R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-08-2009, 09:01 AM   #9811
Tech Master
 
Pablo Diablo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 1,003
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Send a message via Skype™ to Pablo Diablo
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by YmeBP View Post
So my question is how does this "lean" affect the Type-R specifically, does low roll center promote lean, or does high roll center promote lean?
Lower roll center will transfer more weight onto the outside tyres in a corner. Higher roll center, in comparison, will keep a little more on the inside tyres.

Because we run negative camber on all wheels, only the outside tyres have have a full contact patch(if the right amount of camber is used) in a corner. So in a way you want as much weight on the outside as possible so the wheels with the right geometry are doing the work. If you unload the inside too much you will diff out and lose drive.

If you run a spool you want as little weight as possible on the inside tyre so its not scrubbing against the outside. But too much roll and you could traction roll! Also more roll means a less reactive car in tight technical sections of a track. To quote Dragonfire, "its all a compromise".
__________________
Paul H

Losi Type R | Xray T3 | CRC Gen XL | CRC Gen X 10 ME(Messiah Edition) | Black Diamond

www.FlyingFoxRC.com | Advanced Electronics | Team CRC | Factory Messiah
Pablo Diablo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 09:51 AM   #9812
Tech Elite
 
metalracer2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Riverside, CA
Posts: 2,548
Trader Rating: 20 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to metalracer2
Default

does anyone besides me live in cali and run the type r?
there is a new indoor onroad track that is opening with in the next week
__________________
First you forget names, then you forget faces. Next you forget to pull your zipper up and finally, you forget to pull it down.
Team BOOZE CRUISEN!
Rides....
AE B4.1W AE T4.1
metalracer2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 10:56 AM   #9813
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Italy in Altavilla Vicentina (Vi)
Posts: 55
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRXS_chris View Post
^^^^ Pics required please matey!

My Flying Fox layshaft arrived here in the UK yesterday and has been installed. VERY impressed with the quality of the item!


I'll try. I'am not so able with CPU.

ciao ciao
Belty Dog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 11:51 AM   #9814
Tech Elite
 
YmeBP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,927
Trader Rating: 32 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4wheeldrift View Post
Its the distance between the center of gravity and the roll center. The larger the distance the more leverage = more lean. Lower roll center is going to be a greater distance from the CG. Good example would be off road cars. High CG, low RC. Motorcycles are the opposite. Low CG and very high RC, thats why they lean into a corner.

I use this software Roll Centre and Camber Gain Calculator
For me having roll centers within a mm front to rear seams to work out the best for me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pablo Diablo View Post
Lower roll center will transfer more weight onto the outside tyres in a corner. Higher roll center, in comparison, will keep a little more on the inside tyres.

Because we run negative camber on all wheels, only the outside tyres have have a full contact patch(if the right amount of camber is used) in a corner. So in a way you want as much weight on the outside as possible so the wheels with the right geometry are doing the work. If you unload the inside too much you will diff out and lose drive.

If you run a spool you want as little weight as possible on the inside tyre so its not scrubbing against the outside. But too much roll and you could traction roll! Also more roll means a less reactive car in tight technical sections of a track. To quote Dragonfire, "its all a compromise".
The reason why I love this forum . Thanks guys this is great i think I'll have to make sure to spend a quiet day at the track trying out very drastic differences between the front and the rear of the car.
__________________
www.skyrocketracing.com quality RC gear!
http://www.rctech.net/forum/racing-forum/555071-2011-skyrocket-invitational-blue-diamond-raceway-october-15-16-a.html <- Great race!
YmeBP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 03:33 PM   #9815
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 5,310
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4wheeldrift View Post
Its the distance between the center of gravity and the roll center. The larger the distance the more leverage = more lean. Lower roll center is going to be a greater distance from the CG. Good example would be off road cars. High CG, low RC. Motorcycles are the opposite. Low CG and very high RC, thats why they lean into a corner.

I use this software Roll Centre and Camber Gain Calculator
For me having roll centers within a mm front to rear seams to work out the best for me.
I'll simplify that for you more...
Lower rollcenter = more grip / less response
Higher rollcenter = less grip / more response
What you need to be fast depends on the grip levels and layout but because the type R is ultra responsive at all times (due to chassis layout) I feel that with rubber low will always give better results. Foam however always has grip so I would lean the other way with high roll centers.

As mentioned above rollcenters are rarely the same front to rear. This is what is called the roll axis which is an imaginary line running between the front and rear rollcenters (sorry no pics). The best use for this line is to understand how much of your chassis weight is effecting each end of the chassis. I generally run a roll axis leaning towards the front which means that more weight is over my front wheels all the time giving greater grip at that end. This however takes some experience to handle as the chassis will "lose" the rear end in line with the amount you lift off the throttle.

