4LikesTamiya TRF416 / TRF416WE / TRF416X
03-03-2008, 12:56 PM
#1531
Blimey this thread moved fast this afternoon....
@ Mike, Steering ackerman... I tend to find more shims behind the ballstud on the rack tends to give more steering, although the straighter link seems to help smooth the steering out.
Running it in the forward hole on the hub seems to make the car more reactive around the centre.
TBH, I haven't really played around with it too much on the 416, did more so on the 415, but settled on the rear hub hole for indoors, and the forward one outdoors, but thats more a preference on steering feel than anything else.
Adam/syndr0me - I know what you mean with the Type R, I actually owned one for a short while last year. Ran a few meetings with it, and whilst it wasn't bad, just seemed to behave completely differently to the 415. Really found it hard to get setup right, would seem to struggle to turn in, then just rotate mid corner... Was also very quick to square up out of a turn too. Did a back to back one day with my 415... and I jumped a lap... suffice to say, didn't keep the car too long after that :S
Back to the 416... Toe blocks, I contacted Rainbow ten about this last week. Apparently the 416's aren't avaliable yet. Which is a bit of an arse as I bent the 416 D block when using it on the front rear to achieve D/D. Thankfully I have some other D blocks (from the Evo4), that can be flipped without any mods, just requires 5mm of spacers rather than 3. I also suggest that you look at getting longer screws than the 3x10's specified in the kit too mount thoose blocks, seems to help prevent bending, as more material is in the blocks.
...and on this point, attached a pic of the S400 3.0 block on the front rear. Measured it up this evening, and it is exactly the same size as a 1C. So that means D/C is good to go (You need to remove material from the C to "flip" it properly). Does require 4mm of shims to get too the right height though.
As for the pinions... whats wrong with using the hole underneath
?
On the Rear hub issue... I'm using 8mm hexheaded ball studs rather than the kit 5mm, which bite into the rear hub further... no stripping yet. On carpet, I'll always use a longer rear link, as it helps to smooth out the rear of the car.
Regards
Ed
@ Mike, Steering ackerman... I tend to find more shims behind the ballstud on the rack tends to give more steering, although the straighter link seems to help smooth the steering out.
Running it in the forward hole on the hub seems to make the car more reactive around the centre.
TBH, I haven't really played around with it too much on the 416, did more so on the 415, but settled on the rear hub hole for indoors, and the forward one outdoors, but thats more a preference on steering feel than anything else.
Adam/syndr0me - I know what you mean with the Type R, I actually owned one for a short while last year. Ran a few meetings with it, and whilst it wasn't bad, just seemed to behave completely differently to the 415. Really found it hard to get setup right, would seem to struggle to turn in, then just rotate mid corner... Was also very quick to square up out of a turn too. Did a back to back one day with my 415... and I jumped a lap... suffice to say, didn't keep the car too long after that :S
Back to the 416... Toe blocks, I contacted Rainbow ten about this last week. Apparently the 416's aren't avaliable yet. Which is a bit of an arse as I bent the 416 D block when using it on the front rear to achieve D/D. Thankfully I have some other D blocks (from the Evo4), that can be flipped without any mods, just requires 5mm of spacers rather than 3. I also suggest that you look at getting longer screws than the 3x10's specified in the kit too mount thoose blocks, seems to help prevent bending, as more material is in the blocks.
...and on this point, attached a pic of the S400 3.0 block on the front rear. Measured it up this evening, and it is exactly the same size as a 1C. So that means D/C is good to go (You need to remove material from the C to "flip" it properly). Does require 4mm of shims to get too the right height though.
As for the pinions... whats wrong with using the hole underneath
?On the Rear hub issue... I'm using 8mm hexheaded ball studs rather than the kit 5mm, which bite into the rear hub further... no stripping yet. On carpet, I'll always use a longer rear link, as it helps to smooth out the rear of the car.
Regards
Ed
03-03-2008, 02:46 PM
#1535
Haha, I thought everyone knew about the hole in the bottom of the chassis for the pinion set screw! 
I also run a longer ball stud on the rear hub as I always run 3mm shims under it. Plus I've been using the inner hole on the hub. I like this feel better for our technical layouts we have on asphalt. Just remember to place a grub screw in the outter hole to strenghten it up if you use inner hole.
