R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-26-2009, 06:36 PM   #8626
Tech Fanatic
 
Airflow's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Manila
Posts: 823
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by revo61 View Post
If the screws for the motor are too long you can damage your motor. I have not need any longer screws for the suspension holders.
The Ti screw that Ive used still gives 2mm clearance inside the vector x11 motor unlike the 4mm clearance using stock screws.

I read somewhere in this thread that you have to use longer screws on
some areas of the tc5 to increase durability, Im just using my instincts in
identifying the areas that needs longer screws.

Im just asking if it will be better durability-wise, if I use longer Ti screws
on the suspension holders so I can use up all the thread of the arm mount
nut and thus provide more hold.

Thanks
Airflow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2009, 06:43 PM   #8627
Tech Master
 
mr crum's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: tampa florida 813
Posts: 1,591
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via Yahoo to mr crum
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Airflow View Post
The Ti screw that Ive used still gives 2mm clearance inside the vector x11 motor unlike the 4mm clearance using stock screws.

I read somewhere in this thread that you have to use longer screws on
some areas of the tc5 to increase durability, Im just using my instincts in
identifying the areas that needs longer screws.

Im just asking if it will be better durability-wise, if I use longer Ti screws
on the suspension holders so I can use up all the thread of the arm mount
nut and thus provide more hold.

Thanks
yes longer screws in the suspension holders is a must exspecially if u rum 3 degrees rear toe like most people do i think i use 10 or 14 mm length screws just on the rear suspension mounts
__________________
SPEED PASSION TEAM DRIVER
ADAB RACING FACTORY PILOT
WWW.ADRENALINERACEWAY.COM
FL INDOOR R/C COMPLEX
TEAM B.R. RACING
mr crum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2009, 06:56 PM   #8628
Tech Fanatic
 
Airflow's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Manila
Posts: 823
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr crum View Post
yes longer screws in the suspension holders is a must exspecially if u rum 3 degrees rear toe like most people do i think i use 10 or 14 mm length screws just on the rear suspension mounts
Hey thanks. But will it matter if I use Ti or just ordinary hardware hex screw?

The 3 degrees rear toe-in is "total"? I mean 1.5 toe-in left and
right = 3 degrees? Or 3 degrees for each side?
Airflow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2009, 06:59 PM   #8629
Tech Master
 
mr crum's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: tampa florida 813
Posts: 1,591
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via Yahoo to mr crum
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Airflow View Post
Hey thanks. But will it matter if I use Ti or just ordinary hardware hex screw?

The 3 degrees rear toe-in is "total"? I mean 1.5 toe-in left and
right = 3 degrees? Or 3 degrees for each side?
well odviously titanium screws are stronger than regular steel but use wat u got and its 3 degrees each side a 1mm shim is 1.2 degrees
__________________
SPEED PASSION TEAM DRIVER
ADAB RACING FACTORY PILOT
WWW.ADRENALINERACEWAY.COM
FL INDOOR R/C COMPLEX
TEAM B.R. RACING
mr crum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2009, 07:15 PM   #8630
Tech Fanatic
 
Airflow's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Manila
Posts: 823
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Right now Im using the 1.5 shim on each side which equates to 1.8 degrees?

Im setting this up for speed runs. Do you think I should put more toe-in?
What shims are needed to achieve 3 degrees toe-in? Or am I just
fine with the 1.5 shim?

Thanks again man
Airflow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2009, 07:35 PM   #8631
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: RPB, South Florida
Posts: 324
Trader Rating: 20 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimPotter View Post
Rick, bring the car to the track on Wed, we will figure it out, I bet it has something to do with Tweek from the chassis, as we kind of ruled out the other issues. You had to do some dremeling to get the chassis on the car... so...

Also bring all your spares including the old chassis
I missed your post Tim... You are probably right. You had it all set up almost perfect. The problem all started with the new chassis.

See you Wednesday.
GTSSTANG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 12:43 AM   #8632
Tech Initiate
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 23
Default Longer screws

The screws supplied with the kit are just fine, no need to exchange them with longer ones.

When tightening them bear in mind they are 3 mm, they are easily over tightened. Use your fingers to tighten them, instead of the entire arm.