Anyway setup is a pretty complicated thing but as mentioned a few posts ago is usually an adaptation of the chassis to suit the driver so once you find a happy medium setup there will be minimal change from track to track.

Hope I haven't confused everyone...
__________________
Blade: Andro Treiber H 79g AN
FH: Donic Bluefire M3 Max Blk
BH: Donic Bluefire M2 Max Red
Powered by Falco
Dragonfire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 04:34 PM   #9816
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 872
Trader Rating: 35 (100%+)
Default

Can someone please help. I have searched, google searched and it is still not clear to me. I am very new to touring car.

What is the recommended gearing, spurs and pinions to run on an asphalt track typically for a 13.5 motor. I can use either a Novak or Hacker 13.5.

Also, what is better, a 48 or 64 pitch spurs and pinions? I read that 64p strip easy on asphalt, is this really a bad problem?

I believe I already ordered a 92t 48p pinion, however I am going to place another order tomorrow to make sure I get the right gearing.

I can run some boost using a Tekin RS Pro.

Please help JRXS pros!
__________________
High Desert Raceplace, Grand Jct CO, Sanwa Exzes Plus Stick Radio, Spektrum,Thunderpower 230g, Modified Tri-Nut Novak GTB2, Ballistic 4.5t 550, 5.83lb SCTE Ten, Novak Sentry Brushless Dyno, Crossweight Setup Station, Junsi 20A power supply Icharger 20A Charger,TP610C, 22B, Novak Edge, Novak 13.5, SC10, Havoc Pro SC XDrive, Ballistic 17.5 Matthew Joseph Cordova
mattnin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 07:18 PM   #9817
Tech Champion
 
MikeXray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: New York
Posts: 5,747
Trader Rating: 72 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragonfire View Post
I'll simplify that for you more...
Lower rollcenter = more grip / less response
Higher rollcenter = less grip / more response
What you need to be fast depends on the grip levels and layout but because the type R is ultra responsive at all times (due to chassis layout) I feel that with rubber low will always give better results. Foam however always has grip so I would lean the other way with high roll centers.

As mentioned above rollcenters are rarely the same front to rear. This is what is called the roll axis which is an imaginary line running between the front and rear rollcenters (sorry no pics). The best use for this line is to understand how much of your chassis weight is effecting each end of the chassis. I generally run a roll axis leaning towards the front which means that more weight is over my front wheels all the time giving greater grip at that end. This however takes some experience to handle as the chassis will "lose" the rear end in line with the amount you lift off the throttle.

Anyway setup is a pretty complicated thing but as mentioned a few posts ago is usually an adaptation of the chassis to suit the driver so once you find a happy medium setup there will be minimal change from track to track.

Hope I haven't confused everyone...
You won't run high roll center on foams, you need the slower weight transfer to prevent traction rolling on turn in, maybe if you were running hard front tires, but everyone runs rears all around these days.
__________________
Mike L. Awesomatixusa.com | TQWire.com | Islandraceway.com |JacksonRCracing.com | Horsham RC | Sweepracingusa.com
MikeXray is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 08:00 PM   #9818
Tech Master
 
jkirkwood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,223
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeXray View Post
You won't run high roll center on foams, you need the slower weight transfer to prevent traction rolling on turn in, maybe if you were running hard front tires, but everyone runs rears all around these days.
+1
jkirkwood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 09:47 PM   #9819
Tech Adept
 
C.Poh's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Placentia
Posts: 154
Default

metalracer2-- their will be a couple of guys running the losi including my self down here at westcoast rc hope to see you out at the track it will be open very very shortly...

Pablo are you the one in charge of all the ordering of that lay shaft i need to order one, my buddy Chris is running one of the flyingfox shafts out here and its working good, need to see what i have to do to get my hands on one??? thanks
__________________
MUGEN SEIKI
AKA RACING
JS ENGINES
AIRTRONICS
C.Poh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 10:43 PM   #9820
Tech Elite
 
metalracer2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Riverside, CA
Posts: 2,548
Trader Rating: 20 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to metalracer2
Default

c.poh-- i will defiantly be there
__________________
First you forget names, then you forget faces. Next you forget to pull your zipper up and finally, you forget to pull it down.
Team BOOZE CRUISEN!
Rides....
AE B4.1W AE T4.1
metalracer2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 10:47 PM   #9821
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 872
Trader Rating: 35 (100%+)
Default

can anyone help me and give me any gearing suggestions?
__________________
High Desert Raceplace, Grand Jct CO, Sanwa Exzes Plus Stick Radio, Spektrum,Thunderpower 230g, Modified Tri-Nut Novak GTB2, Ballistic 4.5t 550, 5.83lb SCTE Ten, Novak Sentry Brushless Dyno, Crossweight Setup Station, Junsi 20A power supply Icharger 20A Charger,TP610C, 22B, Novak Edge, Novak 13.5, SC10, Havoc Pro SC XDrive, Ballistic 17.5 Matthew Joseph Cordova
mattnin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 11:14 PM   #9822
Company Representative
 
SweepRacingUSA's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: www.SweepRacingUSA.com
Posts: 1,690
Trader Rating: 6 (100%+)
Default

hope this help Mattnin



Can someone please help. I have searched, google searched and it is still not clear to me. I am very new to touring car.

