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R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: New Schumacher KF2
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Welcome to the KF2 Wiki!

Please feel free to add any Tips, Tricks, or anything that would be beneficial to the KF2 Family

Introduction and Pictures Introduction and Pictures

ElectronicsSetupElectronicsSetups

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EmulsionShocksEmulsion Shocks

Tony Newland Gear Diff BuildTony Newland Gear Diff Build

Suggested Gearing

6.5
7.5
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17.5 I ran 69/31 at SRS Scottsdale Arizona and 72/30 at MHOR Aurora Co and Full Throttle ALB, NM RCM lockout worked excellent!


MIP pucks excellent upgrade! The new RCM lockout is an excellent piece as well! These options will greatly reduce weight throughout the drive line!

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Old 08-28-2015, 11:43 PM   #571
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Has anyone gone to 4 deg rear toe? Just tried it tonight using 3deg toe blocks and 1deg aluminum hubs. Our track is fairly loose right now since the layout is less than a week old. 4 deg rear toe seemed to give the car much more forward bite and also took away some steering so it didnt want to get loose in the corners.
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Old 08-30-2015, 07:26 PM   #572
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Has anyone gone to 4 deg rear toe? Just tried it tonight using 3deg toe blocks and 1deg aluminum hubs.
I have been running 4 degrees rear toe but with the optional pivot blocks, not the 1 degree alloy hubs. Here is a link to the pivot blocks: U4719

My car has plenty of forward bite but I am not sure to what extent the 4 degrees of toe is responsible for that. After I installed the MM kit I went from 3 degrees to 4 but I also reversed the rear arms at the same time. Maybe I'll try the rear arms in their regular position again to see how much of a difference that makes.

Were you already running rear arms flipped before adding the extra degree of toe?
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Old 08-30-2015, 09:06 PM   #573
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For those that may be interested I would like to share my experience with the car at the West Side Nationals race that took place yesterday. I really wanted this to be a test bed for the new MM conversion as the track is a dusty hard pack outdoor track but unfortunately the weather did not cooperate. It rained ALL day!

The good news is that they have a smaller indoor medium-grip clay track at the same facility so the race was moved indoors. It wasn't the difficult test I was hoping to put the car through but it was still a really good test nonetheless. Everyone there was running a web-style tire like a JC Dirt Web or Pro-line Electrons. I ran the latter sauced with Liquid Wrench.

Before I share the results from the day I just want to quickly mention that I had the pleasure of pitting with Phil from DiscountRCStore.com and the rest of his off-road team. He is as great of a guy in person as he is on-line and he and his team were all really friendly and helpful the entire day. They squeezed me into an already cramped space and managed to endure a barrage of bad jokes and tech/setup discussions. Thanks again.

My expectations were low going into this race. They got a little better once I realized we would be on the indoor track. The turnout was not quite as high as it might have been because of the weather. The field was mostly composed of local club racers who had been racing for awhile on the current layout. Add to all of this that it was my first time running this car in competition and you can understand why my expectations were not that high.

I entered the car in Stock, which ended up with 24 total entries. I also ran the car in mod with the same exact motor for extra track time and to try setup changes (which quite a few other guys did as well). My starting setup was identical to what I posted last and is currently up on Petitrc. By the end of the day the only change I made was to go to the middle hole on the front shock tower for a bit more entry steering. I ran a Trinity 17.5 D4 short stack (60 degrees timing) with a 71/31 spur/pinion = 5.91 FDR. I was the only person there running Schumacher in 2wd (both classes)

The car was EXCELLENT. All kinds of rear bite both front and side. I could drive the car really hard all around the track and the only time it ever really got loose was when I got outside the groove and into the dusty areas. I had no problem clearing jumps and the car was really fast out of the hole and very stable down the straight. In retrospect the only thing I might have tried differently would be going to the green Core RC springs all around. The car was rolling a little too much through some tight chicanes where I think I was losing the most time.

I ended up qualifying 13th in the field of 24 putting myself right in the middle of the B main. I had a handful of laps in my qualifiers that were within about .5 seconds of the fastest laps on the track in my class. I only missed the A-main by a few seconds. I was also really consistent in qualifying minus a few mistakes and dealing with lap traffic. Unfortunately, I saved my worst for last and the main was my poorest run of the day There was a huge pile up at the tone and my car got pulled out of it last. And then I made a silly mistake right after that. I was never able to recover and ended up finishing 7th.

Despite the poor performance in the main I was VERY pleased with the car. Phil's team was very curious about it and I let one of his team members drive it. This guy was there with a B5M. After a few laps he was smiling and after a few more he was turning faster laps with it than his own car. He asked for a few more before I had to take the transmitter back from him. By the end of the day he was on eBay and this site looking for a deal on a second hand KF2 (true story). He told me he felt the car was more forgiving and easier to drive than his B5M. He also commented on how it felt more stable in the rear than his car and how it had plenty of grip.

