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Old 08-23-2016, 10:37 AM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: Official TLR 22 3.0 Race Kit Thread!
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Cub86 posted the question: Hi. I'm struggling to understand the lay down situation. I run on high bite damp smooth clay and think the conversation would help on my surface but from what I'm reading I need to buy the lay down kit tlr338004. And the dirt gear case tlr332063. But do I really need both from what I've read the dirt case is 1-2mm higher anyway and u don't use the +3mm hubs or the front pivot hrc or Hrc mod. So is the dirt lay down kit tlr332063 is all that's needed to get me a lay down set up that's suited for clay With the components and car I already have. And if I only get the dirt case is there any problems that will need to be addressed IE.. bone plunge . I do know I'll need 1mm spacers on the waterfall to clear the battery. Thanks guys really trying to get my head around this.

Franks response:
Laydown Conversion will work great by itself. You run the aluminum +3mm hubs, the diff is +3.5mm, and you run the HRC front setup. Just follow a setup sheet from tlracing.com (Frank Root).

Dirt Tranny has the diff at the same height as the standard tranny case, and works with the standard plastic hubs. Both are +/- 0mm from stock. When you run this, no need to run the HRC front mod either.

I've found the stock laydown conversion parts to work great for most tracks. The dirt tranny is a great tuning option, but definitely not 'required'.

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Something I made, pretty basic. Just to give people an idea.

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Old 11-22-2016, 04:21 PM   #3811
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I'm using a spektrum 6240 servo and I'm going to install it on the back of the aluminum servo mounts. Is there anything different I have to do other than just bolting it on the back of the mounts? What about shimming the Servo?
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Old 11-22-2016, 04:52 PM   #3812
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Is anyone running the TLR aluminum steering setup? If so, did you find the bell cranks needed some extra shimming to eliminate vertical slop?
I just finished building my 22 3.0 and have the aluminum steering. I did notice some vertical movement on the steering posts. As you turn the wheels the bell crank slides up on the post. At first I questioned this but my steering movement is so smooth and free I decided not to mess with it. It slides up on both sides, depending on which direction you turn the wheel. I was afraid if I used shims it may bind up my steering so I left it alone. Haven't had any issues thus far.
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Old 11-22-2016, 05:38 PM   #3813
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I'm using a spektrum 6240 servo and I'm going to install it on the back of the aluminum servo mounts. Is there anything different I have to do other than just bolting it on the back of the mounts? What about shimming the Servo?
The ball end goes through the front of the servo horn. You also have to dremel out the servo horn. For me, it wasn't worth doing. I thought I was going to do this when I did the laydown conversion, but I didn't want to modify the bulkhead.
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Old 11-22-2016, 05:50 PM   #3814
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I need to go home and measure the cups but the +4mm is the inside of the cup not the area that the spring rests on.This keeps the spring from popping out of the cup.

I will have to go check this when I get home, but I'm pretty sure I'm right.

I'm often wrong though...
The part of the cup inside the spring is the same between normal and +4 mm cups. The +4 mm is below the spring, it's 4 mm more ride height. (These are really useful on the 22sct 2.0 to get the right ride height in front on dirt.) Pull those off and put the stock ones back on.

I'm a fan of the Kyosho gold springs. Yokomo are cheaper, you can look up similar spring rates.

On the front, put both spacers on top of the spindle. This will raise roll center in front, giving less roll, as well as lowering front ride height by 1 mm.

With the stock transmission, I liked running long VLA. I have only tried short since converting to laydown though, so the jury is still out on that one.

If the fast guys are 1.5 seconds ahead though, you're not going to make that up without going laydown.
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Old 11-22-2016, 06:13 PM   #3815
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I just finished building my 22 3.0 and have the aluminum steering. I did notice some vertical movement on the steering posts. As you turn the wheels the bell crank slides up on the post. At first I questioned this but my steering movement is so smooth and free I decided not to mess with it. It slides up on both sides, depending on which direction you turn the wheel. I was afraid if I used shims it may bind up my steering so I left it alone. Haven't had any issues thus far.
I just happened to have some of those shims on hand so I decided to conduct a little experiment. I added a second shim on top of each bell crank but still had some movement. A third shim prevented the bell cranks from moving at all while still allowing nice free movement lock to lock.

It seems to me that the front end is a lot tighter overall (movement of the front wheels without any movement of the servo horn) and I have yet to have any problems with it.

I didn't consider the possibility that the movement was there by design though.
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Old 11-22-2016, 06:19 PM   #3816
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OK thanks everyone. I am a complete moron, sometimes I wonder of my brain functions at all.
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Old 11-22-2016, 07:30 PM   #3817
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Originally Posted by StadiumRC View Post
I just finished building my 22 3.0 and have the aluminum steering. I did notice some vertical movement on the steering posts. As you turn the wheels the bell crank slides up on the post. At first I questioned this but my steering movement is so smooth and free I decided not to mess with it. It slides up on both sides, depending on which direction you turn the wheel. I was afraid if I used shims it may bind up my steering so I left it alone. Haven't had any issues thus far.
You need to flip the ball stud on the servo arm.
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Old 11-23-2016, 05:00 AM   #3818
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Has anyone with an exotek laydown tried the X-Factory rear tower conversion, to see if it fits?
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Old 11-23-2016, 09:17 AM   #3819
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It is not a direct fit, you have to grind the carbon fiber shock tower so it will fit around the trans case, then use longer screws to hold the tower to the wing mounts. I ran this setup all day Saturday and it worked well.
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Old 11-23-2016, 09:54 AM   #3820
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It is not a direct fit, you have to grind the carbon fiber shock tower so it will fit around the trans case, then use longer screws to hold the tower to the wing mounts. I ran this setup all day Saturday and it worked well.
Cool. How easy is it to dremel carbon fiber?
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Old 11-23-2016, 11:01 AM   #3821
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You need to flip the ball stud on the servo arm.
I think you mean if he mounts the servo behind the servo mounts instead of in front. He's talking about the vertical movement of the alloy bell cranks along their shaft when steering torque is applied.
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Old 11-23-2016, 11:11 AM   #3822
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Very easy, just use a round sanding or grinding bit and it will grind through quickly.
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Old 11-23-2016, 12:03 PM   #3823
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I think you mean if he mounts the servo behind the servo mounts instead of in front. He's talking about the vertical movement of the alloy bell cranks along their shaft when steering torque is applied.
Yes, you are correct. My servo is mounted as per the manual and so is everything else. My servo link is parallel to the rack and everything moves smoothly throughout its travel range.
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Old 11-24-2016, 09:27 AM   #3824
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I know you guys will be partial to the 3.0 but I've been thinking about this buggy.
I currently own a b6d with the laydown and I have driven a 3.0 very little.
For those of you that have driven both where do you rate the 3.0 against the b6? I wouldn't put the laydown in it right off (I would have to save some money it's kind of pricey)
Just looking for some experienced advice.
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Old 11-25-2016, 12:02 AM   #3825
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I have run both cars. I will say that both cars with a good set up are virtually identical. It all comes down to set up. Sounds to me like your B6 is not giving you something that you want so you are considering a change. And you should get a 3.0 simply because you might get your new car to work better just because you have a better set up. And yes sometimes we luck into a perfect set up.
Ever hear the story of how bar style tires ever came into existence.
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