What is the recommended gearing, spurs and pinions to run on an asphalt track typically for a 13.5 motor. I can use either a Novak or Hacker 13.5.



>>108 T 64 P Spur with a 45 pinion should be good starting point if you have a PRS spur adaptor.



Also, what is better, a 48 or 64 pitch spurs and pinions? I read that 64p strip easy on asphalt, is this really a bad problem?

>>if your track is prepped commercial track go with a 64P, for parking lot or street run go with a 48P spur



I believe I already ordered a 92t 48p pinion, however I am going to place another order tomorrow to make sure I get the right gearing.

>>>>order 45T-50T pinions. with 108T spur in 64Pitch if you have a PRS adaptor, if not wait for few minute. I ll look up gear chart
>>I assume you ordered Losi 48P spur gear LOSA3973 if you wanted to use that gear then you will need 37T-40T in 48P gears but you will need to double chck if motor can move that far to fits those pinion.
>>bottom line is you need final Gear Ratio 4.2 to 4.5 for a 13.5 motor


I can run some boost using a Tekin RS Pro.

Please help JRXS pros!

>>>sorry me no pro~
__________________
SweepRacingUSA.com 2014 &2015 US. NATIONAL CHAMPION!
10th Buggy F1 TC 8th Buggy 8th Truggy GT8 M-Chassis Monster Truck(SRC) Bodies&Wings

Last edited by SweepRacingUSA; 07-08-2009 at 11:27 PM.
SweepRacingUSA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2009, 11:59 PM   #9823
Tech Master
 
Pablo Diablo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 1,003
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Send a message via Skype™ to Pablo Diablo
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by C.Poh View Post
Pablo are you the one in charge of all the ordering of that lay shaft i need to order one, my buddy Chris is running one of the flyingfox shafts out here and its working good, need to see what i have to do to get my hands on one??? thanks
I'm the person who makes them. If you are in the USA you are better off ordering from www.skyrocketbatteries.com He sells them for the same price as me and his postage is lower and faster as he is also based in the states.

Good to hear they working well. I'm not far from showing you all my next part for the Type R!!!
__________________
Paul H

Losi Type R | Xray T3 | CRC Gen XL | CRC Gen X 10 ME(Messiah Edition) | Black Diamond

www.FlyingFoxRC.com | Advanced Electronics | Team CRC | Factory Messiah
Pablo Diablo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2009, 12:07 AM   #9824
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 872
Trader Rating: 35 (100%+)
Default

da jon, thank you very much for all the information.
__________________
High Desert Raceplace, Grand Jct CO, Sanwa Exzes Plus Stick Radio, Spektrum,Thunderpower 230g, Modified Tri-Nut Novak GTB2, Ballistic 4.5t 550, 5.83lb SCTE Ten, Novak Sentry Brushless Dyno, Crossweight Setup Station, Junsi 20A power supply Icharger 20A Charger,TP610C, 22B, Novak Edge, Novak 13.5, SC10, Havoc Pro SC XDrive, Ballistic 17.5 Matthew Joseph Cordova
mattnin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2009, 05:36 AM   #9825
Tech Regular
 
JRXS_chris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Manchester, England
Posts: 386
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pablo Diablo View Post
I'm the person who makes them. If you are in the USA you are better off ordering from www.skyrocketbatteries.com He sells them for the same price as me and his postage is lower and faster as he is also based in the states.

Good to hear they working well. I'm not far from showing you all my next part for the Type R!!!
Looking forward to seeing this!

Any clues?
JRXS_chris is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
[FS] Team Losi JRXS-Type R squarehead R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 9 07-21-2012 12:59 AM
Team Losi JRXS Type R gtxpro2 R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 18 09-11-2008 08:45 PM
WTB: Team Losi JRXS Type R shifter R/C Items: Wanted to Buy 1 07-03-2008 03:30 PM
Team Losi JRXS TYPE-R John Q R/C Items: Wanted to Buy 1 10-03-2007 06:55 PM
Team Losi JRXS Type R New In Box Canyon R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 0 06-20-2007 04:50 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 01:27 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0