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Old 07-13-2009, 01:26 PM   #10201
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If you need to run 11mm of ride height to get your car to work something is not right unless you running offroad with your touring car to need that much ride height. The bumpiest track I ever ran on we ran 7mm of ride height and then another 4mm of droop so the suspension had extra travel to go up and down for the bumps but still didn't have 11mm ride height. We had 11mm of total height but when setting in race height it was only 7mm.

Most normal track I run on we use 5mm of standard ride height.
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Old 07-13-2009, 02:14 PM   #10202
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Well my dropp was none existant too. Stafford's not that bumpy a track, especially compared to somewhere like Broxtowe, which was designed as an off-roader.

What I'm running is novak gtx with a checkpoint 19turn brushed motor, not ready to make the jump to brushless yet, more bother than it's worth right now.

My shocks do keep leaking, but I rebuilt them all the day before, and checked them before each run and they we're fine, so that's why I'm at a loss for what to do.
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Old 07-13-2009, 03:19 PM   #10203
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sld - Best bet is to put on Olly J's setup from West London (its on the CML site). Copy it exactly, it should be a pretty good starting point for Stafford.

Been a looooong time since I ran brushed at Stafford, but think with a checkpoint we ran something around the 5.4 mark for gearing.

11mm ride height is silly, probably causing more problems with the car than solving any! As I said, start with Olly's setup and see what that's like.
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Old 07-13-2009, 08:48 PM   #10204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M.Abramowicz View Post
Hi!

I have a simple question for advanced TC5 users

How is drag in drive train?

When I take my tc5 with new clean bearings, belts has got soft tension,
spur and pinion is 64p or 48p with very nice mesh, engine is 9.5T or 10.5T with
low drag (small rotors), and I take front tire (solid axle) and try turn, it give
some drag, I must put more load then I do this with TRF416 or Xray ... (even Serpent S400).

What I fu... up and what's going on?
Last day I have clean car, put a kungfukawaski to GM ESC and engine,
take top end with 80C and others are faster ... Car was fast but ...

Now I got trf416 belt for front, looking for team bomber for rear or 63T from cyclone TC (maybe fit, I know that tc5 at rear has 64T).

Maybe when I change belts it will help or not? Or if help how much?

How much I can got when use better spur and pinion? this time play
with HotBodies/HPI and Edit ... maybe must use better one?

For 1st time I have stock trf416 belt and wait for low friction one ....



Regards!
m.

ps: I'm a little disappointed, got this chassis for 1.5y, put a lot of work and
when meet tamiyaz or xrayz got fuu ... and I don't like it in spec 9.5T/5cell class
I don't really like my recent tc5 purchase either. I have to believe it is the belts causing all the drag. If I take my belts off, the center spur spins freely, up front spins freely, and the back spins freely. Both the front and back are fully assembled with the dog bones in. So I guess it has to be the belts. I have tried with the belts on the loosest setting and there still seems to be a lot of drag. So many other cars you can just grab a wheel and spin it, and it will spin for at least a few seconds. My tc5 does not.

I also don't like all the play in the car. There is a huge amount of play in my center pulleys. There is play in every portion of it. There is play between the shaft and the pins. There is play between the pins and pulleys. So just a huge amount of play. There is play between all the axle shafts and bearings. The bearings are good and the shafts seem fine, there is just a lot of space between them. Then in the front of the car, everything has play. The combined play from the caster block bushings, ball cups, steering rack, and axle to bearing is hideous.

I just got this car and I really haven't messed with it too much. I will try to tighten this all up to be at least bearable to me. And with all this being said, the car drives great. I am finding more and more corner speed as I get to know the car. I just get frustrated when I work on the car. So many portions of the car have so much slop and it just bugs me. I don't know why, it just does.

I really did not mean to complain, but I just reads M.Abramowicz and feel the same frustrations.

So of the items I have mentioned, is this pretty much standard for the tc5? Are you guys finding "fixes" for them or just leaving the car as it is?

--pakk
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Old 07-13-2009, 10:22 PM   #10205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pakk View Post
I don't really like my recent tc5 purchase either. I have to believe it is the belts causing all the drag. If I take my belts off, the center spur spins freely, up front spins freely, and the back spins freely. Both the front and back are fully assembled with the dog bones in. So I guess it has to be the belts. I have tried with the belts on the loosest setting and there still seems to be a lot of drag. So many other cars you can just grab a wheel and spin it, and it will spin for at least a few seconds. My tc5 does not.

