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Old 02-18-2013, 01:17 PM   #18406
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Originally Posted by JoeGolf View Post
Hey guys can anyone post pictures of their lipo setup in an M05? I'm having a hard time figuring out what will fit. Also, just about to start racing the mini, what hop ups should I go with. HAS to be TCS legal, so I was thinking ball diff and oil dampers. Anything else anyone would suggest to be competitive? Thanks
Bearings, ball diff, oil shocks are the biggest things.

The battery most of the people I race with use in M03 and M05:
http://www.teamassociated.com/reedy/parts/details/730/
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Old 02-18-2013, 01:29 PM   #18407
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Forgot to mention, I am also looking at the Kimbrough heavy duty servo saver as a way to eliminate steering slop. Is this a good choice?
The Kimbrough servo savers are in many of the Minis here. Good choice.

There are a couple of M04 "gurus" in this area and they maintain that the rear toe in is different from one side to the other. Also that this is responsible for many of the handling problems of the M04. Just passing on some info from a couple of M04 "experts" and have no idea as to it's validity or how to fix the problem.

I'm sure that some have seen this problem and know the "fix"
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Old 02-19-2013, 06:34 AM   #18408
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Bob, you are correct about some of the M04's and rear toe.

There was a bad batch of molds at the time of the second or third release where the right rear had no toe at all and the left was normal. Tamiya replaced those when requested (I bought one of those and they sent me a new chassis ASAP) but I suspect there are a bunch of them out there where the original owner couldn't make it handle decently and tossed it in the closet...perhaps later sold it. So, worth checking.

One way to make the M04 handle better is to use Shoo Goo on all of the joints where the chassis halves come together and then screw them down well. Use a piece of thick lexan on the bottom to join the halves together in front of the transmission and attach it with double sided tape- this makes the chassis a little less springy and more consistent. We also used a weight bar made from flat steel stock that fit under the battery and brought it up to (then) minimum weight. This was all determined to be legal (again, at the time) by TCS.
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Old 02-19-2013, 12:43 PM   #18409
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Bob, you are correct about some of the M04's and rear toe.

There was a bad batch of molds at the time of the second or third release where the right rear had no toe at all and the left was normal. Tamiya replaced those when requested (I bought one of those and they sent me a new chassis ASAP) but I suspect there are a bunch of them out there where the original owner couldn't make it handle decently and tossed it in the closet...perhaps later sold it. So, worth checking.

One way to make the M04 handle better is to use Shoo Goo on all of the joints where the chassis halves come together and then screw them down well. Use a piece of thick lexan on the bottom to join the halves together in front of the transmission and attach it with double sided tape- this makes the chassis a little less springy and more consistent. We also used a weight bar made from flat steel stock that fit under the battery and brought it up to (then) minimum weight. This was all determined to be legal (again, at the time) by TCS.

More great advice, thank you. How do I know if my M04L is one of the bad batch?

I am also looking for the 2-degree rear carriers, but can't seem to find them. Any suggestions on a source? One last question, do the aluminum front knuckles do much to help the steering, or are they just bling?

Thanks again!!
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:01 PM   #18410
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More great advice, thank you. How do I know if my M04L is one of the bad batch?

I am also looking for the 2-degree rear carriers, but can't seem to find them. Any suggestions on a source? One last question, do the aluminum front knuckles do much to help the steering, or are they just bling?

Thanks again!!
I imagine you could tell by just looking.

The aluminum uprights are on my cars only cause I hit a lot of stuff. Other cars, dots, boards, and walls to list a few. Hell, I even hit a bucket once and picked off a few inattentive turn marshals. They are just less prone to bending or breaking. The geometry is the same so there's no handling advantage.

The rear hubs, don't know squat about that.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:21 PM   #18411
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Hi there, do you guys get much leakage from your shocks? I found with the CVA's and now with the TRF Hop-Up's I'm getting quite a bit of leakage... perhaps needing a proper top-up every 8-10 packs.

In my racing buggy (511) I can burn through 20 packs easy without the need for more shock oil and that's my only real experience sorry.

I did use "buggy" methods to build the shocks which when I also refer to this page for Mini shocks seems pretty okay. I even use Associated Green Slime on the rings.

What's your experience? Do I need to upgrade to x-rings?

Sorry if this has previously been discussed, it's a long thread! I did a few searches, found some similar questions but no real discussion.

M03SWB w/TRF 54000 Shocks <- I got these to stop the leakage! The CVA's were quite fine actually otherwise.

