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Old 08-23-2016, 10:37 AM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: Official TLR 22 3.0 Race Kit Thread!
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Cub86 posted the question: Hi. I'm struggling to understand the lay down situation. I run on high bite damp smooth clay and think the conversation would help on my surface but from what I'm reading I need to buy the lay down kit tlr338004. And the dirt gear case tlr332063. But do I really need both from what I've read the dirt case is 1-2mm higher anyway and u don't use the +3mm hubs or the front pivot hrc or Hrc mod. So is the dirt lay down kit tlr332063 is all that's needed to get me a lay down set up that's suited for clay With the components and car I already have. And if I only get the dirt case is there any problems that will need to be addressed IE.. bone plunge . I do know I'll need 1mm spacers on the waterfall to clear the battery. Thanks guys really trying to get my head around this.

Franks response:
Laydown Conversion will work great by itself. You run the aluminum +3mm hubs, the diff is +3.5mm, and you run the HRC front setup. Just follow a setup sheet from tlracing.com (Frank Root).

Dirt Tranny has the diff at the same height as the standard tranny case, and works with the standard plastic hubs. Both are +/- 0mm from stock. When you run this, no need to run the HRC front mod either.

I've found the stock laydown conversion parts to work great for most tracks. The dirt tranny is a great tuning option, but definitely not 'required'.

K.King
Something I made, pretty basic. Just to give people an idea.

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Old 03-18-2016, 12:42 PM   #2401
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Default shorty batteries

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The best IR numbers out there are coming from the new protek packs, the turnigy ultimates, and the trinity packs.
Take a look at SMC, they are very affordable, great support and the new Extreme is an awesome stock class battery. Great IR, I'd put it up there with some of the best. IMO!

http://www.smc-racing.net/index.php?...product_id=338
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Old 03-18-2016, 03:52 PM   #2402
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Losi gear diff is fully rebuild-able. I am not sure what you mean by your comment?
Yes, just rebuilt two of them today. But if you chew up the outer gear (sorry I don't know the term), it's integrated with the housing. Not a big deal. I have rebuilt two of these several times... the Serpent just looks a little sturdier, like I have less chance of stripping out the screws. The seals also look better. Nothing against the Losi diff... it's half the price! I'm going to try one of the Serpent ones though because I need a third gear diff and I'll just give it a go.
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Old 03-18-2016, 04:57 PM   #2403
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I should add that I've never chewed up the outer gear on a Losi gear diff. So I haven't had a problem with them, just willing to try a Serpent at twice the price.

Oh! I do have a beef with the thin little washers that go on the outdrive over the inside bushings... they are so thin they wear a groove into them. I've been flipping the washers over every time I rebuild, but I don't know if that's better or worse.
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Old 03-18-2016, 11:23 PM   #2404
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Old 03-18-2016, 11:38 PM   #2405
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Wow... Very nice
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Old 03-19-2016, 12:22 AM   #2406
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Wow... Very nice
Thanks m8
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Old 03-19-2016, 07:38 AM   #2407
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Tip for you Lyons, remove the rear battery strap stop and use a foam pad instead. Most are running the battery a few mm's back of the rear most position you'll be able to achieve with the stop in place and removal will allow you to go even further back, all the way to the waterfall.
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Old 03-19-2016, 09:39 AM   #2408
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Tip for you Lyons, remove the rear battery strap stop and use a foam pad instead. Most are running the battery a few mm's back of the rear most position you'll be able to achieve with the stop in place and removal will allow you to go even further back, all the way to the waterfall.
Thanks I'll try that. I haven't run this yet and I'll also be running on carpet as well.
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Old 03-19-2016, 07:06 PM   #2409
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Thanks I'll try that. I haven't run this yet and I'll also be running on carpet as well.
On carpet, you'll probably want to go all the way forward with the battery. I made that change today and it worked well. I also added the HRC front and rear this week... that let me run my ride height a little closer to normal (I think I was at 22 mm front and rear) instead of slammed. When I was dropped way down, I had no forgiveness on landings that were less than perfect. With the height raised, I had that forgiveness back and the HRC was effective in reducing roll.
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Old 03-20-2016, 11:54 PM   #2410
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OK, I have read all the discussion on ball diff VS gear diffs and just bought a gear diff to try and see if there's any difference. I have always ran a ball diff. We run on a high bite clay track. Now, what weight fluid are most of you running? I was thinking 5000 to 7000 or should I go 10,000. Any suggestions would be much appreciated.
Thanks
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Old 03-21-2016, 05:49 AM   #2411
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Rob, if it were me, I'd try 1K in the rear diff for Thronhill Jr, maybe even just a light coat of Green Grease which is what I run in the Spec Slash class.

On a side note, I've been running the MIP lightened ball diff for a while now, maybe 6 race days... and it's always had a slight "notchy" feel to it, but this past race day on Sat night, the diff finally loosened up and became super smooth. Can anyone explain what happened? Was I supposed to "break in" the diff some special way and it finally took 6 race days to break in? Is this going to be one of those things that I'll have a short window of super smooth diff action before I need to replace the diff balls or something? How often are folks rebuilding their ball diffs and what are the signs to look for when it's time to rebuild the diff?
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Old 03-21-2016, 10:02 AM   #2412
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A ball diff should be perfectly smooth when new. If yours felt a little notchy when you built it, that's an indication that the rings weren't perfectly smooth and it improved as the balls wore tracks into them (break-in).

The break-in method I employ is put one wheel on the table and apply a small amount of throttle for 5 or so seconds, then do the same on the other side. If you have slip, it is possible that the lube is contaminated. Anything other than the clear silicone, no matter how little, will cause slip.

This car's diff design isn't really "adjustable". The best adjustment is as shown in the manual, tighten the diff screw until the spring just bottoms out, then back out 1/8 turn. On the pre-3.0 diff, I would always change the spring out to AE's, because it is much stronger and resists slip a little better when set properly.
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Old 03-21-2016, 10:26 AM   #2413
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Thanks for the tips David, yes I did a 50% throttle break in for a few seconds on each side and that didn't do any good, your explanation of the balls working into the rings makes sense. It wasn't as rough as a gear diff, but I could definitely feel a little abrasiveness (gritty feeling) when turning one wheel by hand.

On my first run, I had built the diff a little too loose and the diff was acting like a slipper, I slowly tightened until I got just enough traction to lift the front wheels when holding down the rear. I'm also using a slipper eliminator for the stock class. Either case, I'm thrilled to have a super smooth diff now
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Old 03-21-2016, 11:34 AM   #2414
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Originally Posted by HollywoodRC View Post
OK, I have read all the discussion on ball diff VS gear diffs and just bought a gear diff to try and see if there's any difference. I have always ran a ball diff. We run on a high bite clay track. Now, what weight fluid are most of you running? I was thinking 5000 to 7000 or should I go 10,000. Any suggestions would be much appreciated.
Thanks
5k is a good starting point. I run 7k on a super high grip carpet. Would probably go down to 3k in low grip conditions
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Old 03-21-2016, 12:28 PM   #2415
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My mip pucks diff did the same thing when I built mine. It smoothed out though and I have been running, this is at least my second indoor season with it without a rebuild.
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