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Old 05-05-2005, 02:40 PM   #11146
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Default Re: asphalt

Quote:
Originally posted by axel
anybody have luck racing a 3mm chassis on asphalt?
Got why not you can go to malaysia rc forum in rc tech that a guy nick Edwin lee was running 3 mm chassis pro 4 on asphalt. he will tell you his great setting using 2mm chassis.
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Old 05-05-2005, 09:58 PM   #11147
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Default One of those newbie help me setup my car questions.

I know it is kind of hard to diagnose and tune a car like this, but I'm looking for some input. The track I race on is medium/small carpet, rather slippery for carpet but reasonably high speed. I'm running a stock motor. 2.5mm chassis, 2.5mm upper deck.

Issue I'm having is the rear end of the car swaps around about 1/4 of the way into a turn when I'm on power, typically when I am 3/4 to full throttle. The back end gets loose, car spins out. Also unless I am really careful on the throttle the rear end will break loose like I don't have enough sidebite.

My initial setup was the same as the most recent Atsushi Hara/Andy Moore carpet/rubber setup that is on the HPI site (I'd link it for reference but their database is down at this moment.) From that setup, which is very similar to the kit setup, I changed ..

Front:

Shocks; Yellow springs, 50wt AE oil, #3 pistons. Positioned second hole in from the outside on the top, outside hole on the bottom.

2.5 degree front block.
Block height 2mm front/rear.
Camber links are inside hole, 0mm height (no spacers.)
Camber is 1.5 degrees.
Caster is 2.0 degrees.

Rear:

Shocks; same as front, but middle hole on the arm.

2.0 degree rear block.
Block height 2.5mm front/rear.
Camber links are inside hole, 0mm height (no spacers.)
Camber is 2.0 degrees.

Tires: Takeoff CS27's.

Diff rear, oneway front.

Now initially with the kit setup the car was horrible, the rear end was so loose it was like running a drift car. So the initial change I made was springs, which helped some. I then removed the camber link spacers in the rear which improved overall traction, which helped some. I reduced the rear toe to 2.0 degrees to increase sidebite and that helped the most, however going to 1.0 or 0 degrees negates the change the car is really bad again.

I removed the camber link spacers from the front and that increased front end traction some which also seemed to help.

Towards the end of my testing today I tried removing the one way and put a diff in the front, that helped a little as well. The car pushed more, but was more controllable on-power through a turn.

I should also add, at full speed through the 90 degree turn at the end of the straight the car is dialed. High speed, off power, it has just the right amount of turn in and push, and has great rear traction. It's only under power. When making a line through a chicane it's more of a drift through then driving the line, it just slides when it's shifting from left/right on power, or taking a corner at power.

I've also tried various shock springs, AE red and blue, and HPI white, gold, and silver all the way around. The HPI yellow springs seem to be the best and give the quickest response and the most traction overall.

Another thought I had was perhapes I've actually got too little front traction. The car on power does tend to push unless I control the throttle, perhapes I don't have enough front end traction pulling the car through a corner. Does this make sense? I'm still inexperienced enough that I'm not sure.

Anyway, hopefully I've provided enough information and am making some sense. I know it is about impossible to really figure it out without seeing the car but any suggestions would be great. Each change I've made as seemed to make the car a little bit better, but I'm at the point where I'm not sure where to go or if I'm heading in the right direction.

Thanks in advance.

edit: forgot to add droop settings, 7mm front, 6mm rear.

Last edited by Desolas; 05-05-2005 at 10:12 PM.
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Old 05-05-2005, 10:08 PM   #11148
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try 1mm more droop on the front.
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Old 05-05-2005, 10:28 PM   #11149
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What tires are the hot ticket at that track, get the right tires first then figure the set up. CS22 maybe?
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Old 05-05-2005, 10:49 PM   #11150
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I would try a 2.5 or 3.0 rear block,2.0 works on good traction but when traction goes away the car wants to step out mid turn,The reason why your car feels like it has no side bite..with a 2.0 block it doesn't,change the rear block..
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Old 05-06-2005, 12:00 AM   #11151
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my pro 4 came in the mail today!!! No racing this weekend though.
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Old 05-06-2005, 04:50 AM   #11152
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You have to remember with these the setup that you have looked at that Andy Moore always uses a spool and a 2mm chassis. You will have to set your car up differently to compensate for this.
You could try going to 5 or 6 mm droop on the front (more down travel) this will allow the rear more weight and more grip on power. Also maybe combine this with a softer spring in the rear. However you may find then that the car wants to pivot around the rear and it will be easy to drive but slow.

Also if you are allowed I seriously reccomend you try CS22's, they will provide alot more grip on the track conditions you describe. Hope this helps. Jonathan
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Old 05-06-2005, 08:09 AM   #11153
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I will give all those a try. CS22's as well. We're allowed to use them in some classes, and I happen to have a new set of wheels in need of tires..

