
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I'm aware that tires are going to be a big part of the final equation, unfortunately my final track surface isn't yet finished so I'm not quite ready for delving into tires.
Okay, gotcha. However, the starting point of any of this is tires. Besides, if no ones seen the track surface, any suggestion is going to be a guess. With that qualifier, in your situation, I'd probably go with Sweep 40 premounts in the front and since you're loose, Sweep 25 premounts in the rear. This is cause they aren't pricey and are a good all around tire that work well on most surfaces. There may be better tires, but it's real easy to wind up with more $$$$ in your tires if you start chasing tires.

Now, this is important. Label what they are with a permanent marker cause if you get them mixed up, there's no good way to tell them apart. Running a 40 on one side of the car and 25s on the other can make your life more interesting than you'd want.


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I'm currently running 210mm, but I have a 225mm body I'm going to start painting tomorrow. Safe to assume the 225mm will be less prone to oversteer?
It's been said by many people, including myself, that the longer WB cars are more stable than a SWB, but that's just an opinion. But no, I don't think you can assume that a SWB oversteers more than a MWB. It may happen quicker on a SWB which to some may make the car feel "twitchy". I believe it's this quickness rather than any inherent tendency of one to oversteer more than the other.
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Old 05-18-2013, 10:16 AM   #18887
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I have problems with my m05 pro servo not centering. I replaced servos and it still doesn't center. This only happens when I turn left. I checked the screws and I have aluminum steering parts. S9551 servo. Is the stock servo saver a high torque one?
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Old 05-18-2013, 11:45 PM   #18888
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I have problems with my m05 pro servo not centering. I replaced servos and it still doesn't center. This only happens when I turn left. I checked the screws and I have aluminum steering parts. S9551 servo. Is the stock servo saver a high torque one?
Since you've been a poster on rctech for 6 years, you're not a newbie. So, I'm going to assume that you've done the usual checks to check for binding and whether the servo saver is loose or is getting stuck steering to the left. Most of those things will affect steering both right and left. The Tamiya servo saver, hi torque or not, works pretty well and I used the kit one on my M05s with no problems. Did replace one with a mid size Kimbrough later tho.

It seems that what you mean by "centering" is that in left hand turns the car doesn't want to track straight when you release the steering input. Instead, it wants to keep going left and wants to hook the corner. I think you're looking in the wrong place. This is just my opinion and others may differ, but I believe the fault lies in the front shock angle. With the shocks laid down like that, the front end acts as if it is reacting slowly. This will make the front end want to "hook" the corner. Get the option shock shock tower and stand the shocks up straighter. This solved the problem for me. Another problem this helps to alleviate is the tendency to pull in one direction or another when you put the "hammer" down coming out of corners.

Hope this helps. Tested this out at WCRC in LaMirada and going from the stock location to the second hole from the outside was worth 0.5 sec/lap.

Last edited by Granpa; 05-18-2013 at 11:56 PM. Reason: addition
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Old 05-19-2013, 02:36 AM   #18889
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Why would it react slower one side and not the other then?

I think if you're turning the steering wheel straight and you have good electronics, then the command should be received and executed promptly and with no hesitation.

S9551 is a good servo, but they do age and start slacking off. Of course this assumes all else is peachy keen.

Tamiya servo savers are crap in my experience and this is one of the problems I found with them. They tend to not push back enough to fight the steering and bring it back home all the way. Coupled with the sloppy mini steering system, it can easily result in weird problems (difficult to track down). Or perhaps is all an accumulation of ill effects. But as Granpa said, I am sure one can make do with a bad saver.

Do you have equal toe out for instance? I mean really equal? If you say sit the car still and turn the steering left and release the steering wheel on the radio, does the steering centralise? Test this by moving the car forward slowly after you turned left and released. If the car doesn't go straight, see why not. Or even worse, if you make sure the steering is centralised and you drive the car slowly without any steering input does it track straight? If it doesn't, start there, see why not. And so on.
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Old 05-19-2013, 10:32 AM   #18890
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Why would it react slower one side and not the other then?
Didn't say that, did I? It can show on right hand turns or left, depending on a variety of factors, which I'm sure you're well aware.

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I think if you're turning the steering wheel straight and you have good electronics, then the command should be received and executed promptly and with no hesitation
.

True, but that wasn't the question.

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Tamiya servo savers are crap in my experience and this is one of the problems I found with them. They tend to not push back enough to fight the steering and bring it back home all the way. Coupled with the sloppy mini steering system, it can easily result in weird problems (difficult to track down). Or perhaps is all an accumulation of ill effects. But as Granpa said, I am sure one can make do with a bad saver.
I never, ever said you could make do with a bad servo saver. What was said was that Tamiya servo savers work pretty well. I don't usually use them cause the arms have broken on occasion and there are better ones. When assembled properly, they're just fine. My preference is for the Kimbrough savers since they are cheaper and are more durable, but that doesn't mean that the Tamiya ones should be universally proclaimed as crap. I still have one in my first M05 and it still works fine.


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Do you have equal toe out for instance? I mean really equal? If you say sit the car still and turn the steering left and release the steering wheel on the radio, does the steering centralise? Test this by moving the car forward slowly after you turned left and released. If the car doesn't go straight, see why not. Or even worse, if you make sure the steering is centralised and you drive the car slowly without any steering input does it track straight? If it doesn't, start there, see why not. And so on.
Please, do you realize how this sounds????? You must think Mini drivers or racers, if you prefer, don't have brains enough to wipe their butts.