The end cap of a brushless motor (alu can) is around 4 mm, so a motor screw longer than 6 mm will just have the end hanging in the air anyway. With the risk of damaging the internals, as mentioned by others before.

The only places I have stripped anything is steering blocks and rear uprights, and always due to a hard impact. I'd rather exchange those, than bulkheads or hinge pins. Something have to give, when you put in the wall.

Put longer screws in the hinge pin holders, when you space out the A-arms. And use longer balls at the steering rods and camber links, if you run more than 2 mm spacers here.

Best,
Peter Knudsen
petk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 01:06 AM   #8633
Tech Fanatic
 
Airflow's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Manila
Posts: 823
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by petk View Post
The screws supplied with the kit are just fine, no need to exchange them with longer ones.

When tightening them bear in mind they are 3 mm, they are easily over tightened. Use your fingers to tighten them, instead of the entire arm.

The end cap of a brushless motor (alu can) is around 4 mm, so a motor screw longer than 6 mm will just have the end hanging in the air anyway. With the risk of damaging the internals, as mentioned by others before.

The only places I have stripped anything is steering blocks and rear uprights, and always due to a hard impact. I'd rather exchange those, than bulkheads or hinge pins. Something have to give, when you put in the wall.

Put longer screws in the hinge pin holders, when you space out the A-arms. And use longer balls at the steering rods and camber links, if you run more than 2 mm spacers here.

Best,
Peter Knudsen
Got it, thanks.

Right now Im using the 1.5 shim on each side which equates to 1.8 degrees?

Im setting this up for speed runs. Do you think I should put more toe-in?
What shims are needed to achieve 3 degrees toe-in? Or am I just
fine with the 1.5 shim on each side?
Airflow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 03:40 AM   #8634
Tech Regular
 
chrisfrom619's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: San Diego California
Posts: 294
Send a message via Yahoo to chrisfrom619
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Airflow View Post
Got it, thanks.

Right now Im using the 1.5 shim on each side which equates to 1.8 degrees?

Im setting this up for speed runs. Do you think I should put more toe-in?
What shims are needed to achieve 3 degrees toe-in? Or am I just
fine with the 1.5 shim on each side?
hey bro I have the same shims on car I think it's fine I've run my car from novak 17.5 brushless to 7700kv mamba max with lipos I never changed my rear toe-in. I see your from Manila (kumusta) I grew up in Pateros now I'm residing here in San Diego CA. Goodluck on your car it's a really good car wins a lot of local parking lot races here in San Diego.
__________________
#1 Sponsor: Wifey
Hpi baja, traxxas e-maxx,slash, AE TC5R, RC18R,SC10, Thunder Tiger EB4 S2, and Futaba 4pk

DHW Raceway San Diego CA.
Novice Class
chrisfrom619 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 06:43 AM   #8635
Tech Champion
 
Scottrik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Billings, MT
Posts: 6,206
Trader Rating: 245 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr crum View Post
well odviously titanium screws are stronger than regular steel but use wat u got
I believe you'll find this is, generally, incorrect. Titanium, in and of itself, is NOT stronger than steel, nor are titanium fasteners inherently stronger than steel fasteners. Something that DOES make a difference, in the case of Lunsford products anyway, is the fact that they roll their threads rather than cut them. It is the PROCESS, not the material, that gives them their "strength" advantage. Perfect example is pan car threaded axles. The Associated steel axles break comparatively easily at the first thread where the axle goes into the steering block. The Associated part has cut threads and these create natural stress risers. That first thread (basically against the "plate" created by the hex) is not truly supported by the material into which it is threaded. By contrast, the Lunsford axles I've NEVER seen one break. I've bent 'em, but I've never seen one break.