I'm not going to claim that this car is "the best" car you can run on low-med grip indoor clay. All I will say is that you can definitely compete with the KF2 and MM conversion against anything out there. I could not say that about the car before the MM conversion. I am really looking forward to honing it in at my home track where I have yet to run it in a race. I have no doubt that it will never be the limiting factor in my lap times, it's all up to me at this point. And that is all I really ever wanted from it in the first place. I just wish I could have gotten there a little more economically So if you have the car already and run on lower grip surfaces by all means get the MM conversion. If you don't have the car yet then maybe try to find one used and add the MM conversion or perhaps wait for Schumacher to release a kit based on the MM conversion (I am assuming this will be done but have no knowledge of their actual plans)

I still want to test the car out on the looser outdoor track before the end of the season. While there I learned they have club races on it on Friday nights so hopefully I can get out there soon. I'll share my results here of course.
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Old 08-30-2015, 11:24 PM   #574
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorcitymatt View Post
For those that may be interested I would like to share my experience with the car at the West Side Nationals race that took place yesterday. I really wanted this to be a test bed for the new MM conversion as the track is a dusty hard pack outdoor track but unfortunately the weather did not cooperate. It rained ALL day!

The good news is that they have a smaller indoor medium-grip clay track at the same facility so the race was moved indoors. It wasn't the difficult test I was hoping to put the car through but it was still a really good test nonetheless. Everyone there was running a web-style tire like a JC Dirt Web or Pro-line Electrons. I ran the latter sauced with Liquid Wrench.

Before I share the results from the day I just want to quickly mention that I had the pleasure of pitting with Phil from DiscountRCStore.com and the rest of his off-road team. He is as great of a guy in person as he is on-line and he and his team were all really friendly and helpful the entire day. They squeezed me into an already cramped space and managed to endure a barrage of bad jokes and tech/setup discussions. Thanks again.

My expectations were low going into this race. They got a little better once I realized we would be on the indoor track. The turnout was not quite as high as it might have been because of the weather. The field was mostly composed of local club racers who had been racing for awhile on the current layout. Add to all of this that it was my first time running this car in competition and you can understand why my expectations were not that high.

I entered the car in Stock, which ended up with 24 total entries. I also ran the car in mod with the same exact motor for extra track time and to try setup changes (which quite a few other guys did as well). My starting setup was identical to what I posted last and is currently up on Petitrc. By the end of the day the only change I made was to go to the middle hole on the front shock tower for a bit more entry steering. I ran a Trinity 17.5 D4 short stack (60 degrees timing) with a 71/31 spur/pinion = 5.91 FDR. I was the only person there running Schumacher in 2wd (both classes)

The car was EXCELLENT. All kinds of rear bite both front and side. I could drive the car really hard all around the track and the only time it ever really got loose was when I got outside the groove and into the dusty areas. I had no problem clearing jumps and the car was really fast out of the hole and very stable down the straight. In retrospect the only thing I might have tried differently would be going to the green Core RC springs all around. The car was rolling a little too much through some tight chicanes where I think I was losing the most time.

I ended up qualifying 13th in the field of 24 putting myself right in the middle of the B main. I had a handful of laps in my qualifiers that were within about .5 seconds of the fastest laps on the track in my class. I only missed the A-main by a few seconds. I was also really consistent in qualifying minus a few mistakes and dealing with lap traffic. Unfortunately, I saved my worst for last and the main was my poorest run of the day There was a huge pile up at the tone and my car got pulled out of it last. And then I made a silly mistake right after that. I was never able to recover and ended up finishing 7th.

Despite the poor performance in the main I was VERY pleased with the car. Phil's team was very curious about it and I let one of his team members drive it. This guy was there with a B5M. After a few laps he was smiling and after a few more he was turning faster laps with it than his own car. He asked for a few more before I had to take the transmitter back from him. By the end of the day he was on eBay and this site looking for a deal on a second hand KF2 (true story). He told me he felt the car was more forgiving and easier to drive than his B5M. He also commented on how it felt more stable in the rear than his car and how it had plenty of grip.