TIA
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:38 PM   #18412
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Originally Posted by djmcnz View Post
Hi there, do you guys get much leakage from your shocks? I found with the CVA's and now with the TRF Hop-Up's I'm getting quite a bit of leakage... perhaps needing a proper top-up every 8-10 packs.

In my racing buggy (511) I can burn through 20 packs easy without the need for more shock oil and that's my only real experience sorry.

I did use "buggy" methods to build the shocks which when I also refer to this page for Mini shocks seems pretty okay. I even use Associated Green Slime on the rings.

What's your experience? Do I need to upgrade to x-rings?

Sorry if this has previously been discussed, it's a long thread! I did a few searches, found some similar questions but no real discussion.

M03SWB w/TRF 54000 Shocks <- I got these to stop the leakage! The CVA's were quite fine actually otherwise.

TIA
I race with the fella that wrote that blog! Taught him all he knows about Minis...

Anyway, I'm curious to know what you mean by a "buggy" method to building the TRF Mini shocks - the shock is completely different to the 511 shock and shouldn't be built in the same way.

Building TRF on-road shocks is actually incredibly simple. My first bit of advice is to ignore the shock building tips by the current TC world champion, they will just make your shocks leak more. Simply assemble the shock with the standard parts (I never even bother with green slime on the seals, just a dab of your usual shock oil is enough); fill it with oil; stroke it up and down to remove the air bubbles; pull the piston to the bottom of the body; fit the diaphragm in place and seat it fully so it is not distorted by the oil beneath; and screw on the cap. You'll get consistent shocks that hardly ever leak. Don't use the foam wedge above the bladder though.

As far as o-rings go, the clear ones from the basic TRF shocks are the least likely to leak, the softer blue ones leak more and I'm not sure whether the x-rings are worthwhile when the clear o-rings work so well.

CVA's do leak more, not much you can do about it because of the tolerances in the shock body and the soft materials. TRFs are worth having from a durability point of view - I'm not sure there is any benefit in performance.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:42 PM   #18413
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Well, after the first tcs race of the season...and many hours of tuning and driving...I can honestly say, its all M05 for me. That car was 95% there from the very first lap and got faster all weekend. Rock solid, nothing broke, nothing tweaked and it was a missile on the rug. I gave the 03 and 06 equal time and while the 06 could match a single lap, I just couldn't touch the consistency of the 05. Anyone that's run against well set up 06s on carpet know they are beasts on carpet. The little 05 never gave in and continued to improve even as grip got very high. Never even had to glue sidewalls and used one set of tcs legal premounts all weekend. I am set..its 05 for me period.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:55 PM   #18414
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Originally Posted by sosidge View Post
I race with the fella that wrote that blog! Taught him all he knows about Minis...

Anyway, I'm curious to know what you mean by a "buggy" method to building the TRF Mini shocks - the shock is completely different to the 511 shock and shouldn't be built in the same way.

Building TRF on-road shocks is actually incredibly simple. My first bit of advice is to ignore the shock building tips by the current TC world champion, they will just make your shocks leak more. Simply assemble the shock with the standard parts (I never even bother with green slime on the seals, just a dab of your usual shock oil is enough); fill it with oil; stroke it up and down to remove the air bubbles; pull the piston to the bottom of the body; fit the diaphragm in place and seat it fully so it is not distorted by the oil beneath; and screw on the cap. You'll get consistent shocks that hardly ever leak. Don't use the foam wedge above the bladder though.

As far as o-rings go, the clear ones from the basic TRF shocks are the least likely to leak, the softer blue ones leak more and I'm not sure whether the x-rings are worthwhile when the clear o-rings work so well.

CVA's do leak more, not much you can do about it because of the tolerances in the shock body and the soft materials. TRFs are worth having from a durability point of view - I'm not sure there is any benefit in performance.
Nice. Thread subscribed. If I can get this type of thoughtful response I'll come back some more! Thank you.

Well by "buggy" method I meant pretty much what you described, I was just hesitant to call it anything else because I have no experience with anything else! TBH the TRF shocks are incredibly similar to the 511 ones which gave me the initial confidence followed by the miserable doubt! lol.

You've provided the independent insight I needed - built properly the TRF shocks shouldn't leak much, if at all. I'll work from that point, I needed another reference because I got a bit frustrated today when I had to add 50% additional oil before the end of the day (8 packs).

