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Old 08-23-2016, 10:37 AM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: TLR 22 3.0 Race Kit Thread!
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Cub86 posted the question: Hi. I'm struggling to understand the lay down situation. I run on high bite damp smooth clay and think the conversation would help on my surface but from what I'm reading I need to buy the lay down kit tlr338004. And the dirt gear case tlr332063. But do I really need both from what I've read the dirt case is 1-2mm higher anyway and u don't use the +3mm hubs or the front pivot hrc or Hrc mod. So is the dirt lay down kit tlr332063 is all that's needed to get me a lay down set up that's suited for clay With the components and car I already have. And if I only get the dirt case is there any problems that will need to be addressed IE.. bone plunge . I do know I'll need 1mm spacers on the waterfall to clear the battery. Thanks guys really trying to get my head around this.

Franks response:
Laydown Conversion will work great by itself. You run the aluminum +3mm hubs, the diff is +3.5mm, and you run the HRC front setup. Just follow a setup sheet from tlracing.com (Frank Root).

Dirt Tranny has the diff at the same height as the standard tranny case, and works with the standard plastic hubs. Both are +/- 0mm from stock. When you run this, no need to run the HRC front mod either.

I've found the stock laydown conversion parts to work great for most tracks. The dirt tranny is a great tuning option, but definitely not 'required'.

K.King
Something I made, pretty basic. Just to give people an idea.

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Old 02-09-2016, 09:13 AM   #1951
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Important thing to remember about Pro setups: These setups are developed by the most skilled drivers in the world, at tracks that are usually groomed to the best conditions possible and run with no concern for tire life (heavy traction additive use in some cases).

Most times they're pretty dialed but I always expect to change a few things because: I am slower, my track might not have the same grip as it did when Dustin raced there, my tires may not be as perfect.

Gromy, search for a digital copy of any of the XXX buggy instruction manuals. In the back they have a pretty good guide for all of the tuning adjustments that outline what most of them do. It's handy to keep accessible (on your smartphone or paper) at the track so you can decide what changes to make after a practice run.
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Old 02-09-2016, 10:10 AM   #1952
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That's why I love this forum!! Thanks Davidk!! That would help a ton, a little cheat sheet!! Ill see if I can dig one up.

I hear ya on the pro set up thing. Makes sense. I'm not a pro by any means, but it would appear that I cant drive a pro setup either!!

Back to the base line and tune it from there. I enjoyed this car much more in kit form, as opposed to a pro set up.

I will say, the car was VERY responsive to the changes I have made, just seem to be going the wrong direction with it. Still LOVE the car, just trying too many changes at once.

Thank you again!!
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Old 02-09-2016, 10:28 AM   #1953
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gromy82 View Post
a little cheat sheet!!
Petitrc.com already has a cheat sheet online. It's buried in their site, but you can find it at Setup > Technical Review > Offroad > "Process to set up a car"
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Old 02-09-2016, 10:48 AM   #1954
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Originally Posted by Gromy82 View Post
I'm noticing the same thing lately. I tried the Mayfield setup last weekend and i dont think it likes my local track. Car seemed more stable in kit form. Ass end now steps out on entry, and cant seem to get the forward drive off the corner. I am running 32.5 oil up front and 30 in the rear. Kit pistons. kit springs. car jumps and lands great, just low rear grip, is how I would explain it.

Maybe a newb question, but as a rule of thumb, what effect does moving the shock mounts in/out have? Also what effect does moving ball stud location have?? I want to experiment with that kind of thing, just don't want to waste time going the wrong direction.

OH....I'm running 17.5 blinky btw

Any help is greatly appreciated!! Thanks!!

Nick

by all means use a setup cheat sheet but also this should not be a crutch for your own testing. don't be afraid to try things. Most adjustments can be undone in a few minutes and it does not hurt to have that personal experience see what changes do.
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Old 02-09-2016, 11:49 AM   #1955
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Originally Posted by nexxus View Post
My 22 is giving me no joy. Kit set up besides the 4 gear transmission to try and get some more grip. Car is very unsettled off jumps and tends to bounce around a lot, and finds every rut on the track, struggles between on power oversteer and off power understeer, I think I've placed dead last every time I've run it

Outdoor clay track low-medium grip, running rebar rears and vektor fronts. Fastest lap is 2-3 seconds down on the fast guys, Tekin RS Spec esc and 17.5 motor.
Hi Mate - what's your email and location in Australia? I'll get you in touch with someone from our Australian team to help you get it sorted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cracky1970 View Post
Big shout out to Frank Root and Nick Miller for the help yesterday helping me with my 22 3.0. I was getting frustrated thinking I no rear grip in the car. They gave me some suggestions, after each change the car got better. I have a few more changes to make to the car they suggested and I feel I will be where I need to be.
Glad it's getting right for you! Make sure to get those tires/foams sorted for next time, and it'll be even better!

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Originally Posted by hacker07 View Post
I think your oils may be reversed as many of us are running 35 in front and 32 in rear at ocrc so if it doesnt work the way you have it, you may try going the other way...just a thought.
I am actually running 32.5 front and 35 in the rear, as I did at Reedy Race, and is posted on my setup sheet

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the turnbuckles are a good upgrade though.


anyone know what spec the screws for the 1/10 losi cars are?

ex: m2,m3 etc
Most of the screws are M3.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tony montana View Post
Ok so if I want to run 2.4 tires, I want the losi 61mm rim correct? All these tire and wheel sizes get confusing.
2.4" = 60mm = 61mm = VTR = Evo....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gromy82 View Post
I'm noticing the same thing lately. I tried the Mayfield setup last weekend and i dont think it likes my local track. Car seemed more stable in kit form. Ass end now steps out on entry, and cant seem to get the forward drive off the corner. I am running 32.5 oil up front and 30 in the rear. Kit pistons. kit springs. car jumps and lands great, just low rear grip, is how I would explain it.

