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Old 08-23-2016, 10:37 AM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: Official TLR 22 3.0 Race Kit Thread!
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Cub86 posted the question: Hi. I'm struggling to understand the lay down situation. I run on high bite damp smooth clay and think the conversation would help on my surface but from what I'm reading I need to buy the lay down kit tlr338004. And the dirt gear case tlr332063. But do I really need both from what I've read the dirt case is 1-2mm higher anyway and u don't use the +3mm hubs or the front pivot hrc or Hrc mod. So is the dirt lay down kit tlr332063 is all that's needed to get me a lay down set up that's suited for clay With the components and car I already have. And if I only get the dirt case is there any problems that will need to be addressed IE.. bone plunge . I do know I'll need 1mm spacers on the waterfall to clear the battery. Thanks guys really trying to get my head around this.

Franks response:
Laydown Conversion will work great by itself. You run the aluminum +3mm hubs, the diff is +3.5mm, and you run the HRC front setup. Just follow a setup sheet from tlracing.com (Frank Root).

Dirt Tranny has the diff at the same height as the standard tranny case, and works with the standard plastic hubs. Both are +/- 0mm from stock. When you run this, no need to run the HRC front mod either.

I've found the stock laydown conversion parts to work great for most tracks. The dirt tranny is a great tuning option, but definitely not 'required'.

K.King
Something I made, pretty basic. Just to give people an idea.

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Old 02-15-2016, 05:46 PM   #2041
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For those of you running a slipper eliminator, how does that affect the set up of the ball diff? I'm fairly new at this and of the mindset that the slipper should let go at some point before the diff begins to bark. With no forgiveness at the spur, how do you keep the diff from barking?

Also, for a very high traction scenario (i.e. soft pins on carpet), is it more worthwhile to switch to gear diff?

You NEVER want the ball diff to slip, and with stock you should have no problem keeping it tight enough to not slip.

The Serpent ball diff is MONEY! remove 2 gears and run 10-15 oil in it.

The LOSI dif also works well with 2 gears removed and 4k but i have yet to find an O ring to stop it from leaking.
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Old 02-15-2016, 06:02 PM   #2042
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My 22 is giving me no joy. Kit set up besides the 4 gear transmission to try and get some more grip. Car is very unsettled off jumps and tends to bounce around a lot, and finds every rut on the track, struggles between on power oversteer and off power understeer, I think I've placed dead last every time I've run it

Outdoor clay track low-medium grip, running rebar rears and vektor fronts. Fastest lap is 2-3 seconds down on the fast guys, Tekin RS Spec esc and 17.5 motor.
Nexxus, not sure if you still need help but I noticed you where running vektor fronts. I found these to be very aggressive sometimes and they may be leading to your on power oversteer. Try some ribs to smooth out the front end and make the car more stable for you.
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Old 02-15-2016, 06:05 PM   #2043
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Default Serpent gear diff

Just following up Marcus with the Serpent gear diff. Both SER500485 and SER500192 will fit the car. I have run the car without shims, but strongly recommend shimming. As seen from the pictures the difference in width is 1.3mm, so you will need a set of 10x12x0.2mm or 10x14x0.2mm shims.
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Old 02-15-2016, 08:02 PM   #2044
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Default 2.2 vs 2.4 Tire & Wheels

Got my 22 3.0 down to stock weight. But was playing with tires and wheels and wanted to show the weight difference between the 2.2 and 2.4/

TLR Wheels & Dirt Webs on 2.2 = 1512gms


TLR Wheels & Electrons on 2.4 = 1486gms
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Old 02-16-2016, 07:24 AM   #2045
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Just following up Marcus with the Serpent gear diff. Both SER500485 and SER500192 will fit the car. I have run the car without shims, but strongly recommend shimming. As seen from the pictures the difference in width is 1.3mm, so you will need a set of 10x12x0.2mm or 10x14x0.2mm shims.
Do you have any specific brand/part number for the shims?
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Old 02-16-2016, 07:31 AM   #2046
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Originally Posted by cokemaster View Post
Just following up Marcus with the Serpent gear diff. Both SER500485 and SER500192 will fit the car. I have run the car without shims, but strongly recommend shimming. As seen from the pictures the difference in width is 1.3mm, so you will need a set of 10x12x0.2mm or 10x14x0.2mm shims.
Great info!