Hmmm, still not satisfied with the ackermann issue. I'll just have to do more back to back testing. I'm just looking for a tad more steering with a spool in the slow tight corners. What I might actually need is more initial steering. And I'm just going about it wrong by looking for midcorner. Hmmm.
Thanks for your replies guys.
I also run a longer ball stud on the rear hub as I always run 3mm shims under it. Plus I've been using the inner hole on the hub. I like this feel better for our technical layouts we have on asphalt. Just remember to place a grub screw in the outter hole to strenghten it up if you use inner hole.
Hmmm, still not satisfied with the ackermann issue. I'll just have to do more back to back testing. I'm just looking for a tad more steering with a spool in the slow tight corners. What I might actually need is more initial steering. And I'm just going about it wrong by looking for midcorner. Hmmm.
Thanks for your replies guys.
03-03-2008, 02:52 PM
#1536
If you do not care about being TCS legal, you can just get the Square Ti 46mm bones. They are expensive. But you can find those every where.
03-03-2008, 02:58 PM
#1537
Are you using the Foam in your shocks...I have them in both of my kit, this helps a alot. Although the Ray08 is just alittle better. I do not use the tamiya ones.....I use the Ray Speed three different type of foam damping.......
I wish I would have checked the 416 over before the track......for my rear shocks were sticking......the car was stupid fast. If it was driveable I would have check out.......
I wish I would have checked the 416 over before the track......for my rear shocks were sticking......the car was stupid fast
. If it was driveable I would have check out.......
03-03-2008, 03:23 PM
#1538
Tech Adept
jimmy,
try some higher oil in your front shocks, maybe if you can find em, 2degree caster blocks and about ackerman, its kind of a fine tune setting just as diff setting is... i kind of controll the amount of slip the tires have when entering a corner. last year i tested alot with the rear diff and i found that when tightening it slightly instead of as free as possible gave better laptimes as the rear would keep grip longer... also it gave slightly more steering going on throttle, gave a nice feel as well... you could also try some more toe-out...
greeeeeetingsss
mark
try some higher oil in your front shocks, maybe if you can find em, 2degree caster blocks and about ackerman, its kind of a fine tune setting just as diff setting is... i kind of controll the amount of slip the tires have when entering a corner. last year i tested alot with the rear diff and i found that when tightening it slightly instead of as free as possible gave better laptimes as the rear would keep grip longer... also it gave slightly more steering going on throttle, gave a nice feel as well... you could also try some more toe-out...
greeeeeetingsss
mark
03-03-2008, 03:56 PM
#1539
maybe Tower isnt carrying them, but they are still in stock at TamiyaUSA:
http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/ite...oduct-id=51092
http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/ite...oduct-id=51092
03-03-2008, 04:00 PM
#1540
Haha, I thought everyone knew about the hole in the bottom of the chassis for the pinion set screw!
I also run a longer ball stud on the rear hub as I always run 3mm shims under it. Plus I've been using the inner hole on the hub. I like this feel better for our technical layouts we have on asphalt. Just remember to place a grub screw in the outter hole to strenghten it up if you use inner hole.
Hmmm, still not satisfied with the ackermann issue. I'll just have to do more back to back testing. I'm just looking for a tad more steering with a spool in the slow tight corners. What I might actually need is more initial steering. And I'm just going about it wrong by looking for midcorner. Hmmm.
Thanks for your replies guys.
I also run a longer ball stud on the rear hub as I always run 3mm shims under it. Plus I've been using the inner hole on the hub. I like this feel better for our technical layouts we have on asphalt. Just remember to place a grub screw in the outter hole to strenghten it up if you use inner hole.
Hmmm, still not satisfied with the ackermann issue. I'll just have to do more back to back testing. I'm just looking for a tad more steering with a spool in the slow tight corners. What I might actually need is more initial steering. And I'm just going about it wrong by looking for midcorner. Hmmm.
Thanks for your replies guys.
Could try reducing the amount of wheel spacers, that would give slightly more front end. Also could try C/A, as that would also give more mid-corner.
HiH
Ed
03-03-2008, 07:11 PM
#1542
I have heard nothing but great things about this car, especially on rubber tires. It may serve me well to pick one but, but money is an issue now.
How much are they? Where can I get one?
Khal
How much are they? Where can I get one?
Khal
03-03-2008, 07:39 PM
#1543
Concluded my first race meeting yesterday on a prepped asphalt surface. The car was awesome...
