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Old 08-23-2016, 10:37 AM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: Official TLR 22 3.0 Race Kit Thread!
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Cub86 posted the question: Hi. I'm struggling to understand the lay down situation. I run on high bite damp smooth clay and think the conversation would help on my surface but from what I'm reading I need to buy the lay down kit tlr338004. And the dirt gear case tlr332063. But do I really need both from what I've read the dirt case is 1-2mm higher anyway and u don't use the +3mm hubs or the front pivot hrc or Hrc mod. So is the dirt lay down kit tlr332063 is all that's needed to get me a lay down set up that's suited for clay With the components and car I already have. And if I only get the dirt case is there any problems that will need to be addressed IE.. bone plunge . I do know I'll need 1mm spacers on the waterfall to clear the battery. Thanks guys really trying to get my head around this.

Franks response:
Laydown Conversion will work great by itself. You run the aluminum +3mm hubs, the diff is +3.5mm, and you run the HRC front setup. Just follow a setup sheet from tlracing.com (Frank Root).

Dirt Tranny has the diff at the same height as the standard tranny case, and works with the standard plastic hubs. Both are +/- 0mm from stock. When you run this, no need to run the HRC front mod either.

I've found the stock laydown conversion parts to work great for most tracks. The dirt tranny is a great tuning option, but definitely not 'required'.

K.King
Something I made, pretty basic. Just to give people an idea.

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Old 12-08-2015, 07:51 AM   #826
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Originally Posted by philc View Post
Thanks, I have to admit, i did not even look myself before I posted my question.
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Old 12-08-2015, 08:18 AM   #827
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Originally Posted by Frank Root View Post
The TLR 22 2.0/3.0 wheel off-set is very different from the AE/KYO off-set.
I'm a 2WD Buggy Noob and sorry for the ignorance on the topic, but all this discussion about wheel off-set is very confusing, rather than generalize a brands proprietary (confusing) offset, I would appreciate it more if retailers would specify exactly what the offset is, like 0mm, etc. in similar fashion to how touring car wheels are sold.

Will you please share what the offset is for the front/rear wheels in mm?

I mistakenly ordered some rear RB6 wheels thinking they would fit, but this product page is advertising that TLR22 is compatible with AE/KYO:
http://www.amainhobbies.com/rc-cars-trucks/proline-racing-velocity-vtr-2.4-rear-wheels-w-12mm-hex-2-tlr22-b4.2-rb6-yellow-pro2749-02/p298355

Was there a change in offset between the TLR22 and later released versions?

Is it possible for me to change Hex adapters to a thicker hex to make up this difference in the change of offset or will I need to return the order when it arrives and re-order different 2.4" wheels?

The included 2.2" wheels aren't going to do me any good because the tires that I need in that size are currently sold out... oops!

TIA

Tyler Hooks was kind enough to let me test drive his car at Thornhill Jr so he should be credited for my decision to pre-order through Horizon. I can't wait to start my build soon and more thanks to Chris Wheeler for posting his stock setup, I plan to start there as our local track appears to have very similar conditions.... oh and kudos for posting installed electronics and gearing, that is a huge help!


Last edited by billdelong; 12-08-2015 at 01:43 PM.
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Old 12-08-2015, 08:18 AM   #828
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I want to make sure you know you can call Horizon Customer Support and they will be happy to replace those parts that you feel are defective. I would use the call back feature so it doesnt eat up much of your time.
Thank you for your response. I did know that was an option but the $5-$10 in parts won't kill me.

My disappointment comes from the initial responses saying I (and others) need to learn how to tighten screws......"get a feel for it".
Followed by "my car is fine"

It is unacceptable for a company representative to tell a customer who just spent a fair amount of money on one of their products that they are clueless.......even if that person was clueless.

Your response in place of a few of the other previous responses would have been a much better route to take.

I can assure you I am not the only person who had issues with the car.
I am also not the only person who thought some of Franks comments were a very poor way for a company to communicate with a customer.
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Old 12-08-2015, 08:40 AM   #829
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Originally Posted by 303slowdown View Post
This being my first TLR and probably my last, I thought I'd give my opinion. The shocks are the worst I've built (not sure if I got some bad xrings ) they leak just sitting on the bench. I've bled the front shocks four of five times and can not get the same rebound. The shock shaft pushed through the xrings like there not even there.
I've been building these shocks for a very long time and even replace my x-rings every couple of months. Even change shock oil it seems at least once a race. Never have had an issue. Follow this link and watch how to build a losi shock and you should not have an issue.

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...DF2&FORM=VIRE2

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Originally Posted by 303slowdown View Post
Others have talked about stripping screw holes , although I didn't strip out any holes some are probably very close. Screwing on the front shock tower those screws barely get snug.
The first lesson I have learned is if the screw gets tight stop! Probably you have the wrong screw (too long). Sometimes the screw called for is too long and if you keep cranking it then it strips. If the screw gets tight and is still not snug, stop get a shorter screw.