NB: I've had that blog bookmarked to follow for a while, great pics too. I have an M05 also but am wetting my feet with the M03 which I read is a little more forgiving.
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Old 02-19-2013, 02:09 PM   #18415
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Just wondering,

For an M03M on a carpet medium grip track with glued front tires. The car is feeling dialed, but I'm wondering what shock oil you guy's are running normally?

Also you guys have any advice on getting more rotation, but will not give more grip rolling issues. Small things I'm overlooking maybe? I'm just looking for a couple of hundreds or a few tents of a second to win.

Regards Robert
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Old 02-19-2013, 02:22 PM   #18416
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Just wondering,

For an M03M on a carpet medium grip track with glued front tires. The car is feeling dialed, but I'm wondering what shock oil you guy's are running normally?

Also you guys have any advice on getting more rotation, but will not give more grip rolling issues. Small things I'm overlooking maybe? I'm just looking for a couple of hundreds or a few tents of a second to win.

Regards Robert
Shock oil for me is usually #500/#450, but I don't think the shock oil is as important as the balance of the car.

Front diff setting is a big part of corner speed. Also droop. Tyres too.
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Old 02-19-2013, 02:49 PM   #18417
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Hmmmm.... I can't seem to find the 2-degree rear hub carriers for the M03/M04. I am not required to run the Tamiya version at my track, but I can't even find aftermarket. Anyone have a source? I can only get 0, 1, and 3-degree.

Edit: NM, found them on 3Racing's site.

Last edited by GeekSpeed; 02-19-2013 at 02:59 PM.
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Old 02-19-2013, 03:08 PM   #18418
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Originally Posted by Robert_K View Post
Just wondering,

For an M03M on a carpet medium grip track with glued front tires. The car is feeling dialed, but I'm wondering what shock oil you guy's are running normally?

Also you guys have any advice on getting more rotation, but will not give more grip rolling issues. Small things I'm overlooking maybe? I'm just looking for a couple of hundreds or a few tents of a second to win.

Regards Robert
Robert, try adding a firm rear sway bar to the rear only. I found alot more rotation and less body roll in my 05.
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Old 02-20-2013, 12:30 AM   #18419
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Ok, so I checked out the chassis on my M04, and everything looks to be tight. I checked the screws and there was nothing backing out. I put a new servo saver on order, as well as a new digital servo (was running a Futaba S3003). We'll see if that helps with it not returning to center.

I was also dismayed to see that the M04 is not legal for TCS this year. I was kind of hoping to get in on some of that action. I guess it is just as well, considering that some of the performance parts I might need are discontinued.
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Old 02-20-2013, 12:50 AM   #18420
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Originally Posted by djmcnz View Post
Hi there, do you guys get much leakage from your shocks? I found with the CVA's and now with the TRF Hop-Up's I'm getting quite a bit of leakage... perhaps needing a proper top-up every 8-10 packs.

In my racing buggy (511) I can burn through 20 packs easy without the need for more shock oil and that's my only real experience sorry.

I did use "buggy" methods to build the shocks which when I also refer to this page for Mini shocks seems pretty okay. I even use Associated Green Slime on the rings.

What's your experience? Do I need to upgrade to x-rings?

Sorry if this has previously been discussed, it's a long thread! I did a few searches, found some similar questions but no real discussion.

M03SWB w/TRF 54000 Shocks <- I got these to stop the leakage! The CVA's were quite fine actually otherwise.

TIA
DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT build your shocks as shown in that blog. If you do, you'll ruin the o-ring. The likelihood of getting a shock that leaks is quite high following those directions. The correct way is to extend the shock shaft piston assembly thru the shock body, lube the shock shaft threads, slide the o-ring over the shock shaft. Then the small plastic spacer, then the larger one, watch the orientation, then and only then screw one the cap.

When you put the o-ring and spacers in the or on the shock body, and then screw on the cap, you will compress the o-ring slightly. This will make the hole in the o-ring smaller. Shoving the sharp threads of the shock shaft thru a compressed o-ring, even if you lube or green slime it, will damage the o-ring. The o-ring was designed to compress onto the shock shaft when the end cap is tightened. This is what gives you the seal.

Now, Sosidge, whose opinions I often agree with, inadvertently opened a whole new can of worms. The method he described for filling the shocks will give you a shock with a lot of rebound. This may be what you want on certain track surfaces and layouts. In other situations you may want a lot less rebound or even zero rebound. I'm not going to post how to do this, but most good TC drivers can show you.
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