Ran the car in 10.5 (19T) and 13.5 (Stock) classes. I had to file off a little bit of the top deck (inner) to fit a larger pinon for stock, but other than that it was a pretty smooth day. One funny quirk, though, is that i had remove the four screws that mount the back of the top plate so I could access the pinion grub.
Ran the car with Sorex 32's and a one way in both classes. Amazing corner speed!! Reduced the rear toe to about 2deg and the car was just the perfect balance of sidebite through corners but free at the same time (I like a little bit of a looser feeling for the car, especially in the lower hp classes).
I stripped out the rear uprights though with a small side hit. Simple fix - running the inner holes until I find spares/buy the Square ones that will probably come out.
The car is amazing. I'm a believer...
Ran the car in 10.5 (19T) and 13.5 (Stock) classes. I had to file off a little bit of the top deck (inner) to fit a larger pinon for stock, but other than that it was a pretty smooth day. One funny quirk, though, is that i had remove the four screws that mount the back of the top plate so I could access the pinion grub.
Ran the car with Sorex 32's and a one way in both classes. Amazing corner speed!! Reduced the rear toe to about 2deg and the car was just the perfect balance of sidebite through corners but free at the same time (I like a little bit of a looser feeling for the car, especially in the lower hp classes).
I stripped out the rear uprights though with a small side hit. Simple fix - running the inner holes until I find spares/buy the Square ones that will probably come out.
The car is amazing. I'm a believer...
hello just want to ask what's your motor (13.5 and 10.5)? what gearing or pinion did you use? i tried putting my 13.5 lrp with a 42 or43 pinion and at first i was not able to fit it. so what i did is to unscrew the top deck and put the pinion first before i put the top deck. thanks
03-03-2008, 08:25 PM
#1545
Thanks for the input guys.
Yesterday I was alittle scared to try some more toe-out up front because my rear end was loose. But it was loose mid-out. What I did to correct that was camber gain. I had 2mm under the inner link in the rear. I went down to 1mm and it solved that issue. I may try more toe-out up front as I know that is a powerful adjustment for entry. Wish I had more time to test.
I may try higher oil in my car now that you suggested it.. I used to run heavier oil when I ran my Yok years ago. It seemed to like it. So I may try it on this car.
Ed, I'm running D/D up front (I run LWS arms). And no axle shims. Wish I had a C block that I didn't have to mod out. Maybe I'll just wait for Tamiya to come out with one. That or just a C/B setting... OR.... E/D? up front? haha.
Bmmer, are you running the kit 105 spur? If so, you can not use that spur for brushless 17.5~10.5 motors. It's too large. I run a 102 spur and the largest pinion I can use is a 46 before the pinions start to touch the top deck. This combo gives you about a 4.55 final. I use this for 13.5. You could go with a 96 spur if you want to run 13.5 or 10.5. Or get maybe an 88 spur if you want to run 17.5. I have yet to try 17.5. But I will soon.
Travis, MRE spool with 501/416 oneway pulley (or just use the pulley in your kit). Flip the pulley onto the other side of the spool. Pics posted awhile back in this forum.
Yesterday I was alittle scared to try some more toe-out up front because my rear end was loose. But it was loose mid-out. What I did to correct that was camber gain. I had 2mm under the inner link in the rear. I went down to 1mm and it solved that issue. I may try more toe-out up front as I know that is a powerful adjustment for entry. Wish I had more time to test.
I may try higher oil in my car now that you suggested it.. I used to run heavier oil when I ran my Yok years ago. It seemed to like it. So I may try it on this car.
Ed, I'm running D/D up front (I run LWS arms). And no axle shims. Wish I had a C block that I didn't have to mod out. Maybe I'll just wait for Tamiya to come out with one. That or just a C/B setting... OR.... E/D? up front? haha.
Bmmer, are you running the kit 105 spur? If so, you can not use that spur for brushless 17.5~10.5 motors. It's too large. I run a 102 spur and the largest pinion I can use is a 46 before the pinions start to touch the top deck. This combo gives you about a 4.55 final. I use this for 13.5. You could go with a 96 spur if you want to run 13.5 or 10.5. Or get maybe an 88 spur if you want to run 17.5. I have yet to try 17.5. But I will soon.
Travis, MRE spool with 501/416 oneway pulley (or just use the pulley in your kit). Flip the pulley onto the other side of the spool. Pics posted awhile back in this forum.