I also don't like all the play in the car. There is a huge amount of play in my center pulleys. There is play in every portion of it. There is play between the shaft and the pins. There is play between the pins and pulleys. So just a huge amount of play. There is play between all the axle shafts and bearings. The bearings are good and the shafts seem fine, there is just a lot of space between them. Then in the front of the car, everything has play. The combined play from the caster block bushings, ball cups, steering rack, and axle to bearing is hideous.

I just got this car and I really haven't messed with it too much. I will try to tighten this all up to be at least bearable to me. And with all this being said, the car drives great. I am finding more and more corner speed as I get to know the car. I just get frustrated when I work on the car. So many portions of the car have so much slop and it just bugs me. I don't know why, it just does.

I really did not mean to complain, but I just reads M.Abramowicz and feel the same frustrations.

So of the items I have mentioned, is this pretty much standard for the tc5? Are you guys finding "fixes" for them or just leaving the car as it is?

--pakk
Until I read your post I never gave any thought to the issues you brought up.
I guess the belts are stiffer then on the XRay I ran before and there probably is more slop in the car but on the track I cant notice these things... I dont turn laps any slower than with my 08.
The cars are different and need different setups but at the end of the day both are fast.
I expect a little more slop considering the price difference.
I wouldnt waste my time trying to eliminate the slop as I never could see a advantage on the track.... some of my fastest cars over the years were pretty sloppy
If these things really bother you maybe you should consider buying a more expensive touring car.... everyone has their own idea of whats important in a car and with the many options out there you should be able to find one that suites you
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Old 07-13-2009, 11:09 PM   #10206
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couple of ?'s

1. Is there a Steel outdrive Spool for this car

2. Is there a fix/mod for the back end arm mounts so that there is no force on the hinge pin holders when doing up the screws and having say 3 deg rear toe.
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Old 07-14-2009, 06:42 AM   #10207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pakk View Post
I don't really like my recent tc5 purchase either. I have to believe it is the belts causing all the drag. If I take my belts off, the center spur spins freely, up front spins freely, and the back spins freely. Both the front and back are fully assembled with the dog bones in. So I guess it has to be the belts. I have tried with the belts on the loosest setting and there still seems to be a lot of drag. So many other cars you can just grab a wheel and spin it, and it will spin for at least a few seconds. My tc5 does not.

I also don't like all the play in the car. There is a huge amount of play in my center pulleys. There is play in every portion of it. There is play between the shaft and the pins. There is play between the pins and pulleys. So just a huge amount of play. There is play between all the axle shafts and bearings. The bearings are good and the shafts seem fine, there is just a lot of space between them. Then in the front of the car, everything has play. The combined play from the caster block bushings, ball cups, steering rack, and axle to bearing is hideous.

I just got this car and I really haven't messed with it too much. I will try to tighten this all up to be at least bearable to me. And with all this being said, the car drives great. I am finding more and more corner speed as I get to know the car. I just get frustrated when I work on the car. So many portions of the car have so much slop and it just bugs me. I don't know why, it just does.

I really did not mean to complain, but I just reads M.Abramowicz and feel the same frustrations.

So of the items I have mentioned, is this pretty much standard for the tc5? Are you guys finding "fixes" for them or just leaving the car as it is?

--pakk


My car had slop from day one. I ended up replacing everything I could with Losi parts. That was pain but it did take out a lot of slop. Profit margin must of been a big issue with Thunder Tiger.
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Old 07-14-2009, 06:51 AM   #10208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jag88 View Post
My car had slop from day one. I ended up replacing everything I could with Losi parts. That was pain but it did take out a lot of slop. Profit margin must of been a big issue with Thunder Tiger.
What have you change? Can you wrote more?

For shaft and pulleys, I use a thick locktile and it's works better, my friend put
there some CA glue

Regards!
m.
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Old 07-14-2009, 07:30 AM   #10209
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Yes, please share what losi parts you upgraded to.

I thought about gluing the center pulleys together. I don't know how long you and your friend have been using threadlock/glue, but I thought about using jb weld. But then I would have to replaced all the parts in the center diff if one broke. But then again, this is a tc5 and parts are cheap.


--pakk
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Old 07-14-2009, 08:27 AM   #10210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M.Abramowicz View Post
Hi!

I have a simple question for advanced TC5 users

How is drag in drive train?

When I take my tc5 with new clean bearings, belts has got soft tension,
spur and pinion is 64p or 48p with very nice mesh, engine is 9.5T or 10.5T with
low drag (small rotors), and I take front tire (solid axle) and try turn, it give
some drag, I must put more load then I do this with TRF416 or Xray ... (even Serpent S400).

