Dragonfueled

Does that much rear toe take away allot of steering?

Matthew_Armeni

iTrader: (31)

I didn't feel that I lost any steering when we made the change, in fact, I had to go from 3.5 to 4 degrees of rear toe because it was a little looser on corner exit from the lower antisquat setting. And if it had taken steering away it would have mostly been corner entry, again from the lower antisquat setting, which could be dialed back in with other setup changes.

LiL CeeZ

iTrader: (23)

I would suggest upgrading to a different servo that has a known track record of taking the abuse from heavy high powered vehicles like these sct's. All I ran for 1/8th scale truggy or seen anyone else use is either a 7955 hitech or KO Propo RSX power. These servos stand up to abuse and the test of time.

ResultsRC

iTrader: (1)

It was built stock as the manual suggested,how much diff is this than what u suggest here?what other effect does does this setup you suggest do better? I have alot of hair pins and s turns in this track that are slow speed,I like alot of steering. With the front screws in as steering stops even with no washers,its turning a little less than i really like,But it was washing out and waggin like a dogs tail with no steerin stops,the inside wheel was moving around to much,I may grind down the top of the screw and try and get the wheel turning a bit further,right before the point the servo loses leverage on the inside wheel. Im sure this wouldnt be the setup for a faster track. I had so much dremel work done to my scte,it was turning tighter than the tekno is now.Im still faster with the tekno,it just transitions smoother and quicker through rough spots in the track and the weight seems to roll it through the tighter corners much smoother,Im out to lunch trying to follow up race my xray 4wheel buggy. it feels so glitchy in the turns now im not sure ill be able to race them in back to back heats

FAO

Yes, it does. My last race was on medium bite, drying astro turf with very big jumps and i tested less anti-squat and more toe-in in the rear. With 4 deg. toe-in i had problems to get the car around the corners because of heavy understeer (even in big radius while accelerating). Reduced it to 2 deg still gave enough grip in the back and on the straigt without that heavy understeer.

ResultsRC

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't like that setup then. Deff not a tight clay course tune

Dragonfueled

What tires are you guys using on clay? I was running proline primes in super soft but was kinda drifting my local indoor clay track. Everyone else seemed to also be on slicks but they had allot more traction. One guy was using Panthers. Are the clay compounds better then super soft?

rcgod

iTrader: (33)

You should ask them what compound they are running. Yes the compound makes a big difference. Most of the time SS doesn't work on clay tracks as well as clay compound.

Matthew_Armeni

iTrader: (31)

I understand why you would want to run no washers but unless your track only has jumps that launch straight and land straight and the only turns are tight 180's your truck will be faster and more consistent with more washers. Even if that's your track there are other ways to obtain steering. Believe me, it took awhile for us to convince all the drivers on the team (including a pro or two) to add more washers. No one likes the idea of limiting steering. But the results of doing this have been proven over and over. My advice for everyone is to run the truck with 4 washers and then tune in more steering other ways. Just to be sure, check to make sure your servo saver is tight. Also, the plastic ackermann plate can flex a little and not deliver maximum holding ability at full lock, but this is usually only noticed into a tight turn at high speed but it could be a contributing factor. Another thing is to make sure you have zero bumpsteer (or a little bump out if you want more steering into a turn).
As far as the anitsquat, the manual starts with 3 degrees, which is simply too much. At the time it seemed good, but as we constantly tune and become more familiar with the truck/buggy we find better setups. Keep the C block pill where it is (should be center dot down) and change the D block to double dot up and out. This will give you 1 degree of antisquat and 3.5 degrees of toe.
If your truck is setup according to the manual I can give you a better overall starting setup if you want or if you're pretty comfortable with your truck now we can suggest one change at a time. The biggest thing is knowing where you need more or less steering; e.g. into a turn, out of a turn, on power, off power, etc.

Dragonfueled

I run the box setup but already run the antisquat like you suggest with less rear toe to try and get it to rotate going into a turn. I do not have the steering stops but will tonight.
I have to waite when I dive into a turn off throttle it pushes. I can nail the throttle and get it to rotate but only after it slows down obviously. So how do I get it to turn more when coasting into a turn rite after landing a jump. Diffs are 575
Running proline primes on a clay track with big jumps that go rite into corners after the landing

Matthew_Armeni

iTrader: (31)

First, if you have other springs to choose from, I would run (depending on how heavy your truck is) Pink/Pink or Black/Black F/R and move the front shocks in on the arms front and rear and all the way out on the tower front and rear. The green springs are too stiff I feel and probably felt good because of amount of antisquat. If you don't have other springs still move the shocks and set your ride height pretty much as low as low as you can, 22mm is the lowest I've had success with. Change your front kickup to 8 degrees by running the A block single dot down and the B block single dot up. While this will stop weight transfer into a corner (potentially taking away steering) it gives a very direct feel to the steering and makes the front tires "bite" a little better into the turns. You'll have to readjust your bumpsteer after this change. For the front camber link we've pretty much gone to always running the A position on the hub and either the 4 or 5 position on the tower depending on the amount of entry steering we need. The short link makes the truck land jumps really well. Run the 4 spot for a very controllable car on entry and if you need more steering into the turn run the 5. If you run the 5 spot you might want to run slightly less static camber and if you run the 4 you might want to run a little more due to the difference in their camber gains. We always start with about 1-2 degrees in the front, more camber usually gives more steering.
In the rear I usually run the 6/C position but if I need a little more corner entry steering or more on power rear traction I go to 6/B. Wheelbase is an easy change to make that can have an effect on on and off power traction as well. Longer wheelbase is usually more stable into a turn and when landing jumps but can be a little looser on power because there's less dogbone angle. Shorter is basically the opposite. I play with this pretty often because it's an easy change. Toe will change your wheelbase as well so it can have similar effects.
Ackermann will change your steering (obviously ), forward is usually smoother and will not steer as much off power and off center and will steer more on power. Rearward, more off power and off center and more pushy on power. I'm usually in the middle.
Droop can change the car a lot but honestly I never change mine. Limiting droop basically limits weight transfer on and off power and through turns. I run max droop (I don't even have the screws in my arms) and never play with it. Not the best advice I know but I drive my cars better with full droop. I have tested it a lot over the years and that's my personal preference.
Lastly (at least for this post, it's now a lot longer than I had planned) is swaybars. Basically the thinner the swaybar the more traction that end of the car has into and through a turn. So if you need more steering go thinner in the front or thicker on the back. If the front pushes through the turn go thinner in the front. If the car initiates the turn well but the rear sticks really well and can't rotate try thicker in the rear.

Finally, everyone drives a little differently. If something I've said here doesn't work for you (not Dragonfueled specifically, but anyone reading this) that's fine. Just remember what the change did to your car. And try to remember it in terms of on power, off power, into and out of turns so the next time you need to make a change to your car you'll know which way to go. Also, don't be afraid to make changes! It takes no time at all to swap out a pill, change a camber link, move a shock, change ride height, etc. The worst thing that happens is you don't like the way the car feels and you have to go back to where it was.

Dan.J

iTrader: (21)

^^^^Good info there, thanks.

Dragonfueled

Awesome I'm gonna dissect that post and re read it 100 times to take it all in. Really appreciate it. Knowledge is gold!!!!!

jjl1

iTrader: (2)

Matthew
Above you recommended 0 bump steer or bump out. Would you explain how to adjust bump steer/out?

rcgod

iTrader: (33)

Adding washers under the inner or outer ball stud will increase bump out.