I'll start with tires, then the rear block, and then droop and see what happens and keep you all posted. Thanks for the suggestions.
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Old 05-06-2005, 11:51 AM   #11154
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Santa came early and dropped off a package for me today..

05 spec 2.25mm upperdeck
05 spec shocks
05 spec 1 piece front bevel gear/input shaft.

my 05 SPec car is about 99.9% complete.

will post some pics later....
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Old 05-06-2005, 12:10 PM   #11155
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Default Rubber tires on carpet

I've been getting my car setup for running rubber tires on carpet. It's getting really close. My lap times with stock are down to almost what the 19 turn cars are turning with foam tires.
Here is what I have right now:

Front:
#2 pistons w/ 70 wt. oil, Assoc. Copper spring
#3 mount on tower and #1 on a-arm
2* caster and -2* camber
Camber link outside with 4mm spacer
1.5* toe block with .8 mm spacer (#4 washer) and wheels set at 0* toe.
5mm ride height and droop set to 1mm over ride height.

Rear:
#2 pistons w/ 50 wt. oil, Assoc. Red spring
#3 mount on tower and #2 on arm.
-2* camber
Camber inside on inner mount and hub. with 3mm spacer.
2.5* toe block with .8mm spacer
5mm ride height and droop set to 2mm over ride height.

2.5mm chassis and top deck
no roll bars
CS22 with medium inserts
Traction compound seems to be the key. Using TQ Mod and doing full width rear and 1/4" on the inside of the fronts for no more than 10 minutes.

The main battle has been to keep the car from traction rolling. I've done that now and it has VERY good balance for the entire run.

take care
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Old 05-06-2005, 12:45 PM   #11156
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Erik..

on the new shocks...what shock length do you recommend. doesn't say in the instructions... 62mm?
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Last edited by rc-zombies; 05-06-2005 at 01:29 PM.
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Old 05-06-2005, 04:04 PM   #11157
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Default HPI pro 4 confusion

i am thinking of buying a hpi pro 4 but am confused as to what different versions of the pro 4 are on the market.

i have been led to believe that hpi make a,
pro 4 v1
pro 4 v1.1
pro 4 2005 edition

are these correct, and also would anyone be able to tell me what the part numbers are for the different versions
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Old 05-06-2005, 04:11 PM   #11158
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Default Re: HPI pro 4 confusion

Quote:
Originally posted by Bony85
i am thinking of buying a hpi pro 4 but am confused as to what different versions of the pro 4 are on the market.

i have been led to believe that hpi make a,
pro 4 v1
pro 4 v1.1
pro 4 2005 edition

are these correct, and also would anyone be able to tell me what the part numbers are for the different versions
V1 is the original batch.
V1.1 same as the V1 except has new revised bevel gears.
05 is entire new. has all the upgrades that Hara and HPI team uses. new upperdeck w/tweak mod, new shocks, new input shaft, new motor mount, etc. and comes with sway bar set, and various toe blocks.

If you're seriously into competative racing..this is the kit to guy.
here are the main 05 Specs:
The USA/ Europe 2005 Spec Pro 4 will have the following:
All standard Pro 4 features
+2.5mm main chassis (original main chassis)
+new upper deck (as shown -- more lateral flex, same fore to aft stiffness, reduced chance of tweaking on impacts, with cone washers and o-rings over the steering posts as used by Hara)
+new motor mount (as shown)
+new shocks (fluorine coated, new bladders, new pistons, new shafts, as shown)
+Delrin diff out drives
+new 1 piece aluminum rear input shaft (combines spur adapter and shaft, with solid pins, much more rigid gear mounting, different than Japanese spec parts)
+new aluminum front input shaft
+new diff nut and new diff screw (larger screw size + T-nut)
+aluminum steering servo mounts
+Spool and One Way will be included
+full range of pivot block spacers to adjust block heights
+0, 2.0, 2.5 and 3.0 degree pivot blocks included
+Heavy Duty, Self Lubricating Ball Cups are also included
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Old 05-06-2005, 04:16 PM   #11159
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wow, so if i do decide on the pr 4 it has to be a 05 edition i guess, would anyone have the part number for this, or is it not released yet?
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Old 05-06-2005, 04:20 PM   #11160
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bony85
wow, so if i do decide on the pr 4 it has to be a 05 edition i guess, would anyone have the part number for this, or is it not released yet?
already released in Asia.
the Asia version will differ from the US/Euro version.
the Asia version will have the 2mm chassis instead of 2.5mm

This is what RcModel quoted me this week:

Quote:
Yes this car is available we have 1 kit in stock.
The price is about US$405.
The weight is 2Kg (included packing)
You can see the following shipping fee:

Method Fee (US$)
EMS to USA 35
Parcel to USA 26
don't know how much shipping will be to the UK.

the US/Euro version has not been released yet... hopefully by end of this month or next.
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HB HARA EDITION PRO4: Gone to a new home..

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