Maybe a newb question, but as a rule of thumb, what effect does moving the shock mounts in/out have? Also what effect does moving ball stud location have?? I want to experiment with that kind of thing, just don't want to waste time going the wrong direction.

OH....I'm running 17.5 blinky btw

Any help is greatly appreciated!! Thanks!!

Nick
Make sure to try the FULL setup when changing to one. For example, Maifield's setup doesn't use kit springs or pistons, like you are still running. Every part of the setup works in unison, when so changing only part of it, the rest may not be right and the balance could be poor.

I ran stock last week for a night, and ran my Reedy Race setup, only changing to a stiffer front spring (1 rate), and it was DIALED. I'd give that a shot, but remember to try all of it.
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Old 02-09-2016, 12:17 PM   #1956
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Frank........

I see on your set up sheet the spring rates. Are those TLR lf springs? If so what is the part number? Or are they included in the TLR spring kit? (currently have front and rear spring kits on order) I also saw Mayfield running kyosho springs, which finding kyosho springs, are like finding a unicorn around my area!! I guess I'm asking what is the TLR equivalent??

I also have the pistons you recommended coming as well. Trying to load the tool box with any and all options, so I can was you stated "run the full set up"

Again this info is beyond helpful!!
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Old 02-09-2016, 01:38 PM   #1957
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gromy82 View Post
Frank........

I see on your set up sheet the spring rates. Are those TLR lf springs? If so what is the part number? Or are they included in the TLR spring kit? (currently have front and rear spring kits on order) I also saw Mayfield running kyosho springs, which finding kyosho springs, are like finding a unicorn around my area!! I guess I'm asking what is the TLR equivalent??

I also have the pistons you recommended coming as well. Trying to load the tool box with any and all options, so I can was you stated "run the full set up"

Again this info is beyond helpful!!
We sometime test springs not manufactured by TLR, and when this is the case moving forward, the spring rate will be listed. These can easily be looked up on Petit Rc.

Kyosho white is probably closest to our LF orange or silver front spring. The gold rear is between a pink and red TLR LF spring.
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Last edited by Frank Root; 02-09-2016 at 02:17 PM.
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Old 02-09-2016, 02:09 PM   #1958
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Root View Post
We sometime test springs not manufactured by TLR, and when this is the case moving forward, the spring rate will be listed. These can easily be looked up on Petit Rc.

Kyosho white is probably closest to our LF orange or silver front spring. The gold rear is between a pink and white TLR LF spring.
Wouldn't between pink and white be yellow on the TLR chart?
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Old 02-09-2016, 02:17 PM   #1959
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gromy82 View Post
Frank........

I see on your set up sheet the spring rates. Are those TLR lf springs? If so what is the part number? Or are they included in the TLR spring kit? (currently have front and rear spring kits on order) I also saw Mayfield running kyosho springs, which finding kyosho springs, are like finding a unicorn around my area!! I guess I'm asking what is the TLR equivalent??

I also have the pistons you recommended coming as well. Trying to load the tool box with any and all options, so I can was you stated "run the full set up"

Again this info is beyond helpful!!
Quote:
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Wouldn't between pink and white be yellow on the TLR chart?
Updated
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Old 02-09-2016, 02:53 PM   #1960
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Originally Posted by Frank Root View Post
I ran stock last week for a night, and ran my Reedy Race setup, only changing to a stiffer front spring (1 rate), and it was DIALED. I'd give that a shot, but remember to try all of it.
Frank,

In the promo video you mentioned the front to rear balance was 36-64.
Does this still hold true today?
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Old 02-09-2016, 03:17 PM   #1961
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Killer!! Ill check it out.

Thanks Frank and Casper. You guys are a HUGE help!! Off to test all this new knowledge.......TBC
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Old 02-09-2016, 03:56 PM   #1962
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Frank,

In the promo video you mentioned the front to rear balance was 36-64.
Does this still hold true today?
Depends on where you mount the battery and electronics, but it is absolutely possible. We've been running a little further forward than that, although my car hasn't been on the scales lately.
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Old 02-09-2016, 04:02 PM   #1963
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Hey frank, what setup changes do u make to the esc? Is there something u look for when making these changes
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Old 02-09-2016, 04:25 PM   #1964
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Loving it. Box stock with the exception of the 4 gear trans and 2mm on the front inner link instead of 3mm. Weighs 1560. Slick track, geared at 70/30 with a trackstar v2 motor. This thing rocks.

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Old 02-09-2016, 05:36 PM   #1965
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Hey frank, what setup changes do u make to the esc? Is there something u look for when making these changes
That's a tough one. It really goes by feel, and you won't always know when it's right, but you should know when it is wrong.

I can put my Orion setup up if you have an Orion ESC?

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Loving it. Box stock with the exception of the 4 gear trans and 2mm on the front inner link instead of 3mm. Weighs 1560. Slick track, geared at 70/30 with a trackstar v2 motor. This thing rocks.

Sweet!
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