What I fu... up and what's going on?
I've been thinking about this for a while now, and I think this happens when the center layshaft is too far above the centerline of the front and rear pulleys (mostly just the rear since it's belt is shorter) which causes the belt to be pulling down on the center layshaft which doesn't get offset by the front belt. The Losi, for example, has it's layshaft centerline at the same height as the pulleys, and I've watched so many Losi's just spin when you do that test on them, whereas I've never seen a TC5 do that. It appears the XRay 009 also has it's center layshaft at about the same height as the pulleys, and the TC5's is higher. You may want to check out http://www.exotekracing.com/ - they have a lowered center layshaft carrier for the TC5 which, in theory, may help the problem.

I tried TRF416 belts in my Kawada, and it didn't make as much difference as I was hoping for. The best results came from cleaning and oiling the bearings with light oil.
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Old 07-14-2009, 09:10 AM   #10211
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I don't worry about the slop too much. Some slop will never affect the cars handling. I actually took a car and shimmed out all of the slop one time and it was the worst handling car and never would go straight. I then took all the shims I put in out so it would have the slop again and was amazed how well the car worked and how it would now go straight.

I think many get too carried away and worried about slop because some 5$500 plus car has less slop than are $350 car. Work on setup more and maybe shim a little slop out but just run it because the slop won't hurt you.

I remember when I ran for Schumacher and Chris Tossolini at that time won the Nationals and also raced for Schumacher. I was on vacation in Florida and stopped by Schumacher to get some parts and check out the place. They had Chris's touring car at the shop and when I looked at it it had easily 3 times more slop than my Schumahcer car did but he didn't have no problems that year lapping the field with his car. Main thing is slop is just not really a huge problem. Ever since that I don't worry about it too much. I will just change out totally worn parts in the drive train but mostother slop I just leave it in the car.
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Old 07-14-2009, 09:11 AM   #10212
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What about changing diff height?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thirtybird View Post
I've been thinking about this for a while now, and I think this happens when the center layshaft is too far above the centerline of the front and rear pulleys (mostly just the rear since it's belt is shorter) which causes the belt to be pulling down on the center layshaft which doesn't get offset by the front belt. The Losi, for example, has it's layshaft centerline at the same height as the pulleys, and I've watched so many Losi's just spin when you do that test on them, whereas I've never seen a TC5 do that. It appears the XRay 009 also has it's center layshaft at about the same height as the pulleys, and the TC5's is higher. You may want to check out http://www.exotekracing.com/ - they have a lowered center layshaft carrier for the TC5 which, in theory, may help the problem.

I tried TRF416 belts in my Kawada, and it didn't make as much difference as I was hoping for. The best results came from cleaning and oiling the bearings with light oil.
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Old 07-14-2009, 09:31 AM   #10213
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Hello guys just wondering if someone have done what I am planning to do.

- Change the original shocks for the Tamiya part number TA42102, since I bought the car I could not get them to work properly, always leaking, specially the rear ones.

- Exotek lowered lay shaft cap, to reduce the drag, I think it is going to work fine.

- TC5R cam holders, they got more adjusting them the originals I got.

- Ceramic ball diff, also if someone have changed something on the diff to last more, post it, I think it is a negative point of the car.

- New shim kit, I want to take out the play on the axles, they are huge and it is hard to set up the car like that.

- ITF chassis and top deck, I tried to use it in the past but could no get rid of the Tweak so I got the original one back, now I want to put it back again so any advise would be good.

This is a couple of things I want to do with the car, I do not think this car is slow compared to the high dolar ones, here in my club, we had one guy last year running wit a TC5 beating XRays, Serpents, Corally and doing track time records, so I think it can be a good car.
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Old 07-14-2009, 12:04 PM   #10214
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If the tightness is from the center pulley being too high, there are two options.

One is the exotek holders. It lowers the shaft 1.25mm.

The other option is this completely new rear bulk head. It seems to do two major changes. One is lower the center shaft 5mm and move the motor 5mm to the center.

--pakk
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Old 07-14-2009, 12:13 PM   #10215
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What I've done, which is a bit time consuming, is dremel off every other tooth on the front and rear pulleys. Similar to what Tamiya has been doing for years to reduce belt friction

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabricio View Post
- ITF chassis and top deck, I tried to use it in the past but could no get rid of the Tweak so I got the original one back, now I want to put it back again so any advise would be good.

This is a couple of things I want to do with the car, I do not think this car is slow compared to the high dolar ones, here in my club, we had one guy last year running wit a TC5 beating XRays, Serpents, Corally and doing track time records, so I think it can be a good car.
This is my advice for reducing tweak www.exotekracing.com
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