Frankly, I'm beginning to believe this is either personal or born out of a desire to display your superior intellect, skills etc. Yes, I know you drive TCs, but for some strange reason, this doesn't make me awestruck. I know you don't race your Minis or Mini cause you've said that yourself. You're what I call a "driveway" Mini expert. Expertise born in the "driveway" often isn't valid on the track. Neither does does disagreeing just to disagree prove anything. It just makes you disagreeable and unpleasant to have anything to do with.

Your last post just reached the end of my considerable patience. Why do you even bother to post on a Mini thread???? You, for the most part, don't agree with anything. Is it to give us the benefit of your vast TC knowledge????? Why even bother. Most of us, when we have a problem, don't go running to a TC racer for set up advice. I used to race TCs and realized that a lot of what of TC set up knowledge was not transferable to Minis. If it's not personal or born out of a desire for self aggrandizement, my apologies. but damn, you can sure be a PITA at times.
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Old 05-19-2013, 01:26 PM   #18891
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Has anyone had any issue w/ the long idler gear in the m05 melting where the bearing race OD on the diff side goes? It appears the bearing seized and plastic had made its way into the race of this bearing. It then melted the hole the bearing sits in a bit. I'm wondering if this is an issue people have had before or if perhaps I just got a bearing that decided to give up the ghost and seize on its own. All other bearings are in perfect condition. This is the 5x8x2.5mm bearing if anyone cares. I've ordered the reinforced gears and a new bearing but if shimming or something may resolve this I'd like to prevent this in the future.

Thanks
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Old 05-19-2013, 03:11 PM   #18892
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Sounds like a bad bearing. Definitely not a common problem.
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Old 05-19-2013, 04:21 PM   #18893
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Ok, thanks for the input. I'll reassemble and keep an eye on it.

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Old 05-19-2013, 04:51 PM   #18894
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Just out of curiosity, what motor are you using and what conditions are you running in? I've seen one melt down before, but that was the rc-mini guys doing velodrome runs with ridiculously low turn motors and a dramatic series of barrel rolls.

Velodrome 07
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Old 05-19-2013, 04:58 PM   #18895
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Stock silver can and stock esc
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:35 PM   #18896
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Originally Posted by Granpa View Post
Please, do you realize how this sounds????? You must think Mini drivers or racers, if you prefer, don't have brains enough to wipe their butts.

Frankly, I'm beginning to believe this is either personal or born out of a desire to display your superior intellect, skills etc. Yes, I know you drive TCs, but for some strange reason, this doesn't make me awestruck. I know you don't race your Minis or Mini cause you've said that yourself. You're what I call a "driveway" Mini expert. Expertise born in the "driveway" often isn't valid on the track. Neither does does disagreeing just to disagree prove anything. It just makes you disagreeable and unpleasant to have anything to do with.

Your last post just reached the end of my considerable patience. Why do you even bother to post on a Mini thread???? You, for the most part, don't agree with anything. Is it to give us the benefit of your vast TC knowledge????? Why even bother. Most of us, when we have a problem, don't go running to a TC racer for set up advice. I used to race TCs and realized that a lot of what of TC set up knowledge was not transferable to Minis. If it's not personal or born out of a desire for self aggrandizement, my apologies. but damn, you can sure be a PITA at times.
Geez.

There was none of those intentions in my post. Not sure where you see that.

The sequence of posts would demonstrate why I assumed you thought standing up the shocks would cure a problem which if he shock position was the problem should manifest itself both on right and left turning, yet the OP says it only happens on left corners. Perhaps you need to take more care when collating posts.

The other comments I made have to do with my experience in general, and I don't see why you keep making this a TC vs Mini debate. Assymetrical behaviour of a car doesn't have anything to do with whether it is a mini or a TC. From experience however I have noticed that tracking on minis is very important and if it wasn't mentioned I can not assume it is okay. Most of the time, problems such as that presented here result from the issues I have addressed with no intention to teach anyone to suck eggs. If these issues have been checked and found up to scratch, it is the OP's business to decide. Sometimes even the best overlook the obvious (or take it for granted).

Toe is very (or just more) difficult to measure with accuracy on minis because of their inbuilt slop, that is another reason why I raised the issue.

Really, no need to get aggro here, we're talking toy cars.

PS. My expertise is born on the track, no need to get personal. And by the way, do you realise that you take pot shots at me and make personal comments about me quite often whilst I refrain from any such behaviour? How do you think that sounds?
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:14 AM   #18897
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i find it best not measure toe by any device. do it by eye or just use shims/washers between the steering links

and unlike touring cars many things you do to a mini work opposite
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Old 05-20-2013, 01:23 AM   #18898
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i find it best not measure toe by any device. do it by eye or just use shims/washers between the steering links

and unlike touring cars many things you do to a mini work opposite
Yep, so true on the toe measuring issue. I have a set up station from my TC days, so did very precisely measure toe and the Mini still ran crooked. Almost all Minis are "tweaked" with no simple way to straighten them out. They will nearly all veer off in one direction or another because of tweak in spite of having equal toe on each side.

Minis and 4WD TCs sure do react differently to some adjustments. I've forgotten most of my TC stuff, so am not as confused by the behavior of Minis anymore.
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:29 AM   #18899
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i find it best not measure toe by any device. do it by eye or just use shims/washers between the steering links

and unlike touring cars many things you do to a mini work opposite
That may be true, but I don't think it's because it is a mini, but because it is a FWD car. Looked at from that angle, they don't actually work opposite at all. Experience with real life FWD cars helps.
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:59 AM   #18900
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not quite true, IMHO... i used to race AutoX/Solo and Open track with a FWD car and set-ups are quite different to my FF RCs (i race both Mini and FF03). Weight, suspension geometry, tire/track conditions are so different that what you thought would work on a 1:1 would not necessarily work with a 1:10 RC...
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