Is there one diff preferred over the other? I'm at work now so can't look in-depth at both. At a glance, it looks like on is slightly more expensive and has different gears.

For those that are using this diff, what is the general starting point? 2-gears and 7K I think I saw mentioned earlier. Is that about right?
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Old 02-16-2016, 08:29 AM   #2047
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Great info!

Is there one diff preferred over the other? I'm at work now so can't look in-depth at both. At a glance, it looks like on is slightly more expensive and has different gears.

For those that are using this diff, what is the general starting point? 2-gears and 7K I think I saw mentioned earlier. Is that about right?

the 2wd version uses plastic main gear the 4wd version uses aluminum. that is the only difference.I went with the srx4 (aluminum version) because it for sure has the updated o'rings which do not leak, the older SRX2 difs leaked really bad. I am sure they updated both but if for some reason you end up with an older stock SRX2 diff, it will leak. the new O rings are clear. i started with 2 gears and 12k and it is perfect on high bite /slicks track. Sven had 10k in his the other night and felt that it was a bit too low. i was told to start with 15k but only had 12 on hand.
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Old 02-16-2016, 08:49 AM   #2048
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Do you have any specific brand/part number for the shims?
Not really. Just search for 10x12 shims at your favorite hobby shop. I would get the 0.2mm thought.
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Old 02-16-2016, 09:40 AM   #2049
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the 2wd version uses plastic main gear the 4wd version uses aluminum. that is the only difference.I went with the srx4 (aluminum version) because it for sure has the updated o'rings which do not leak, the older SRX2 difs leaked really bad. I am sure they updated both but if for some reason you end up with an older stock SRX2 diff, it will leak. the new O rings are clear. i started with 2 gears and 12k and it is perfect on high bite /slicks track. Sven had 10k in his the other night and felt that it was a bit too low. i was told to start with 15k but only had 12 on hand.
Good to know. Really appreciate the info!

One more follow up:

Are there any other considerations to be made other than some shimming as mentioned above? Other than that is it a direct drop-in? The Serpent outdrives are compatible?
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Old 02-16-2016, 10:33 AM   #2050
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Do you have any specific brand/part number for the shims?
I always use Kyosho shims....

KYO96647 Kyosho 10x12mm Shim Set (0.1mm/0.2mm) (8) (ZX-5)
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Old 02-16-2016, 10:38 AM   #2051
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Looks good!

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Frank,
Does TLR have any plans to make smaller spur gears for the stock racers?
We have the 70T available now. The 76 is the smallest we can make to work with HDS pads. Something else might be in the works
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Old 02-16-2016, 10:44 AM   #2052
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Good to know. Really appreciate the info!

One more follow up:

Are there any other considerations to be made other than some shimming as mentioned above? Other than that is it a direct drop-in? The Serpent outdrives are compatible?
Direct drop in just be prepared to go faster!
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Old 02-16-2016, 12:55 PM   #2053
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Frank - Can we get the Rumble setup from you or Dustin? I think small track racers would appreciate it!
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Old 02-16-2016, 01:30 PM   #2054
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Frank - Can we get the Rumble setup from you or Dustin? I think small track racers would appreciate it!
Only if your small track has crazy/abrassive traction

Same as Dustin's Reedy Setup, up 2.5wt front oil and one spring stiffer.
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Old 02-16-2016, 03:20 PM   #2055
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Only if your small track has crazy/abrassive traction

Same as Dustin's Reedy Setup, up 2.5wt front oil and one spring stiffer.
Haha it was'nt abrasive till Sunday, you were a beast too
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