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Steering rack is pretty tight too, was also disappointed the rack wasn't aluminum but soft plastic . So far after building the 22 3.0 I am not impressed with it but I'll give it a shot and see how it drives before I make my decision to sell it.
The steering rack and the dog bones have been addressed and are not a big deal. Don't tighten the steering so much and if you want take the spacer from the tuning bag and add 1mm to the dog bone spacing.
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Old 12-08-2015, 09:20 AM   #830
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Got mine in yesterday, just have the shocks left to build and just like any other TLR the build was great no problems at all. I did get to drive one this past weekend at the track and I love how planted it is. I cant wait to get mine on the track.
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Old 12-08-2015, 09:29 AM   #831
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I always let my x-rings soak for about 2 hours before I build them. Then build as video posted.
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Old 12-08-2015, 09:54 AM   #832
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Originally Posted by Josh Hohnstein View Post
Thank you for your response. I did know that was an option but the $5-$10 in parts won't kill me.

My disappointment comes from the initial responses saying I (and others) need to learn how to tighten screws......"get a feel for it".
Followed by "my car is fine"

It is unacceptable for a company representative to tell a customer who just spent a fair amount of money on one of their products that they are clueless.......even if that person was clueless.

Your response in place of a few of the other previous responses would have been a much better route to take.

I can assure you I am not the only person who had issues with the car.
I am also not the only person who thought some of Franks comments were a very poor way for a company to communicate with a customer.
Doing my best to help, sorry it wasn't what you wanted.
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Old 12-08-2015, 10:17 AM   #833
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whats the wing shim setteing out of the box
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Old 12-08-2015, 10:31 AM   #834
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Hohnstein View Post
Thank you for your response. I did know that was an option but the $5-$10 in parts won't kill me.

My disappointment comes from the initial responses saying I (and others) need to learn how to tighten screws......"get a feel for it".
Followed by "my car is fine"

It is unacceptable for a company representative to tell a customer who just spent a fair amount of money on one of their products that they are clueless.......even if that person was clueless.

Your response in place of a few of the other previous responses would have been a much better route to take.

I can assure you I am not the only person who had issues with the car.
I am also not the only person who thought some of Franks comments were a very poor way for a company to communicate with a customer.

While I agree with your comments about the plastics and Frank's response, I will say we are very fortunate to have the design engineer on a public forum that will answer our questions. How many other brands would do that? I own or owned a B5M RB6 and never seen the level of service that I see from Frank. Don't want to speak for Frank but his background is product design not customer service. If you wanted customer service call Horizon.

Thanks Frank for making yourself available to us.
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Last edited by Speedychris22; 12-08-2015 at 11:29 AM.
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Old 12-08-2015, 10:47 AM   #835
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Originally Posted by Speedychris22 View Post
While I agree with your comments about the plastics and Frank's response, I will saw we are very fortunate to have the design engineer on a public forum that will answer our questions. How many other brands would do that? I own or owned a B5M RB6 and never seen the level of service that I see from Frank. Don't want to speak for Frank but his background is product design not customer service. If you wanted customer service call Horizon.

Thanks Frank for making yourself available to us.

+1....Thanks Frank. All the guys at TLR that I've met or talked with are all first class.
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Old 12-08-2015, 10:59 AM   #836
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This is my third new losi car in less than 2 years. I absolutely love the shocks and haven't had one leak yet. But I do use green slime when I build them.
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Old 12-08-2015, 11:21 AM   #837
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Built it, ran it hard for couple days. Had a high speed tangle on a long straight and a mid-air tangle on a large jump. Made me cringe, but survived. No issue with dogbones, no issues with any screws backing out. Love the buggy. Definitely a different feel than the 2.0.

As for the comments, specifically about customer service. It is not unreasonable to assume that some issues are self inflicted. And even though someone may not be using a hammer drill to drive in their stuff, the truth is that you do need to get a feel for how a metal screw will go into a plastic. Stripping one screw is one thing. Stripping multiple... not sure what to say.

No forum is immune to this. People tend to complain more than give praise - complains stand out more generally. Some are more sensitive than others...

Thanks TLR, especially Frank.
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Old 12-08-2015, 11:58 AM   #838
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lenman73 View Post
This is my third new losi car in less than 2 years. I absolutely love the shocks and haven't had one leak yet. But I do use green slime when I build them.
I was a green slime believer for 20 years then this new Pro-Tek Blue stuff is great.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlsO2oge2yk
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Old 12-08-2015, 01:23 PM   #839
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Originally Posted by Mudcat981 View Post
I was a green slime believer for 20 years then this new Pro-Tek Blue stuff is great.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlsO2oge2yk
It's cool that you're sharing product information, but if you read Franks post #819 he claims the o-rings are designed to swell and fit perfectly AFTER the Silicone oils have come in contact with the o-rings. Wouldn't using this for TLR's (Awesome) Shocks cause the o-ring NOT to swell and possibly cause leaks?
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Old 12-08-2015, 02:08 PM   #840
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I have built about 9 of the TLR 22 series kits. at least 2 of each model including the 2.0's and the new 3.0. I have only been in the hobby for about 3 years having never owned or built any kits previously.

I can say honestly these kits are top quality. Nothing is ever perfect but these guys strive for it and never stop R&D to keep the products evolving and improving. I have never had any issues with building shocks or anything else to do with the kit.

I will say on occasion i have striped one or two screws and over tightened some too. I know any issues i have had were minor to say the least and the cause of the operator not the product.

Keep up the excellent work guys, Thanks Frank for making himself available to answer questions. As others have said this level of service and backing is not available for most of the other brands out there.

Shocks have been flawless for me in all kits even with the old 1.0 bladders without bleeder caps.
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