I'm not going to claim that this car is "the best" car you can run on low-med grip indoor clay. All I will say is that you can definitely compete with the KF2 and MM conversion against anything out there. I could not say that about the car before the MM conversion. I am really looking forward to honing it in at my home track where I have yet to run it in a race. I have no doubt that it will never be the limiting factor in my lap times, it's all up to me at this point. And that is all I really ever wanted from it in the first place. I just wish I could have gotten there a little more economically So if you have the car already and run on lower grip surfaces by all means get the MM conversion. If you don't have the car yet then maybe try to find one used and add the MM conversion or perhaps wait for Schumacher to release a kit based on the MM conversion (I am assuming this will be done but have no knowledge of their actual plans)

I still want to test the car out on the looser outdoor track before the end of the season. While there I learned they have club races on it on Friday nights so hopefully I can get out there soon. I'll share my results here of course.
Thanks Matt.
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Old 08-31-2015, 05:50 AM   #575
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorcitymatt View Post
For those that may be interested I would like to share my experience with the car at the West Side Nationals race that took place yesterday. I really wanted this to be a test bed for the new MM conversion as the track is a dusty hard pack outdoor track but unfortunately the weather did not cooperate. It rained ALL day!

The good news is that they have a smaller indoor medium-grip clay track at the same facility so the race was moved indoors. It wasn't the difficult test I was hoping to put the car through but it was still a really good test nonetheless. Everyone there was running a web-style tire like a JC Dirt Web or Pro-line Electrons. I ran the latter sauced with Liquid Wrench.

Before I share the results from the day I just want to quickly mention that I had the pleasure of pitting with Phil from DiscountRCStore.com and the rest of his off-road team. He is as great of a guy in person as he is on-line and he and his team were all really friendly and helpful the entire day. They squeezed me into an already cramped space and managed to endure a barrage of bad jokes and tech/setup discussions. Thanks again.

My expectations were low going into this race. They got a little better once I realized we would be on the indoor track. The turnout was not quite as high as it might have been because of the weather. The field was mostly composed of local club racers who had been racing for awhile on the current layout. Add to all of this that it was my first time running this car in competition and you can understand why my expectations were not that high.

I entered the car in Stock, which ended up with 24 total entries. I also ran the car in mod with the same exact motor for extra track time and to try setup changes (which quite a few other guys did as well). My starting setup was identical to what I posted last and is currently up on Petitrc. By the end of the day the only change I made was to go to the middle hole on the front shock tower for a bit more entry steering. I ran a Trinity 17.5 D4 short stack (60 degrees timing) with a 71/31 spur/pinion = 5.91 FDR. I was the only person there running Schumacher in 2wd (both classes)

The car was EXCELLENT. All kinds of rear bite both front and side. I could drive the car really hard all around the track and the only time it ever really got loose was when I got outside the groove and into the dusty areas. I had no problem clearing jumps and the car was really fast out of the hole and very stable down the straight. In retrospect the only thing I might have tried differently would be going to the green Core RC springs all around. The car was rolling a little too much through some tight chicanes where I think I was losing the most time.

I ended up qualifying 13th in the field of 24 putting myself right in the middle of the B main. I had a handful of laps in my qualifiers that were within about .5 seconds of the fastest laps on the track in my class. I only missed the A-main by a few seconds. I was also really consistent in qualifying minus a few mistakes and dealing with lap traffic. Unfortunately, I saved my worst for last and the main was my poorest run of the day There was a huge pile up at the tone and my car got pulled out of it last. And then I made a silly mistake right after that. I was never able to recover and ended up finishing 7th.

Despite the poor performance in the main I was VERY pleased with the car. Phil's team was very curious about it and I let one of his team members drive it. This guy was there with a B5M. After a few laps he was smiling and after a few more he was turning faster laps with it than his own car. He asked for a few more before I had to take the transmitter back from him. By the end of the day he was on eBay and this site looking for a deal on a second hand KF2 (true story). He told me he felt the car was more forgiving and easier to drive than his B5M. He also commented on how it felt more stable in the rear than his car and how it had plenty of grip.

I'm not going to claim that this car is "the best" car you can run on low-med grip indoor clay. All I will say is that you can definitely compete with the KF2 and MM conversion against anything out there. I could not say that about the car before the MM conversion. I am really looking forward to honing it in at my home track where I have yet to run it in a race. I have no doubt that it will never be the limiting factor in my lap times, it's all up to me at this point. And that is all I really ever wanted from it in the first place. I just wish I could have gotten there a little more economically So if you have the car already and run on lower grip surfaces by all means get the MM conversion. If you don't have the car yet then maybe try to find one used and add the MM conversion or perhaps wait for Schumacher to release a kit based on the MM conversion (I am assuming this will be done but have no knowledge of their actual plans)

I still want to test the car out on the looser outdoor track before the end of the season. While there I learned they have club races on it on Friday nights so hopefully I can get out there soon. I'll share my results here of course.
Had a great time Matt .. Thanks for making it out .. Your car was dialed all day long ..!



..p
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Old 09-02-2015, 11:28 PM   #576
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Someone is selling lockouts on ebay...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-RC-Madne...-/191675460509
I tested the lockout for the first time today. I was skeptical at first since its 3D printed and the plastic looks brittle, but it held up well with no signs of stress.