The material strength (all things equal) and weight line up in the same manner, least to greatest: aluminum, titanium and steel. Processing can alter that order, especially between titanium and steel as they are not terribly far apart, like for like, weight-wise. The difference between aluminum and titanium is far greater in both regards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr crum View Post
3 degrees each side a 1mm shim is 1.2 degrees
THIS is the information jsaves and I are looking for. We have been concerned that folks are confusing 3mm difference front/back with 3 degrees. Now if the mounts were some certain length apart along the hinge pin this could certainly be the case...and judging by your numbers they're not TOO far off (mounts would need to be a bit further apart to get to that magic 1 degree per mm threshold)...but it appears they're not. Is this information printed somewhere, the number of degrees per mm? We were about to embark upon a journey of measuring things up, using some trigonometry (thank goodness I'm a math teacher!!) and find out for ourselves, but if this 1.2 degrees per mm is definitively published somewhere we'd be beholden to you were you to point us to that nugget!! Save us a fair bit of work and head-scratching.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Airflow View Post
Im setting this up for speed runs. Do you think I should put more toe-in?
Toe is the enemy of speed. It will add stability, but it causes tire scrub, and tire scrup eats horsepower, loss of horsepower means loss of speed. Someone at Michelin once told me, and I can't remember the exact number, but if your family car is 1/8" out on toe-in it is basically dragging the tire sideways 100 feet for every mile it travels. Whatever the number was it depends greatly on the oa diameter of the tire but the idea still holds with our toy cars. It ends up being a balancing act, particularly in power-limited classes like 17.5 Stock or (worse yet) Vintage TransAm...you have to balance losing speed and acceleration to gaining the stability and handling characteristics of additional toe.
__________________
Congressmen should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we can identify their corporate sponsors.

THE REVOLUTION WILL NOT BE TELEVISED -Gil Scott-Heron (1949-2011)
Scottrik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 07:09 AM   #8636
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,759
Default

.8mm is equal to 1 deg of toe.


I have to disagree with the toe is the enemy statement. Rear toe is stability and forward traction.

There is no doubt that a car with 3 deg of toe (in any tc class) will produce faster lap times than any tc with 0 or 1 deg of rear toe.
Josh Hohnstein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 07:14 AM   #8637
Tech Champion
 
Scottrik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Billings, MT
Posts: 6,206
Trader Rating: 245 (100%+)
Default

I don't disagree with you at ALL, Josh, but please note the context. He said he's doing speed runs, and while toe may produce faster lap times it absolutely creates drag. For lap times, as I indicated, we have to find that balance between additional toe for the traction and stability vs. the induced drag. It appears that "balance" for this car may, likely, live around 3 degrees. For an outright speed run that balance very likely lies much lower, like closer to zero.

Is that mm per degree toe spec printed somewhere that we might find it when I forget again (and I will)? Wasn't able to find it in the manual or on the AE site.

Many thanks,

Scottrik
__________________
Congressmen should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we can identify their corporate sponsors.

THE REVOLUTION WILL NOT BE TELEVISED -Gil Scott-Heron (1949-2011)
Scottrik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 07:27 AM   #8638
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,759
Default

If you measure the thin plastic 1 deg clips that come with the kit they are .81mm. 2 deg is 1.62mm.
Josh Hohnstein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 08:14 AM   #8639
Tech Elite
 
yodace's Avatar
R/C Tech Charter Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Caleb
Posts: 2,485
Trader Rating: 7 (100%+)
Default

One those new bulkheads, are there any mods u need to do fit them on or can u just slap on?
yodace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 08:27 AM   #8640
Tech Master
 
losi guy's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 1,258
Trader Rating: 38 (100%+)
Send a message via ICQ to losi guy
Default

For you guy's running the lipo plates, what are using for the screws for the battery strap? I bought the manutech tray and I'm using a smc 5000 lipo and the screws are to short to put my battery strap on. I really don't want to use tape but I will if I have to. Thanks.
__________________
Spektrum | Avid | DE Racing | Tekno
losi guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FS: Team Losi XXXS G+ with parts!! Team Orion V2 Hitec 5625 cola R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 9 06-18-2008 07:11 PM
BATTERIES - Team Orion 4200 SHO Team Cells (6 cell) packs................... For Sale 2-Bad Australia For Sale/Trade 0 03-21-2008 01:16 AM
New Items for Sale Tamiya F103gt Chassis Kit, Team Much More CTX-D, Novak, Team Orion Tsquare R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 14 04-17-2007 07:29 PM
>>> BRAND STINKING NEW NEVER RAN TEAM JAMMIN FACTORY TEAM FTE RACING BUGGY <<<< mach51 R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 5 01-25-2007 08:13 PM
F/S Team Associated Factory Team RC18T with Mamba Comp X Brushless and Extras ZeroCool101 R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 7 01-07-2006 12:54 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 11:10 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net