There was a noticeable difference between using the lockout, versus using the full slipper with cage and versus two pads with the AE spring. I could never get much success using only two pads. No matter how tight I got the screw, there was noticeable slipping. Even using the full slipper assembly and fully tightened, the slipper was still slipping on the straightaway. Maybe the pads need some cleaning???

Does anyone use another brand of slipper pads?
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Old 09-03-2015, 06:37 AM   #577
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They probably need a scuff of scotchbrite.
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Old 09-03-2015, 07:52 AM   #578
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Originally Posted by Jpdanger View Post
I tested the lockout for the first time today. I was skeptical at first since its 3D printed and the plastic looks brittle, but it held up well with no signs of stress.

There was a noticeable difference between using the lockout, versus using the full slipper with cage and versus two pads with the AE spring. I could never get much success using only two pads. No matter how tight I got the screw, there was noticeable slipping. Even using the full slipper assembly and fully tightened, the slipper was still slipping on the straightaway. Maybe the pads need some cleaning???

Does anyone use another brand of slipper pads?
Try RC Shox slipper pads! Excellent product, many of the the racer's at my track use them. Phil can get them! Some new slipper pads from McKune Design MDR10012 $10.00 pr. FR4 High Bite Vented Slipper Pads.

Last edited by MelKF2; 09-04-2015 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 09-03-2015, 09:40 PM   #579
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Last night at my club race someone commented on how my slipper sounded a bit loose going on around the track and it turns out they were right. Not sure why I didn't hear it and the car seemed to have plenty of pop anyway.

I put a 1/4" nylon spacer on the layshaft first and then put the stock spring and collar back on. This allowed me to cinch the spring down enough to keep it from slipping. Just to make sure I put some small index marks on the spur and retaining plate. The marks have not budged since.

And now the car pulls wheelies with a 17.5! Before the MM kit this just was not possible for me on the surfaces I run on.

Interesting side note: Last night for the main, just to mix it up a bit, I threw in a gear diff with 6k in it and two of the spider gears removed. I had my fastest lap of the night by 8 tenths with it and almost won with a wire-to-wire lead but blew it at the end to finish 4th. But my top five average was a couple tenths slower compared to the ball diff. I am going to experiment more with it.
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Old 09-04-2015, 07:15 AM   #580
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Clean the pads with some scotchbrite.... it's maintenance. More often on high grip....
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Old 09-04-2015, 08:00 AM   #581
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Why remove the two spider gears?
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Old 09-04-2015, 10:23 AM   #582
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Originally Posted by UNSTABLE View Post
Hello all.
I have started making my own bodies for my cars, as I am not a fan of the cab forward craze that seems to be the current default for manufacturers.
Although Schumacher are not too bad in this regard, I have started with what I run.

So, I thought I'd post them up and see if there would be any demand for them.
This is my new Cougar KF2 body, based on the look of the Cougar 2 but fits KF and KF2 models. You do need to drill the shock tower to fit a body mount. works with rear mounted shock tower also. Suits low grip and front mounted motor, I will modify for the MM soon or if I get a request.





Let me know if you like it.
It looks nice, little old school but i like that, I am a fan of cab foward but i like an aggressive looking body. I just put the K1 body on my Aero.
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Old 09-04-2015, 07:57 PM   #583
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It looks nice, little old school but i like that, I am a fan of cab foward but i like an aggressive looking body. I just put the K1 body on my Aero.
I don't know how I missed the original post, but I love that body. I want!
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Old 09-05-2015, 12:22 AM   #584
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Wish we could get those body shells in the UK. Really love the old school design,reminds me of the Topcat and original Cougar.
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Old 09-06-2015, 11:56 AM   #585
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Newland View Post
That means your suspension is binding throughout the day....

check hinge pins for binding/bent... clean pin bores with pipe cleaners... use dry teflon wd40 on all pivots to ensure free movement.

It could also indicate bent shocks, shafts, swollen orings, blown bladders, rebound decreasing....

so many possibilities, those are all reasons why the top shelf racers maintain their rigs meticulously... almost medically clean all time. Consistency
I checked and cleaned everything and nothing is bent or binding in the arms, links, and pins. The shocks have been cleaned and rings replaced. The shafts don't appear to be bent. I've even tried the shocks with sealed, emulsion, and also vented caps, but I still have the "settling" issue. I build the shocks with zero rebound using AE oil.

I'm starting to think that it could be the springs. If I rotate the springs around the shock without turning the collar or the perch, the RH can change by as much as 1.5mm. I'm using Core RC springs. Essentially, disturbing the shock at all has an effect on the RH.

Frustrated...
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